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> But let me return to Thiel’s list of possible apocalypses: artificial intelligence, climate change, bioweapons, nuclear war, fertility collapse. The list is u

by ajuc 1y ago

> But let me return to Thiel’s list of possible apocalypses: artificial intelligence, climate change, bioweapons, nuclear war, fertility collapse. The list is unintentionally revealing. Thiel is probably not wrong to say that people are pretty worried about the climate crisis. But the examples of AI, bioweapons and fertility collapse in particular suggest that Thiel has confused the world’s worries for those of a very recherché set of aging tech entrepreneurs he hobnobs with. And the antichrist, too, seems very Silicon Valley-coded. This suggests, I think, that in Thiel’s mind there are two cosmic forces warring over creation itself, and they both consist of Peter and his friends. If all the problems are caused by unregulated technology, the solution is obvious, isn't it? Sadly, the whole culture around SV is based on libertarianism, so regulation isn't even considered.

jamiequint 1y ago
Wrong. The problems come from regulation itself. From bureaucracies that freeze innovation, protect incumbents, and smother experimentation under compliance costs, etc.
- ggm 1y ago
  ... in his opinion.
- WarOnPrivacy 1y ago
  > The problems come from regulation itself. The problems also come from improperly regulated businesses, operating in the 3rd stage of encrapification where they stifle innovation that threaten their *opoly and the choke-hold they have on their captured regulators. Every ideology and system is fundamentally flawed. Worse, zealots (of said I/S) compulsively refuse to recognize that their own house needs cleaning. And they not only don't clean, they'll savagely attack anyone who attempts to do the needed cleaning (improve the ideology by addressing it's flaws). No One Anywhere Will Clean Their Own House is an absolute human constant, right between death and taxes.
- Hansappreciator 1y ago
  Regulation is the result of politics, and politics is the result (in democracies) of the inputs of every person in society. Dismissing regulation, or in Thiel's formulation, conflating regulators with the antichrist is therefore anti-democratic and anti-people. The anti-regulation side of SV, which comes from the libertarian / Randian utopia, is one of its least appealing and most ignorant aspects.
  - mac-attack 1y ago
    Libertarianism is selfishness inoculated from the human condition
  - Animats 1y ago
    Regulation is usually the result of some industry way overdoing bad stuff.
- ajuc 1y ago
  There's always regulation. The choice is between self-serving regulation by a few lucky assholes or regulation by society for the society. If you let the tobacco industry self-regulate, smoking ads would still be legal, and there would be no ban on selling cigarettes to kids. This is the situation in IT.
  - sigwinch 1y ago
    And certainly, upstarts and social challenges to incumbent tobacconists would be met with regulations.
resters 1y ago
> Sadly, the whole culture around SV is based on libertarianism, so regulation isn't even considered. Thiel actively supported one of the least libertarian candidates in US history. Whatever reputation he has for having libertarian views is nonsense. No libertarian would try to control others based on his/her religious beliefs, and no libertarian would be remotely comfortable with any of the heavy handed stuff in Trump's platform. In my view, what happened to Thiel and Musk is that they succeed in business and everyone starts respecting them and treating them like deities. They want to believe it is justified rather than simply people trying to manipulate them, which leads to a reinvention of self where they perceive themself to be a bit superhuman or important to the world. They act, they explore new areas, they act more. They usually do not experience as much reward from additional success in business, they are typically poorly socialized and fail to create a solid support network of people who know them and care about them. They realize money doesn't really help, fine food doesn't help, expensive possessions doesn't help. Even positions where they occupy a top hierarchical role end up feeling lacking. What's left is the allure of tradition, religion, blood, war, progeny, and the trajectory of civilizations. They admire the brutality and decisiveness of medieval kings and the idea of theirs being destiny rather than luck. They then try to figure out how to believe they are deserving and suitable for the unique kind of destiny they realize can be theirs. Most of us do not have to worry about hearing the voices they hear calling them to this destiny. One can see it on Elon's face. He's quick to sweat, quick to contemplate how his every decision will be more significant to the world than the entire lives of thousands. Day after day of waiters, concierges, personal assistants, aides, advisors, trainers, masseuses, chefs, SVPs, etc. all at their absolute service. They must ask themselves again and again endlessly "what do I want? What do I really want?" Ultimately they realize that all they really want is to shape the world like so many kings or prime ministers or philosophers have. But theirs is a different skill-set. In spite of their desire they are not philosophers, not kings, not literati, not demagogues. So they struggle to become that which they are not so they can do more than order a delicious lunch and pay for everyone else's and listen to everyone's flattery. They want to shape the world with who they are, but part of them realizes it was luck and the are not as unique as they hoped. So they find ways to feel special like cultural supremacy, authoritarianism, buying favor with politicians or religious leaders, etc.
- 1y ago
Animats 1y ago
> artificial intelligence, climate change, bioweapons, nuclear war, fertility collapse. The list is unintentionally revealing. Those are big concerns for the next 20-30 years. At any one time, they rarely hit the headlines. But their effects accumulate. We may be in the runup to WWIII in Europe. Read up on the runup to WWII, the "phony war". The Chancellor of Germany said recently "We are not at war, but we are not at peace either".

by ajuc 1y ago

jamiequint 1y ago

Wrong. The problems come from regulation itself. From bureaucracies that freeze innovation, protect incumbents, and smother experimentation under compliance costs, etc.

ggm 1y ago
... in his opinion.
WarOnPrivacy 1y ago
> The problems come from regulation itself. The problems also come from improperly regulated businesses, operating in the 3rd stage of encrapification where they stifle innovation that threaten their *opoly and the choke-hold they have on their captured regulators. Every ideology and system is fundamentally flawed. Worse, zealots (of said I/S) compulsively refuse to recognize that their own house needs cleaning. And they not only don't clean, they'll savagely attack anyone who attempts to do the needed cleaning (improve the ideology by addressing it's flaws). No One Anywhere Will Clean Their Own House is an absolute human constant, right between death and taxes.
Hansappreciator 1y ago
Regulation is the result of politics, and politics is the result (in democracies) of the inputs of every person in society. Dismissing regulation, or in Thiel's formulation, conflating regulators with the antichrist is therefore anti-democratic and anti-people. The anti-regulation side of SV, which comes from the libertarian / Randian utopia, is one of its least appealing and most ignorant aspects.
- mac-attack 1y ago
  Libertarianism is selfishness inoculated from the human condition
- Animats 1y ago
  Regulation is usually the result of some industry way overdoing bad stuff.
ajuc 1y ago
There's always regulation. The choice is between self-serving regulation by a few lucky assholes or regulation by society for the society. If you let the tobacco industry self-regulate, smoking ads would still be legal, and there would be no ban on selling cigarettes to kids. This is the situation in IT.
- sigwinch 1y ago
  And certainly, upstarts and social challenges to incumbent tobacconists would be met with regulations.

resters 1y ago

> Sadly, the whole culture around SV is based on libertarianism, so regulation isn't even considered. Thiel actively supported one of the least libertarian candidates in US history. Whatever reputation he has for having libertarian views is nonsense. No libertarian would try to control others based on his/her religious beliefs, and no libertarian would be remotely comfortable with any of the heavy handed stuff in Trump's platform. In my view, what happened to Thiel and Musk is that they succeed in business and everyone starts respecting them and treating them like deities. They want to believe it is justified rather than simply people trying to manipulate them, which leads to a reinvention of self where they perceive themself to be a bit superhuman or important to the world. They act, they explore new areas, they act more. They usually do not experience as much reward from additional success in business, they are typically poorly socialized and fail to create a solid support network of people who know them and care about them. They realize money doesn't really help, fine food doesn't help, expensive possessions doesn't help. Even positions where they occupy a top hierarchical role end up feeling lacking. What's left is the allure of tradition, religion, blood, war, progeny, and the trajectory of civilizations. They admire the brutality and decisiveness of medieval kings and the idea of theirs being destiny rather than luck. They then try to figure out how to believe they are deserving and suitable for the unique kind of destiny they realize can be theirs. Most of us do not have to worry about hearing the voices they hear calling them to this destiny. One can see it on Elon's face. He's quick to sweat, quick to contemplate how his every decision will be more significant to the world than the entire lives of thousands. Day after day of waiters, concierges, personal assistants, aides, advisors, trainers, masseuses, chefs, SVPs, etc. all at their absolute service. They must ask themselves again and again endlessly "what do I want? What do I really want?" Ultimately they realize that all they really want is to shape the world like so many kings or prime ministers or philosophers have. But theirs is a different skill-set. In spite of their desire they are not philosophers, not kings, not literati, not demagogues. So they struggle to become that which they are not so they can do more than order a delicious lunch and pay for everyone else's and listen to everyone's flattery. They want to shape the world with who they are, but part of them realizes it was luck and the are not as unique as they hoped. So they find ways to feel special like cultural supremacy, authoritarianism, buying favor with politicians or religious leaders, etc.

1y ago

Animats 1y ago

> artificial intelligence, climate change, bioweapons, nuclear war, fertility collapse. The list is unintentionally revealing. Those are big concerns for the next 20-30 years. At any one time, they rarely hit the headlines. But their effects accumulate. We may be in the runup to WWIII in Europe. Read up on the runup to WWII, the "phony war". The Chancellor of Germany said recently "We are not at war, but we are not at peace either".