3 ms·

Pedestrians are hit by cars in the USA because the roads are not designed for non-car users. This is exacerbated by distracted driving, drunk driving, and recen

by bradfa 1y ago

Pedestrians are hit by cars in the USA because the roads are not designed for non-car users. This is exacerbated by distracted driving, drunk driving, and recent car design changes like higher hood heights but the root of it is poorly designed roads which don’t consider pedestrians’ needs.

quantumwannabe 1y ago
Someone didn't read the article.
- potato3732842 1y ago
  >Someone didn't read the article. Someone doesn't understand that any article that's drawing conclusions based on a workflow that involves putting a Chevy Suburban (functionally a chevy pickup from the B pillar forward) and a Honda HRV into the same category is sus at best and anyone uncritically accepting said conclusions is also sus at best. If one wanted to be honest they'd look at GVW or some other metric that tracks size far more closely than a fairly arbitrary categorization that is highly gamed for regulatory reasons. We're all just so sick of these shallow analysis. Shitting numbers and graphs onto them doesn't make them not shallow. Like what even is the point of a raw "deaths by state" map?[1]? [1] https://xkcd.com/1138/ https://xkcd.com/1138/
  - willis936 1y ago
    Suburbans are on truck chassis and are SUVs. HRVs are on car chassis and are crossovers. The bucket is called "trucks and SUVs" to make this less ambiguous.
    - potato3732842 1y ago
      >Suburbans are on truck chassis and are SUVs. HRVs are on car chassis and are crossovers. The bucket is called "trucks and SUVs" to make this less ambiguous. TFA does not use data broken down in that way. TFA cites "sales by body type" which puts a 'Burb (functionally a pickup for this discussion) into the same category as a 2002 Forester (which is an SUV on paper, but obviously a car).
    - ToucanLoucan 1y ago
      As an adamant enthusiast of both cars and infrastructure design, if someone puts a crossover in the trucks and SUVs category, I am dubious of anything that follows. Crossovers are basically just cars with higher rollover risk. They're lighter, they have smaller engines, they can stop more quickly, and overall have much, much better safety characteristics. Like I'm sorry but if you put crossovers and SUVs in the same bucket for a discussion anywhere, but especially in the realm of safety, I'm not taking your opinions seriously.
  - alterom 1y ago
    >Like what even is the point of a raw "deaths by state" map? It does give slightly more insight than the map of US state population per capita[1]. [1] https://facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=710896291698831&id=100083353988428 https://facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=710896291698831&id...
- alterom 1y ago
  The article that fails to consider that the sedans have changed in shape and size over the past 20 years? The article that has all the cool plots, and no relevant information like the actual vehicles being discussed? The article that doesn't even bother putting a 2000 Camry side-by-side with a 2025 Camry to make it blatantly obvious that it's not just SUVs? That article?
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
gdulli 1y ago
It's more the trend in cars than the roads because the roads didn't change starting in 2009.
- willis936 1y ago
  And drivers. Readers should ask themselves when they first got a smartphone and if it was around 2009.
  - ceejayoz 1y ago
    You should ask yourself whether smartphones are a US-only phenomenon. From the article: > Other countries haven’t seen this increase in pedestrian deaths: in every other high-income country, rates are flat or declining. Whatever’s causing the problem seems to be limited to the US.
    - ajuc 1y ago
      It reminds me of Americans blaming school shootings on video games as if nobody else in the world had them :)
    - willis936 1y ago
      Smartphones + US culture is limited to the US.
      - ceejayoz 1y ago
        That's a deeply silly assertion. Culture is one of our major and most successful exports. Afghan tribesmen have seen The Simpsons. Osama Bin Laden played Half-Life and showed his kids Pixar films. https://www.history.com/articles/bin-laden-compound-abbottabad-belongings https://www.history.com/articles/bin-laden-compound-abbottab...
        willis936 1y ago
        And the US isn't under Sharia Law. Saying that The Simpsons in syndication is the reason why two cultures behaves the same is the sillier of the two statements.
willis936 1y ago
As compared to the European roads that are half the width of US roads?
- denismenace 1y ago
  Yes, european roads are not as wide, since they make place for proper sidewalks and bike lanes. Another advantage is that narrower roads make drivers drive more carefully and slowly, reducing accidents even further.
  - tdeck 1y ago
    In Japan many neighborhood roads (even in cities) are narrow and have no sidewalk to speak of. But I feel safe walking down them because drivers expect to go slow and look out for pedestrians and cyclists. If you want to blow through an area fast, there are other roads for that with lighted crossings and sidewalks, and often slower mixed-use parallel roads for pulling in and out of businesses.
  - ajuc 1y ago
    On small village roads with little traffic you don't even need pavements (not to mention bike paths) as long as the road is narrow and winding with good visibility. Cars drive slowly and rarely, it's perfectly fine to walk there.
  - IanCal 1y ago
    I wish people would stop assuming that an area with 500M people, more than 20 countries and far more cultures are one addressable block. Some places are, others are absolutely awful. > Another advantage is that narrower roads make drivers drive more carefully and slowly, In some places, in others people go absolutely hell for leather because the roads are pretty fun. This varies city to city.
    - ceejayoz 1y ago
      I've no doubt it varies, but they're all doing something differently that seems to work versus the US. > Other countries haven’t seen this increase in pedestrian deaths: in every other high-income country, rates are flat or declining. Whatever’s causing the problem seems to be limited to the US.
twelvechairs 1y ago
A huge part of poorly designed roads is wider lanes (and parking spaces) that allow/encourage huge cars. Its been proven that narrower lanes correlate strongly with lower crash and fatality rates (e.g. [0] below) yet lane widths are under pressure to increase with larger vehicles, and every time this happens the vehicles get larger again. [0] https://publichealth.jhu.edu/2023/narrower-lanes-safer-streets https://publichealth.jhu.edu/2023/narrower-lanes-safer-stree...
- CalRobert 1y ago
  Higher speeds, too.
- FridayoLeary 1y ago
  I heard the fire department wants wide lanes so they can drive around in those huge behemoths they love.
  - ajuc 1y ago
    Surely that's not THE determining factor behind American transportation system. Because if it is - seems easy and cheap to fix.
  - 542354234235 1y ago
    It is part of it. Notjustbikes did a video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2dHFC31VtQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2dHFC31VtQ
  - IAmBroom 1y ago
    People living in buildings that are currently aflame tend to be fans of those behemoths. Speaking from experience.
    - FridayoLeary 1y ago
      In Europe they're smaller. I don't know if the fires are also smaller.
  - 1y ago

by bradfa 1y ago

quantumwannabe 1y ago

Someone didn't read the article.

potato3732842 1y ago
>Someone didn't read the article. Someone doesn't understand that any article that's drawing conclusions based on a workflow that involves putting a Chevy Suburban (functionally a chevy pickup from the B pillar forward) and a Honda HRV into the same category is sus at best and anyone uncritically accepting said conclusions is also sus at best. If one wanted to be honest they'd look at GVW or some other metric that tracks size far more closely than a fairly arbitrary categorization that is highly gamed for regulatory reasons. We're all just so sick of these shallow analysis. Shitting numbers and graphs onto them doesn't make them not shallow. Like what even is the point of a raw "deaths by state" map?[1]? [1] https://xkcd.com/1138/ https://xkcd.com/1138/
- willis936 1y ago
  Suburbans are on truck chassis and are SUVs. HRVs are on car chassis and are crossovers. The bucket is called "trucks and SUVs" to make this less ambiguous.
  - potato3732842 1y ago
    >Suburbans are on truck chassis and are SUVs. HRVs are on car chassis and are crossovers. The bucket is called "trucks and SUVs" to make this less ambiguous. TFA does not use data broken down in that way. TFA cites "sales by body type" which puts a 'Burb (functionally a pickup for this discussion) into the same category as a 2002 Forester (which is an SUV on paper, but obviously a car).
  - ToucanLoucan 1y ago
    As an adamant enthusiast of both cars and infrastructure design, if someone puts a crossover in the trucks and SUVs category, I am dubious of anything that follows. Crossovers are basically just cars with higher rollover risk. They're lighter, they have smaller engines, they can stop more quickly, and overall have much, much better safety characteristics. Like I'm sorry but if you put crossovers and SUVs in the same bucket for a discussion anywhere, but especially in the realm of safety, I'm not taking your opinions seriously.
- alterom 1y ago
  >Like what even is the point of a raw "deaths by state" map? It does give slightly more insight than the map of US state population per capita[1]. [1] https://facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=710896291698831&id=100083353988428 https://facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=710896291698831&id...
alterom 1y ago
The article that fails to consider that the sedans have changed in shape and size over the past 20 years? The article that has all the cool plots, and no relevant information like the actual vehicles being discussed? The article that doesn't even bother putting a 2000 Camry side-by-side with a 2025 Camry to make it blatantly obvious that it's not just SUVs? That article?

deleted 1y ago

[deleted]

gdulli 1y ago

It's more the trend in cars than the roads because the roads didn't change starting in 2009.

willis936 1y ago
And drivers. Readers should ask themselves when they first got a smartphone and if it was around 2009.
- ceejayoz 1y ago
  You should ask yourself whether smartphones are a US-only phenomenon. From the article: > Other countries haven’t seen this increase in pedestrian deaths: in every other high-income country, rates are flat or declining. Whatever’s causing the problem seems to be limited to the US.
  - ajuc 1y ago
    It reminds me of Americans blaming school shootings on video games as if nobody else in the world had them :)
  - willis936 1y ago
    Smartphones + US culture is limited to the US.
    - ceejayoz 1y ago
      That's a deeply silly assertion. Culture is one of our major and most successful exports. Afghan tribesmen have seen The Simpsons. Osama Bin Laden played Half-Life and showed his kids Pixar films. https://www.history.com/articles/bin-laden-compound-abbottabad-belongings https://www.history.com/articles/bin-laden-compound-abbottab...
      - willis936 1y ago
        And the US isn't under Sharia Law. Saying that The Simpsons in syndication is the reason why two cultures behaves the same is the sillier of the two statements.

willis936 1y ago

As compared to the European roads that are half the width of US roads?

denismenace 1y ago
Yes, european roads are not as wide, since they make place for proper sidewalks and bike lanes. Another advantage is that narrower roads make drivers drive more carefully and slowly, reducing accidents even further.
- tdeck 1y ago
  In Japan many neighborhood roads (even in cities) are narrow and have no sidewalk to speak of. But I feel safe walking down them because drivers expect to go slow and look out for pedestrians and cyclists. If you want to blow through an area fast, there are other roads for that with lighted crossings and sidewalks, and often slower mixed-use parallel roads for pulling in and out of businesses.
- ajuc 1y ago
  On small village roads with little traffic you don't even need pavements (not to mention bike paths) as long as the road is narrow and winding with good visibility. Cars drive slowly and rarely, it's perfectly fine to walk there.
- IanCal 1y ago
  I wish people would stop assuming that an area with 500M people, more than 20 countries and far more cultures are one addressable block. Some places are, others are absolutely awful. > Another advantage is that narrower roads make drivers drive more carefully and slowly, In some places, in others people go absolutely hell for leather because the roads are pretty fun. This varies city to city.
  - ceejayoz 1y ago
    I've no doubt it varies, but they're all doing something differently that seems to work versus the US. > Other countries haven’t seen this increase in pedestrian deaths: in every other high-income country, rates are flat or declining. Whatever’s causing the problem seems to be limited to the US.

twelvechairs 1y ago

A huge part of poorly designed roads is wider lanes (and parking spaces) that allow/encourage huge cars. Its been proven that narrower lanes correlate strongly with lower crash and fatality rates (e.g. [0] below) yet lane widths are under pressure to increase with larger vehicles, and every time this happens the vehicles get larger again. [0] https://publichealth.jhu.edu/2023/narrower-lanes-safer-streets https://publichealth.jhu.edu/2023/narrower-lanes-safer-stree...

CalRobert 1y ago
Higher speeds, too.
FridayoLeary 1y ago
I heard the fire department wants wide lanes so they can drive around in those huge behemoths they love.
- ajuc 1y ago
  Surely that's not THE determining factor behind American transportation system. Because if it is - seems easy and cheap to fix.
- 542354234235 1y ago
  It is part of it. Notjustbikes did a video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2dHFC31VtQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2dHFC31VtQ
- IAmBroom 1y ago
  People living in buildings that are currently aflame tend to be fans of those behemoths. Speaking from experience.
  - FridayoLeary 1y ago
    In Europe they're smaller. I don't know if the fires are also smaller.
- 1y ago