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Wonder how this jives with Gruber's comments on the maps situation: >Using Maps to Improve Maps >> Scott Rafer: >>What’s missing from this conversation is th
by cooldeal 14y ago
Wonder how this jives with Gruber's comments on the maps situation:
>Using Maps to Improve Maps
>> Scott Rafer:
>>What’s missing from this conversation is that map usage is critical. […] Google’s maps are going to start degrading. Apple’s will get better. They’ll meet in the middle within 18 months.
>The idea is that you need to collect usage data to improve your data. The only way for Apple to get from here to there is to release what they have now and improve the data as millions of people start using it.
http://daringfireball.net/linked/2012/09/19/rafer-maps http://daringfireball.net/linked/2012/09/19/rafer-maps
If Google Maps is approved, far less people would be using Apple Maps.
- capo 14y agoWhy would GMaps degrade in quality? Apple's might improve but Google's are on Android devices, and they have another key data source in StreetView.
- baddox 14y agoAs map data changes over time (road construction, POI movement, etc.), Google Maps could fall out of date. Of course, I doubt that's a major threat, since Google will presumably still be the primary maps platform on Android and the desktop web.
- ktsmith 14y agoHow is Google's data going to fall out of date? There are millions of activated android devices providing them data.
- lftl 14y agoI think Gruber was postulating that Apple would continue updating the app to take advantage of iOS in deeper ways while Google wouldn't put the same level of effort into the iOS version of the app, making it stagnate. So more of degrading of the iOS experience than anything related to map data.
- brown9-2 14y agoHe wrote "Google’s maps are going to start degrading", not that their app would degrade. He seems to imply that with less iOS users, they'd get less corrections - which ignores the large userbase of Google Maps on other platforms (Android, web).
- qq66 14y agoThe ability to take passive GPS readings and integrate with other parts of iOS is pretty powerful. Imagine if you had a reminder to "Buy new guitar strings" -- your phone could beep and say "You're just around the corner from a musical instrument store -- would you like to get those strings?" Of course, Apple could also decide whether or not to charge the instrument store for this lead generation.
- danielweber 14y agoAnd Google's self-driving cars. It's not going to generate much data in the next few years, but the two products each add a lot of value to the other. It's easy to believe that Apple's maps will improve, but thinking that Google's will stagnate? Bah.
- zarify 14y agoWell, given Google's past history with iOS apps, they might just release a shit app. Your data is only as good as your interface to it.
- revelation 14y agoMaps don't magically improve through usage. Fix a POI here and there from user input is not going to cut it for competing with Google Maps. For that, you need LIDARs on the road.
- ryanhuff 14y agoHow does LIDAR fix POI?
- jlgreco 14y agoLIDAR itself? It doesn't really. A fleet of cars with, in addition to LIDAR, cameras that provide you with source material for as much OCRing as you have server-farms to afford? That helps.
- ZeroGravitas 14y agoIt gives you building shapes and locations.
- FireBeyond 14y agoI thought Gruber was getting more balanced. I guessed wrong. Maps don't improve by themselves. They improve by complaints, feedback, input. They also don't degrade by themselves. Unless Gruber et al are under some amazing assumption that Google now has no investment in Maps, is not getting street data, topographical data, traffic data any more. Though, mind you, this assumption isn't far fetched. Much as some of these pundits live their life in the Apple ecosystem, they seem to be blissfully (or willfully) ignorant of the fact that "mobile Maps" is but one segment of Google Maps. Millions of people rely on it, daily, on their desktops.
- ajross 14y agoTo be fair: maps do "degrade by themselves", simply because the world changes and they must be updated to prevent being wrong in the future. Obviously that's no more or less true of any data source, so Gruber still isn't making any sense...
- juiceandjuice 14y agoThis is such a stupid assumption. Apple's maps will never reach Google's. Why? Because Google's business model is so heavily dependent on highly accurate maps at so many levels. There's been posts on HN regarding Google's usage of Streetview/OCR to improve their map directions, and it's absolutely critical that their maps be the absolute highest quality in terms of content and accuracy of that content for their driverless cars. Google has and will continue to invest massively in maps, and no user feedback will ever approach that investment.
- 0xABADC0DA 14y agoApple's maps will never reach Google's. There is one way Apple's maps already surpass Google's: no advertising. For instance the iOS 5 Youtube app never showed ads, whereas the new app store one shows tons of them. Sometimes 1/4th of the screen is advertisement. I'm sure it will be the same way for maps. Looking up a bus route, looking for used cars for cheap? Oh you are walking someplace, wouldn't you like a bicycle? There's five StarBucks® on your route! No thanks. If I need the better features in Google Maps then I'll use it, but I'll go with the ad-free version if it works well enough.
- rieter 14y agoApple's Youtube app also made a large portion of content unavailable because of lack of advertisement support.
- fpgeek 14y agoThe advertising isn't intrusive in the Android version of Maps. It's also worth noting that, like search advertisements, Maps advertisements have the potential to be useful. If I'm looking for a restaurant near some location, restaurants that care enough to advertise in Maps for that location could easily be worth considering.
- ryanhuff 14y agoTrue, because Google is trying to use Google Maps as a hook into Google+ Local. For maps, it all comes back to local search.
- olalonde 14y ago>What’s missing from this conversation is that map usage is critical. […] Google’s maps are going to start degrading. By that logic, Apple Maps would never reach Google Maps anyways as there are way more people using Android phones and/or web-based Google Maps then there are iPhone users. Regardless, the article "How Google Builds Its Maps"[0], which was recently submitted on HN, seems to indicate that Google improves the bulk of its map data through Google employees rather then through user feedback (although I suspect it's a mix of both). [0] http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2012/09/how-google-builds-its-maps-and-what-it-means-for-the-future-of-everything/261913/ http://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2012/09/how-go...
- DominikR 14y agoI'm pretty sure they'll get all the signals needed with hundreds of millions of Android and web users.