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Yeah, this whole "let's sell off state-owned infrastructure on the Free Market" hasn't worked out so well: not only in the UK, but also elsewhere in Europe, the

Yeah, this whole "let's sell off state-owned infrastructure on the Free Market" hasn't worked out so well: not only in the UK, but also elsewhere in Europe, the handsome profits of those moves have pretty much evaporated, investments in upgrades have been severely lacking, and now everyone is pointing fingers due to the inevitable capacity meltdowns. (Note that I'm not opposed to privatization in general, and it has worked out very well in other sectors, noticeably Telecoms, but I'm not aware of it bringing long-term happiness anywhere when it comes to Energy)

Ekaros 1y ago
I'm all for free market with some subsidiaries for backup generation for electricity generation. But transfer should be only publicly owned companies. Be it national for national grid and regional owned by suitable entity say municipality or group of them. Same goes for water and sewer. Maybe garbage could be mixed model. In big enough towns having multiple competing companies for removal is not unreasonable competition. Same could be said for part of bus networks.
- bardak 1y ago
  > Same could be said for part of bus networks The only part of municipal/ regional bus network that is suitable for privatisation in a high labour cost country is contracting out operations. Ticketing, route planning andscheduling all should be under a central governmental authority. There is a reason that, outside of London, England has some of the worst bus services in the developed world
philipallstar 1y ago
> the inevitable capacity meltdowns Capacity is constantly being hit by very large population growth. Just like water and housing. Money available is lowered by state-enforced price caps. Purchase prices are raised by state-mandated net zero rules that subsidise green sources.
- adolph 1y ago
  > Capacity is constantly being hit by very large population growth. What population growth? https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/uk-population/ https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/uk-population...
  - mytailorisrich 1y ago
    The UK has experienced the 2 largest annual growth on record in the last 5 years, with +755k mid-23 to mid-2024 alone [1]. Even your link shows about 11% growth since 2010 and higher growth rates since ~2004. So we can argue about what "very large" means, but population growth is significant. [1] https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/populationandmigration/populationestimates/bulletins/annualmidyearpopulationestimates/mid2024 https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/populati...
    - onraglanroad 1y ago
      > about 11% growth since 2010 So much less than 1% a year. > we can argue about what "very large" means Yeah, you can argue that less than 1% a year is "very large". I'm not sure anyone else will be convinced.
      - mytailorisrich 1y ago
        The UK does have record population growth, the rest is semantics as mentioned. That certainly does not help with all the infrastructure issues the country has. That's it. Please refrain from flamebaits and political assumptions, and let's have a substantive discussion instead.
        onraglanroad 1y ago
        No, it's not semantic it's numeric. It's less than 1%. And I didn't make any political assumptions. Didn't even mention them. Might want to tighten the cord there, looks like a mask is slipping.
fridder 1y ago
For things where there is not a natural path for competition, state owned, or how it is done in the US state of Nebraska a separate political subdivision, makes more sense. You are not going to have multiple power lines and connections coming into your home to enable natural competition

Ekaros 1y ago

I'm all for free market with some subsidiaries for backup generation for electricity generation. But transfer should be only publicly owned companies. Be it national for national grid and regional owned by suitable entity say municipality or group of them. Same goes for water and sewer. Maybe garbage could be mixed model. In big enough towns having multiple competing companies for removal is not unreasonable competition. Same could be said for part of bus networks.

bardak 1y ago
> Same could be said for part of bus networks The only part of municipal/ regional bus network that is suitable for privatisation in a high labour cost country is contracting out operations. Ticketing, route planning andscheduling all should be under a central governmental authority. There is a reason that, outside of London, England has some of the worst bus services in the developed world

philipallstar 1y ago

> the inevitable capacity meltdowns Capacity is constantly being hit by very large population growth. Just like water and housing. Money available is lowered by state-enforced price caps. Purchase prices are raised by state-mandated net zero rules that subsidise green sources.

adolph 1y ago
> Capacity is constantly being hit by very large population growth. What population growth? https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/uk-population/ https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/uk-population...
- mytailorisrich 1y ago
  The UK has experienced the 2 largest annual growth on record in the last 5 years, with +755k mid-23 to mid-2024 alone [1]. Even your link shows about 11% growth since 2010 and higher growth rates since ~2004. So we can argue about what "very large" means, but population growth is significant. [1] https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/populationandmigration/populationestimates/bulletins/annualmidyearpopulationestimates/mid2024 https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/populati...
  - onraglanroad 1y ago
    > about 11% growth since 2010 So much less than 1% a year. > we can argue about what "very large" means Yeah, you can argue that less than 1% a year is "very large". I'm not sure anyone else will be convinced.
    - mytailorisrich 1y ago
      The UK does have record population growth, the rest is semantics as mentioned. That certainly does not help with all the infrastructure issues the country has. That's it. Please refrain from flamebaits and political assumptions, and let's have a substantive discussion instead.
      - onraglanroad 1y ago
        No, it's not semantic it's numeric. It's less than 1%. And I didn't make any political assumptions. Didn't even mention them. Might want to tighten the cord there, looks like a mask is slipping.

fridder 1y ago

For things where there is not a natural path for competition, state owned, or how it is done in the US state of Nebraska a separate political subdivision, makes more sense. You are not going to have multiple power lines and connections coming into your home to enable natural competition