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'democracy' is used 4 times. Arguments like this: >But as I said, this isn’t about crime. It’s about paranoid conspiracy theories and an attempt to dismantle d

by bko 1y ago

'democracy' is used 4 times. Arguments like this: >But as I said, this isn’t about crime. It’s about paranoid conspiracy theories and an attempt to dismantle democracy. Most people don't think of 'normal law enforcement', they just see crime, people in the country illegally and others trying to make law enforcements job harder. They don't care about these types of arguments about how this is different from "normal" law enforcement. You can care about these arguments , and a small percentage of people do, but if you want to be persuasive to the overwhelming majority, you have to put it in concrete terms how more police and law enforcement is actually bad.

BLKNSLVR 1y ago
So, you're just saying the article isn't persuasive to normies? I'm OK with that sentiment of yours, but I'm also OK with the article itself and the direction it implies this administration is going. Normies don't persuade easy, that's why they're normies. Trump has worked out how to persuade them: by lying hyperbolically and providing the 'circus' of the bread and circus method. But it's a dark circus, and its involuntary audience are only those already lost to Trump.
- bko 1y ago
  > Normies don't persuade easy, that's why they're normies That's where I disagree with you. Normies persuade very easily. Just give them a better life. Tell them you'll make their life materially better and they'll be persuaded to support it. See those tents on the street? I'll get rid of them. Don't like to step over needles? I'll clean it up. Are you annoyed by having stores put shampoo behind lock and key? I'll start arresting and prosecuting the <1% of people stealing.
  - actionfromafar 1y ago
    Or you know, lie that you'll give them a better life. Take control of all branches of government and keep lying. Works fine in Russia.
HankStallone 1y ago
"Democracy" in these discussions increasingly just means the 21st-century bureaucratic status quo. It no longer has anything to do with antiquated notions like "the will of the people." If the people want something different, they're trying to dismantle democracy and should be ignored and given what the managerial class knows is best for them. Persuading the voters is seen as a last resort, a distasteful task that really shouldn't be necessary, if we could just get the right systems in place to keep them pacified and voting for more of the same.
- sickofparadox 1y ago
  >Democracy" in these discussions increasingly just means the 21st-century bureaucratic status quo. It is for this reason that so many young people, left and right, are latching onto non or even anti-democratic political ideologies. The systems themselves have become the highest good as opposed to what they were originally designed for. Due process no longer means a swift and fair trial, it means endless shifting paperwork and appeals that make our judiciary collapse on itself. Building anything is no longer about the funds and means to build it but about the willpower to trudge through 5+ layers of approval from councils and faceless agencies. All the while, elite overproduction has created a whole class of "expert" who cannot understand the world 3 inches from their face but are supposed to be trusted at all times to make the best decision on our behalf.

by bko 1y ago

BLKNSLVR 1y ago

So, you're just saying the article isn't persuasive to normies? I'm OK with that sentiment of yours, but I'm also OK with the article itself and the direction it implies this administration is going. Normies don't persuade easy, that's why they're normies. Trump has worked out how to persuade them: by lying hyperbolically and providing the 'circus' of the bread and circus method. But it's a dark circus, and its involuntary audience are only those already lost to Trump.

bko 1y ago
> Normies don't persuade easy, that's why they're normies That's where I disagree with you. Normies persuade very easily. Just give them a better life. Tell them you'll make their life materially better and they'll be persuaded to support it. See those tents on the street? I'll get rid of them. Don't like to step over needles? I'll clean it up. Are you annoyed by having stores put shampoo behind lock and key? I'll start arresting and prosecuting the <1% of people stealing.
- actionfromafar 1y ago
  Or you know, lie that you'll give them a better life. Take control of all branches of government and keep lying. Works fine in Russia.

HankStallone 1y ago

"Democracy" in these discussions increasingly just means the 21st-century bureaucratic status quo. It no longer has anything to do with antiquated notions like "the will of the people." If the people want something different, they're trying to dismantle democracy and should be ignored and given what the managerial class knows is best for them. Persuading the voters is seen as a last resort, a distasteful task that really shouldn't be necessary, if we could just get the right systems in place to keep them pacified and voting for more of the same.

sickofparadox 1y ago
>Democracy" in these discussions increasingly just means the 21st-century bureaucratic status quo. It is for this reason that so many young people, left and right, are latching onto non or even anti-democratic political ideologies. The systems themselves have become the highest good as opposed to what they were originally designed for. Due process no longer means a swift and fair trial, it means endless shifting paperwork and appeals that make our judiciary collapse on itself. Building anything is no longer about the funds and means to build it but about the willpower to trudge through 5+ layers of approval from councils and faceless agencies. All the while, elite overproduction has created a whole class of "expert" who cannot understand the world 3 inches from their face but are supposed to be trusted at all times to make the best decision on our behalf.