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PhD students are devoting years of their life to this endeavor, which may pay modest living expenses during school but otherwise provides no current or future f

PhD students are devoting years of their life to this endeavor, which may pay modest living expenses during school but otherwise provides no current or future financial benefit to the student unless they get a job in their field I'd like to juxtapose your quote against a famous quote of John Adams: The Science of Government it is my Duty to study, more than all other Sciences: the Art of Legislation and Administration and Negotiation, ought to take Place, indeed to exclude in a manner all other Arts. I must study Politicks and War that my sons may have liberty to study Mathematicks and Philosophy. My sons ought to study Mathematicks and Philosophy, Geography, natural History, Naval Architecture, navigation, Commerce and Agriculture, in order to give their Children a right to study Painting, Poetry, Musick, Architecture, Statuary, Tapestry and Porcelaine. -- John Adams in a letter to Abigail Adams (12 May 1780) In this quote, John Adams offers the thesis that what subjects we deem appropriate to study is determined not wholly by our interests, but also by the situation (personal, economic, and political) we find ourselves in. Within your quote is an implicit sense of urgency that weighs against someone's desire to devote years of their lives to studying the arts. Perhaps we are returning to John Adams's tumultuous time? Then it should be wholly understandable for more students to choose pragmatism over personal calling when deciding on a course of study.

logicchains 1y ago
Studying in that context didn't mean spending years and years in an institution, it meant regularly taking the time to read up and immerse yourself in those things. One of the greatest tragedies of modernity is that we've created a society where the majority of people believe studying is just something done at university, and stop studying anything difficult after they graduate.
lapcat 1y ago
Adams may be correct, but isn't the lesson that we need people to study political science right now? The lesson surely isn't to drop all studies that aren't capitalistically profitable. I don't think the current situation requires even more ruthless profit-seeking.
- chongli 1y ago
  isn't the lesson that we need people to study political science right now? That's a quite literal interpretation of the quote, which I did not intend. John Adams studied political science because his business was the business of government. Studying political science today -- as an otherwise directionless middle-class student relying on loans and scholarships for tuition -- is not really hearing the call to favour pragmatism I believe Adams had intended.
  - lapcat 1y ago
    > That's a quite literal interpretation of the quote, which I did not intend. Yes, but considering the contemporary assault on democracy and the rule of law, it seems apt. > the call to favour pragmatism I believe Adams had intended It depends on what you mean by pragmatism. I'd call it public pragmatism, not mere private pragmatism. Adams calls it his "duty" to study, and goes on to talk about the "liberty" and "right" to student other subjects. The obvious interpretation, I think, especially given who Adams is and his role in the founding of the US, is that he has the obligation to fight for democracy and liberty. Otherwise, he could probably just accumulate person wealth and allow his literal descendants, and those only, to study whatever they want.
  - 1718627440 1y ago
    Assuming you are in the USA and given the state of your country, I would think that you shouldn't reject that proposal over eagerly.
    - chongli 1y ago
      I'm actually not an American and I don't reject the proposal outright. I think the pragmatic approach is still best though: study polisci if you are actually serious about going into politics (or at least policy). But if you don't know what you want to do with your life then it's not a great idea to go into the humanities and hope for the best (while racking up a lot of debt).
      - 1y ago
kenjackson 1y ago
In Adams letter it seems that studying poetry, tapestry, and porcelain are leisurely and enjoyable. For most kids I know today, this would be torture. Are there modern equivalents to this? Film and comics?
- whatshisface 1y ago
  By their children they mean their children when they grow up.

logicchains 1y ago

Studying in that context didn't mean spending years and years in an institution, it meant regularly taking the time to read up and immerse yourself in those things. One of the greatest tragedies of modernity is that we've created a society where the majority of people believe studying is just something done at university, and stop studying anything difficult after they graduate.

lapcat 1y ago

Adams may be correct, but isn't the lesson that we need people to study political science right now? The lesson surely isn't to drop all studies that aren't capitalistically profitable. I don't think the current situation requires even more ruthless profit-seeking.

chongli 1y ago
isn't the lesson that we need people to study political science right now? That's a quite literal interpretation of the quote, which I did not intend. John Adams studied political science because his business was the business of government. Studying political science today -- as an otherwise directionless middle-class student relying on loans and scholarships for tuition -- is not really hearing the call to favour pragmatism I believe Adams had intended.
- lapcat 1y ago
  > That's a quite literal interpretation of the quote, which I did not intend. Yes, but considering the contemporary assault on democracy and the rule of law, it seems apt. > the call to favour pragmatism I believe Adams had intended It depends on what you mean by pragmatism. I'd call it public pragmatism, not mere private pragmatism. Adams calls it his "duty" to study, and goes on to talk about the "liberty" and "right" to student other subjects. The obvious interpretation, I think, especially given who Adams is and his role in the founding of the US, is that he has the obligation to fight for democracy and liberty. Otherwise, he could probably just accumulate person wealth and allow his literal descendants, and those only, to study whatever they want.
- 1718627440 1y ago
  Assuming you are in the USA and given the state of your country, I would think that you shouldn't reject that proposal over eagerly.
  - chongli 1y ago
    I'm actually not an American and I don't reject the proposal outright. I think the pragmatic approach is still best though: study polisci if you are actually serious about going into politics (or at least policy). But if you don't know what you want to do with your life then it's not a great idea to go into the humanities and hope for the best (while racking up a lot of debt).
    - 1y ago

kenjackson 1y ago

In Adams letter it seems that studying poetry, tapestry, and porcelain are leisurely and enjoyable. For most kids I know today, this would be torture. Are there modern equivalents to this? Film and comics?

whatshisface 1y ago
By their children they mean their children when they grow up.