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It has also been well-documented that the controlling interest within Gaza also limits access to food - of it's own citizens/people. While it seems undeniable

by Alupis 1y ago

It has also been well-documented that the controlling interest within Gaza also limits access to food - of it's own citizens/people. While it seems undeniable the people of Gaza are experiencing food scarcity - we cannot lay blame soley at the foot of Israel here. That would be grossly disengenous and an outright falsehood.

JumpCrisscross 1y ago
> we cannot lay blame soley at the foot of Israel here For the famine, yes we can. Let the aid in. Let Hamas steal it. Now you can blame Hamas. The fact that we have zero evidence of Hamas stealing the current aid makes it entirely one side's fault.
- Alupis 1y ago
  Aid did get in, and Hamas did steal it. The media ignored it, so the narrative continues status-quo. Israel has no reason to support Hamas and their efforts here. If Hamas wasn't stealing all of the aid earlier in this conflict, perhaps aid would still be flowing into Gaza. It doesn't seem so absolute/cut-and-dry like you try to make it.
  - JumpCrisscross 1y ago
    > Aid did get in, and Hamas did steal it We have no proof this was routinely happening [1]. [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2025/07/26/world/middleeast/hamas-un-aid-theft.html https://www.nytimes.com/2025/07/26/world/middleeast/hamas-un...
    - Alupis 1y ago
      The UN's own data does not support your claim or article[1]. The UN's data showed 88% of trucks delivering aid to Gaza were looted along their routes - failing to reach their intended destination. [1] - https://www.fdd.org/analysis/2025/08/05/un-reports-88-percent-of-aid-trucks-slated-for-delivery-in-gaza-since-may-looted-along-routes/ https://www.fdd.org/analysis/2025/08/05/un-reports-88-percen...
      - JumpCrisscross 1y ago
        > UN's data showed 88% of trucks delivering aid to Gaza were looted along their routes - failing to reach their intended destination Yes. I think a shop in San Francisco also had some candy bars stolen this AM. Doesn't mean Hamas did it.
        Alupis 1y ago
        You're trying super hard here... So explain to us who is armed and can loot a moving UN convoy in the Gaza region??? This is some insane, wild, political nonsense.
        JumpCrisscross 1y ago
        > explain to us who is armed and can loot a moving UN convoy in the Gaza region That's not what the data say! "Intercepted" means what in retail one calls "shrinkage." It was there before. It isn't now. A staffer could have stolen it. A security guard or driver could have been bribed. It could have been dropped off at the wrong location, or not tracked. It could have been ripped off a moving truck by unarmed, hungry people [1]. It could be non-militants who picked a gun off a dead combatant. Or it could be armed militants. Concluding that all shrinkage is the result of armed robbery is sort of like figuring everything a store's inventory system says was delivered to the store that isn't on the shelves and hasn't been sold was obviously robbed at gunpoint. (I'm also not sure where you're getting the idea that these are armed convoys of UN assets being run through Gaza. Aid provisioning is generally much more rinky dink. And the "U.N. does not accept protection from Israeli forces, saying it would violate its rules of neutrality.") [1] https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-hamas-aid-trucks-danger-34f60bfcd7c84d75e90847c70b76b302 https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-hamas-aid-tru...
        Alupis 1y ago
        You actually believe 88% of all UN aid disappeared to "shrinkage"? The mental gymnastics going on here are stunning...
- db48x 1y ago
  Hamas regularly brags in their recruitment videos about how much food they have, and how their fighters get to eat as much as they want.
  - cyberpunk 1y ago
    Ah then cut off the whole region entirely. Makes perfect sense. Here's a crazy idea. If hamas steal even 90% of the food, why not flood the area with so much fucking food it becomes worthless instead of letting humans starve as terrible collateral against your war goals? Which approach do you think better serves the stated goals of defeating the terrorists? Nah, isolation and cruelty it is. Israel has created generations of enemies.
    - actionfromafar 1y ago
      And pissed away generations of goodwill (deserved or not) abroad. The damage to the Israeli state is incalculable.
      - sgjohnson 1y ago
        > The damage to the Israeli state is incalculable. Is it? Because not even the Arab countries that have recently recognized Israel don’t seem to particularly care about what Israel does in Gaza. Aside from a press release or a vote at the UN. All empty words. Not a single Arab country that recognizes Israel has suspended (or even lowered) diplomatic relations with Israel. I’m pretty sure that once the war in Gaza ends, everyone will be all too happy to forget that it even happened. Even if they won’t say it out loud.
        JumpCrisscross 1y ago
        > once the war in Gaza ends, everyone will all too be happy to forget that it even happened. Even if they won’t say it out loud. It may have a lasting effect in America. Which would mean Israel finding friends in Russia, China and/or India, the latter two which would probably be fully on board with an actual ethnic cleansing of Gaza.
- tguvot 1y ago
  according to published data above 80 percent of shipments are intercepted: https://app.un2720.org/tracking https://app.un2720.org/tracking

by Alupis 1y ago

JumpCrisscross 1y ago

> we cannot lay blame soley at the foot of Israel here For the famine, yes we can. Let the aid in. Let Hamas steal it. Now you can blame Hamas. The fact that we have zero evidence of Hamas stealing the current aid makes it entirely one side's fault.

Alupis 1y ago
Aid did get in, and Hamas did steal it. The media ignored it, so the narrative continues status-quo. Israel has no reason to support Hamas and their efforts here. If Hamas wasn't stealing all of the aid earlier in this conflict, perhaps aid would still be flowing into Gaza. It doesn't seem so absolute/cut-and-dry like you try to make it.
- JumpCrisscross 1y ago
  > Aid did get in, and Hamas did steal it We have no proof this was routinely happening [1]. [1] https://www.nytimes.com/2025/07/26/world/middleeast/hamas-un-aid-theft.html https://www.nytimes.com/2025/07/26/world/middleeast/hamas-un...
  - Alupis 1y ago
    The UN's own data does not support your claim or article[1]. The UN's data showed 88% of trucks delivering aid to Gaza were looted along their routes - failing to reach their intended destination. [1] - https://www.fdd.org/analysis/2025/08/05/un-reports-88-percent-of-aid-trucks-slated-for-delivery-in-gaza-since-may-looted-along-routes/ https://www.fdd.org/analysis/2025/08/05/un-reports-88-percen...
    - JumpCrisscross 1y ago
      > UN's data showed 88% of trucks delivering aid to Gaza were looted along their routes - failing to reach their intended destination Yes. I think a shop in San Francisco also had some candy bars stolen this AM. Doesn't mean Hamas did it.
      - Alupis 1y ago
        You're trying super hard here... So explain to us who is armed and can loot a moving UN convoy in the Gaza region??? This is some insane, wild, political nonsense.
        JumpCrisscross 1y ago
        > explain to us who is armed and can loot a moving UN convoy in the Gaza region That's not what the data say! "Intercepted" means what in retail one calls "shrinkage." It was there before. It isn't now. A staffer could have stolen it. A security guard or driver could have been bribed. It could have been dropped off at the wrong location, or not tracked. It could have been ripped off a moving truck by unarmed, hungry people [1]. It could be non-militants who picked a gun off a dead combatant. Or it could be armed militants. Concluding that all shrinkage is the result of armed robbery is sort of like figuring everything a store's inventory system says was delivered to the store that isn't on the shelves and hasn't been sold was obviously robbed at gunpoint. (I'm also not sure where you're getting the idea that these are armed convoys of UN assets being run through Gaza. Aid provisioning is generally much more rinky dink. And the "U.N. does not accept protection from Israeli forces, saying it would violate its rules of neutrality.") [1] https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-hamas-aid-trucks-danger-34f60bfcd7c84d75e90847c70b76b302 https://apnews.com/article/israel-palestinians-hamas-aid-tru...
        Alupis 1y ago
        You actually believe 88% of all UN aid disappeared to "shrinkage"? The mental gymnastics going on here are stunning...
db48x 1y ago
Hamas regularly brags in their recruitment videos about how much food they have, and how their fighters get to eat as much as they want.
- cyberpunk 1y ago
  Ah then cut off the whole region entirely. Makes perfect sense. Here's a crazy idea. If hamas steal even 90% of the food, why not flood the area with so much fucking food it becomes worthless instead of letting humans starve as terrible collateral against your war goals? Which approach do you think better serves the stated goals of defeating the terrorists? Nah, isolation and cruelty it is. Israel has created generations of enemies.
  - actionfromafar 1y ago
    And pissed away generations of goodwill (deserved or not) abroad. The damage to the Israeli state is incalculable.
    - sgjohnson 1y ago
      > The damage to the Israeli state is incalculable. Is it? Because not even the Arab countries that have recently recognized Israel don’t seem to particularly care about what Israel does in Gaza. Aside from a press release or a vote at the UN. All empty words. Not a single Arab country that recognizes Israel has suspended (or even lowered) diplomatic relations with Israel. I’m pretty sure that once the war in Gaza ends, everyone will be all too happy to forget that it even happened. Even if they won’t say it out loud.
      - JumpCrisscross 1y ago
        > once the war in Gaza ends, everyone will all too be happy to forget that it even happened. Even if they won’t say it out loud. It may have a lasting effect in America. Which would mean Israel finding friends in Russia, China and/or India, the latter two which would probably be fully on board with an actual ethnic cleansing of Gaza.
tguvot 1y ago
according to published data above 80 percent of shipments are intercepted: https://app.un2720.org/tracking https://app.un2720.org/tracking