4 ms·

Many Microsoft customers would still stay on Windows XP if they could.

forgotmypw17 1y ago
Yes, they would. And it valid for them to want to do so. And the fact that software developers think that they "know better" is part of the problem with our software world today.
- graemep 1y ago
  Exactly. If customers prefer your old product to your new product there is something wrong. It is not just MS that does this.
  - greggsy 1y ago
    I disagree. If there is a fundamental architectural issue with the current platform that is getting in the way of progress, the right thing to do is to fix it. By ‘progress’ I mean compatibility with new innovations like DirectX or some new instruction set that enable dumb things like transparency, or spacial audio, as well genuinely useful things. You simply can’t bolt that onto an 18 year old system without breaking things irreversibly. It also means depreciation of insecure ways of doing things. MS’ attempt to get TPMs into every desktop is clumsy, but it serves a greater good. None of those things require W11 to operate, but I can see why they needed to make it look fancier than W10 to convince people that it’s somehow ‘better’.
    - graemep 1y ago
      > None of those things require W11 to operate, but I can see why they needed to make it look fancier than W10 to convince people that it’s somehow ‘better’. It has the opposite effect. People do not like the fancier look. It also depends on what you mean by progress. if it is genuinely better for customers why do you have to force them to use it?
- hueho 1y ago
  > And it valid for them to want to do so. Sure, if they don't make it everybody else's problem. Not to defend MS too hard, but they supported Windows XP with security updates for 18 years. At some point software needs to be "finished", and once it is, all responsability falls upon the user. The enterprises with competent IT that will airgap their XP machines to keep running the control plane for their factory probably "know better" than MS, the power user who refuses to use a Linux distro for their Pentium 3 box or who will disable Windows Defender and run random scripts on the internet to "debloat the OS" without understanding it, or the ones who run LTSC and then complain that their games aren't working - they all absolutely don't know better, but unfortunately they tend to be the louder voices in the conversation.
0xCMP 1y ago
I think the article's point is that many on Windows 10 would upgrade to 11 if they could. Their computers are simply not supported and to get around that requires some technical skills.
- greggsy 1y ago
  They almost wilfully neglected to state that users can buy extended support at $50 per seat. That was recently waived for private EU users, and I’m half expecting them to expand it more broadly.
harddrivereque 1y ago
My XP system was my best ever system. I had so many things in it. I still have my old XP laptop, it still works but I can connect it to the internet. Even when I do, usually browsers don't show anything properly anymore because the last xp supporting versions are from I think 2016-2018? Not sure about that one. But I love my XP computer. I wish there was a way to completely move the system to a virtual machine.
- r2_pilot 1y ago
  Are you familiar with disk2vhd? I've used it to virtualize several older OS installs
happymellon 1y ago
Vista had a number of QOL improvements, and later in the cycle once the drivers and apps were fixed to stop demanding admin access all the time, and the terrible Intel GPUs that struggled with XP and died under Vista were replaced, it was pretty good. Arguably better than XP. 7 and 10 didn't really give most folks much better experience, they benefited from Vista already forcing everyone to update their crap.

Yes, they would. And it valid for them to want to do so. And the fact that software developers think that they "know better" is part of the problem with our software world today.

graemep 1y ago
Exactly. If customers prefer your old product to your new product there is something wrong. It is not just MS that does this.
- greggsy 1y ago
  I disagree. If there is a fundamental architectural issue with the current platform that is getting in the way of progress, the right thing to do is to fix it. By ‘progress’ I mean compatibility with new innovations like DirectX or some new instruction set that enable dumb things like transparency, or spacial audio, as well genuinely useful things. You simply can’t bolt that onto an 18 year old system without breaking things irreversibly. It also means depreciation of insecure ways of doing things. MS’ attempt to get TPMs into every desktop is clumsy, but it serves a greater good. None of those things require W11 to operate, but I can see why they needed to make it look fancier than W10 to convince people that it’s somehow ‘better’.
  - graemep 1y ago
    > None of those things require W11 to operate, but I can see why they needed to make it look fancier than W10 to convince people that it’s somehow ‘better’. It has the opposite effect. People do not like the fancier look. It also depends on what you mean by progress. if it is genuinely better for customers why do you have to force them to use it?
hueho 1y ago
> And it valid for them to want to do so. Sure, if they don't make it everybody else's problem. Not to defend MS too hard, but they supported Windows XP with security updates for 18 years. At some point software needs to be "finished", and once it is, all responsability falls upon the user. The enterprises with competent IT that will airgap their XP machines to keep running the control plane for their factory probably "know better" than MS, the power user who refuses to use a Linux distro for their Pentium 3 box or who will disable Windows Defender and run random scripts on the internet to "debloat the OS" without understanding it, or the ones who run LTSC and then complain that their games aren't working - they all absolutely don't know better, but unfortunately they tend to be the louder voices in the conversation.

0xCMP 1y ago

I think the article's point is that many on Windows 10 would upgrade to 11 if they could. Their computers are simply not supported and to get around that requires some technical skills.

greggsy 1y ago
They almost wilfully neglected to state that users can buy extended support at $50 per seat. That was recently waived for private EU users, and I’m half expecting them to expand it more broadly.

harddrivereque 1y ago

My XP system was my best ever system. I had so many things in it. I still have my old XP laptop, it still works but I can connect it to the internet. Even when I do, usually browsers don't show anything properly anymore because the last xp supporting versions are from I think 2016-2018? Not sure about that one. But I love my XP computer. I wish there was a way to completely move the system to a virtual machine.

r2_pilot 1y ago
Are you familiar with disk2vhd? I've used it to virtualize several older OS installs

happymellon 1y ago

Vista had a number of QOL improvements, and later in the cycle once the drivers and apps were fixed to stop demanding admin access all the time, and the terrible Intel GPUs that struggled with XP and died under Vista were replaced, it was pretty good. Arguably better than XP. 7 and 10 didn't really give most folks much better experience, they benefited from Vista already forcing everyone to update their crap.