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If "kick down, lick up" didn't work, there would be fewer people selecting it as a strategy, and no need for jeremiads like this one. Sad but true. Edit: Thin

by hapless 14y ago

If "kick down, lick up" didn't work, there would be fewer people selecting it as a strategy, and no need for jeremiads like this one. Sad but true. Edit: Thinking on it, I guess the other message from this article isn't in the headline: "Don't do business with people who treat their employees like crap." It's not just a jeremiad.

silvestrov 14y ago
To play the devil's advocate: that German guy didn't lick up enough, he was too selective, if he had licked everybody those few days, he would have gotten the contract. So he could have come to the complete opposite conclusion. You can fool most people some of the time...
- r00fus 14y ago
  Just an anecdote - back over a decade ago during my consulting days, a large client I was working for in France said that when they chose a competitor over Siebel, Tom himself flew down to the client site for the sole purpose (as they said it) to tell them they were idiots for not choosing his product. Flying to a different country just to say FU to a recently lost sale doesn't sound very afffable, and yet, the Siebel product line still exists today (under the Oracle umbrella - but then again, Oracle seems to just like buying out their competitors).
j_baker 14y ago
I think that "kick down, lick up" almost always fails in the long run. That's the most puzzling thing about it in fact. It doesn't really benefit anyone in the long run (including the person who uses it), but for some reason people keep using it, and others will keep them around for longer than it's a benefit to them.
- konradb 14y ago
  A person kicking down and licking up is too blinded by fear, and that fear robs them of the awareness of how counterproductive the strategy they are using is. In their haste to move away from what they hate, they take the shortcut which is to not look at it; to act what they feel is the opposite of what they hate. What would be most beneficial for these people is to confront themselves head on and examine why they don't feel comfortable and deconstruct their history, their reactions, their thoughts and their actions. But it's the strength of the fear they feel that stops them doing precisely this. A natural protection system no? Move away from what you don't like? Counterproductive to force yourself to move towards it and know it, but I personally find the more I do it, the more I benefit. Of course sometimes it can take time for the penny to drop. That's why I meditate. The pennies drop faster, and as the noise drops away you slowly start to pay more attention to yourself, and can move away from destructive behaviour.
- im3w1l 14y ago
  Lick up works. I would assume people kick down not because it is useful, but because they get a perverse sense of enjoyment out of it.

by hapless 14y ago

silvestrov 14y ago

To play the devil's advocate: that German guy didn't lick up enough, he was too selective, if he had licked everybody those few days, he would have gotten the contract. So he could have come to the complete opposite conclusion. You can fool most people some of the time...

r00fus 14y ago
Just an anecdote - back over a decade ago during my consulting days, a large client I was working for in France said that when they chose a competitor over Siebel, Tom himself flew down to the client site for the sole purpose (as they said it) to tell them they were idiots for not choosing his product. Flying to a different country just to say FU to a recently lost sale doesn't sound very afffable, and yet, the Siebel product line still exists today (under the Oracle umbrella - but then again, Oracle seems to just like buying out their competitors).

j_baker 14y ago

I think that "kick down, lick up" almost always fails in the long run. That's the most puzzling thing about it in fact. It doesn't really benefit anyone in the long run (including the person who uses it), but for some reason people keep using it, and others will keep them around for longer than it's a benefit to them.

konradb 14y ago
A person kicking down and licking up is too blinded by fear, and that fear robs them of the awareness of how counterproductive the strategy they are using is. In their haste to move away from what they hate, they take the shortcut which is to not look at it; to act what they feel is the opposite of what they hate. What would be most beneficial for these people is to confront themselves head on and examine why they don't feel comfortable and deconstruct their history, their reactions, their thoughts and their actions. But it's the strength of the fear they feel that stops them doing precisely this. A natural protection system no? Move away from what you don't like? Counterproductive to force yourself to move towards it and know it, but I personally find the more I do it, the more I benefit. Of course sometimes it can take time for the penny to drop. That's why I meditate. The pennies drop faster, and as the noise drops away you slowly start to pay more attention to yourself, and can move away from destructive behaviour.
im3w1l 14y ago
Lick up works. I would assume people kick down not because it is useful, but because they get a perverse sense of enjoyment out of it.