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EU and US testing criteria are very different - in the US, motor vehicles leaving the roadway and impacting stationary objects is the top source of traffic fata

EU and US testing criteria are very different - in the US, motor vehicles leaving the roadway and impacting stationary objects is the top source of traffic fatalities. In the EU, it's pedestrian impacts (which makes sense corresponding to the urban vs rural environments in each). The EU has very stringent testing for pedestrian safety: https://www.euroncap.com/en/car-safety/the-ratings-explained/vulnerable-road-user-vru-protection/ https://www.euroncap.com/en/car-safety/the-ratings-explained.... One of the tests is literally just taking a foam ball, pressing it on spots all around the front of the car, and looking for hard, sharp corners. The cybertruck is a steel box made of sharp corners. It was never, ever going to be allowed on European roads - and the US Government here is saying they are not even going to fight for the rarest exception.

jonpurdy 1y ago
Not knowing how testing works or the criteria in USA/Canada, I'm surprised it's even allowed here. I'd rather be hit as a pedestrian by almost any other truck since at least F-150s and RAMs don't have sharp edges like the Cybertruck...
- legitster 1y ago
  But again, here in the US we are an order of magnitude less likely to be hit by a car. EDIT: Than being in a car accident Obviously we could get into incentives and prioritizing pedestrian safety and urbanizing. But if you take the current status quo of where Americans live and how they drive, I can very much understand regulators choosing to prioritize the safety regulations that will save the largest number of lives on the roads we have now.
  - _aavaa_ 1y ago
    https://usa.streetsblog.org/2020/10/10/exactly-how-far-u-s-street-safety-has-fallen-behind-europe-in-four-bombshell-charts https://usa.streetsblog.org/2020/10/10/exactly-how-far-u-s-s...
    - legitster 1y ago
      You're right, I misrepresented the idea. Part of the thing is that US roads are just so much more dangerous in every way. Here's the actual data: US pedestrian fatalities 2 per 100k. US driver fatalities ~7 per 100k. European pedestrian fatalities: 0.5 per 100k. European driver fatalities: ~2 per 100k. So it's somewhat understandable that regulators may disproportionately favor crash protection for drivers.
      - wkat4242 1y ago
        It's especially concerning when you see that US drivers tend to drive huge tanks. Whereas in Europe we have a lot of tiny compact cars. And yet they still die in the US in larger numbers :O
  - bdangubic 1y ago
    > But again, here in the US we are an order of magnitude less likely to be hit by a car. hard disagree, in places where cybertrucks are most sold it is urban populated areas and pedestrian incidents and fatalities are very high
  - jbmchuck 1y ago
    > But again, here in the US we are an order of magnitude less likely to be hit by a car. Huh - do you have a source for that stat?
- al_borland 1y ago
  I don't care so much about the edges. I'm more worried about the height of these newer trucks and SUVs, which create massive front blindspots. The below report focuses on kids, but I'm an adult and some of these trucks seem taller than me. https://www.wthr.com/article/news/investigations/13-investigates/13-investigates-millions-vehicles-have-unexpected-dangerous-front-blind-zone/531-9521c471-3bc1-4b55-b860-3363f0954b3b https://www.wthr.com/article/news/investigations/13-investig...
  - throw0101c 1y ago
    > I'm more worried about the height of these newer trucks and SUVs, which create massive front blindspots. There's a bit of meme that an M1 Abrams tank has better forward visibility than many SUVs/pickups: * https://old.reddit.com/r/fuckcars/comments/140dgn8/many_popular_trucks_have_a_bigger_dead_spot_in/ https://old.reddit.com/r/fuckcars/comments/140dgn8/many_popu...
    - detaro 1y ago
      So we need to arm children, so SUV drivers also consider good visibility a feature for their safety, just like the M1 designers did.
  - timw0j 1y ago
    I drive a Mini. I frequently notice how the hoods of these trucks are taller than my entire car.
    - al_borland 1y ago
      I drive a smaller hatchback as well and notice the same thing. I’ve been on the other side of it once. I got roped into driving an acquaintance’s H3 Hummer years ago. I went to change lanes, checked my mirrors, looked over my shoulder out the window, and all seems clear. It wasn’t. There was a car that was completely invisible to me. Had other people not been in the car and looking, I would have run them right off the road. I have no idea how anyone drives those things on a daily basis. I was a nervous wreck. I think the best visibility I had in a car was my old GTI. I could see all 4 corners and knew exactly where I was at.
- legitster 1y ago
  There's a really good video by Road Guy Rob that goes into very good detail about the specific causes of pedestrian fatalities in the US: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEj-pyjA2oo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEj-pyjA2oo TL;DW: It's most likely happening at night, on an arterial street, by a truck or SUV.
HWR_14 1y ago
> In the EU, it's pedestrian impacts (which makes sense corresponding to the urban vs rural environments in each). The US has a comparable urban population to Western Europe or Scandinavia. However, the urban areas are far more car centric.
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
m463 1y ago
wonder if importers can qualify the truck for europe? They used to do this for lamborghini countach in the US by adding ridiculous bumpers: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/42/Lamborghini_Countach_US_spec_5000QV.jpg https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/42/Lamborgh...
- rsynnott 1y ago
  It's not _just_ the absurd pointiness; it's also far too heavy. Vehicles over 3.5 tonnes (AIUI the Cybertruck would qualify; while its empty weight is 3.2 tonnes, what matters is the laden weight, and you'd have a hard time arguing that it could only take 300kg contents) in Europe require a speed limiter. The imposed limits vary by country, but would make it pretty impractical as a car. Typically 80km/h on motorways, 50km/h in urban areas. They also need to beep when they reverse and so forth.
duxup 1y ago
Maybe I'm taking your words to mean something other than intended, but are sharp corners on a car in a car vs pedestrian situation more dangerous than any other? Or is it more the angle + materials? This is one of those things that seems visually more dangerous, but I'm not sure if it is in real world results. Outside say a pike sticking out I wonder...

jonpurdy 1y ago

Not knowing how testing works or the criteria in USA/Canada, I'm surprised it's even allowed here. I'd rather be hit as a pedestrian by almost any other truck since at least F-150s and RAMs don't have sharp edges like the Cybertruck...

legitster 1y ago
But again, here in the US we are an order of magnitude less likely to be hit by a car. EDIT: Than being in a car accident Obviously we could get into incentives and prioritizing pedestrian safety and urbanizing. But if you take the current status quo of where Americans live and how they drive, I can very much understand regulators choosing to prioritize the safety regulations that will save the largest number of lives on the roads we have now.
- _aavaa_ 1y ago
  https://usa.streetsblog.org/2020/10/10/exactly-how-far-u-s-street-safety-has-fallen-behind-europe-in-four-bombshell-charts https://usa.streetsblog.org/2020/10/10/exactly-how-far-u-s-s...
  - legitster 1y ago
    You're right, I misrepresented the idea. Part of the thing is that US roads are just so much more dangerous in every way. Here's the actual data: US pedestrian fatalities 2 per 100k. US driver fatalities ~7 per 100k. European pedestrian fatalities: 0.5 per 100k. European driver fatalities: ~2 per 100k. So it's somewhat understandable that regulators may disproportionately favor crash protection for drivers.
    - wkat4242 1y ago
      It's especially concerning when you see that US drivers tend to drive huge tanks. Whereas in Europe we have a lot of tiny compact cars. And yet they still die in the US in larger numbers :O
- bdangubic 1y ago
  > But again, here in the US we are an order of magnitude less likely to be hit by a car. hard disagree, in places where cybertrucks are most sold it is urban populated areas and pedestrian incidents and fatalities are very high
- jbmchuck 1y ago
  > But again, here in the US we are an order of magnitude less likely to be hit by a car. Huh - do you have a source for that stat?
al_borland 1y ago
I don't care so much about the edges. I'm more worried about the height of these newer trucks and SUVs, which create massive front blindspots. The below report focuses on kids, but I'm an adult and some of these trucks seem taller than me. https://www.wthr.com/article/news/investigations/13-investigates/13-investigates-millions-vehicles-have-unexpected-dangerous-front-blind-zone/531-9521c471-3bc1-4b55-b860-3363f0954b3b https://www.wthr.com/article/news/investigations/13-investig...
- throw0101c 1y ago
  > I'm more worried about the height of these newer trucks and SUVs, which create massive front blindspots. There's a bit of meme that an M1 Abrams tank has better forward visibility than many SUVs/pickups: * https://old.reddit.com/r/fuckcars/comments/140dgn8/many_popular_trucks_have_a_bigger_dead_spot_in/ https://old.reddit.com/r/fuckcars/comments/140dgn8/many_popu...
  - detaro 1y ago
    So we need to arm children, so SUV drivers also consider good visibility a feature for their safety, just like the M1 designers did.
- timw0j 1y ago
  I drive a Mini. I frequently notice how the hoods of these trucks are taller than my entire car.
  - al_borland 1y ago
    I drive a smaller hatchback as well and notice the same thing. I’ve been on the other side of it once. I got roped into driving an acquaintance’s H3 Hummer years ago. I went to change lanes, checked my mirrors, looked over my shoulder out the window, and all seems clear. It wasn’t. There was a car that was completely invisible to me. Had other people not been in the car and looking, I would have run them right off the road. I have no idea how anyone drives those things on a daily basis. I was a nervous wreck. I think the best visibility I had in a car was my old GTI. I could see all 4 corners and knew exactly where I was at.
legitster 1y ago
There's a really good video by Road Guy Rob that goes into very good detail about the specific causes of pedestrian fatalities in the US: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEj-pyjA2oo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEj-pyjA2oo TL;DW: It's most likely happening at night, on an arterial street, by a truck or SUV.

HWR_14 1y ago

> In the EU, it's pedestrian impacts (which makes sense corresponding to the urban vs rural environments in each). The US has a comparable urban population to Western Europe or Scandinavia. However, the urban areas are far more car centric.

deleted 1y ago

[deleted]

m463 1y ago

wonder if importers can qualify the truck for europe? They used to do this for lamborghini countach in the US by adding ridiculous bumpers: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/42/Lamborghini_Countach_US_spec_5000QV.jpg https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/42/Lamborgh...

rsynnott 1y ago
It's not _just_ the absurd pointiness; it's also far too heavy. Vehicles over 3.5 tonnes (AIUI the Cybertruck would qualify; while its empty weight is 3.2 tonnes, what matters is the laden weight, and you'd have a hard time arguing that it could only take 300kg contents) in Europe require a speed limiter. The imposed limits vary by country, but would make it pretty impractical as a car. Typically 80km/h on motorways, 50km/h in urban areas. They also need to beep when they reverse and so forth.

duxup 1y ago

Maybe I'm taking your words to mean something other than intended, but are sharp corners on a car in a car vs pedestrian situation more dangerous than any other? Or is it more the angle + materials? This is one of those things that seems visually more dangerous, but I'm not sure if it is in real world results. Outside say a pike sticking out I wonder...