4 ms·

That might work for cleaners, but not for rideshare, food delivery and vacation rentals, which probably account for the vast majority of the "gig economy".

by gruez 1y ago

mrandish 1y ago
Good point. I think lack of competition inflates the 'share of revenue' online marketing services can extract. And competitive alternatives are nerfed due to the app store hegemony and the anti-competitive behavior and dark patterns of giants like Google & FB. They needed to nerf the open web to maximize their profits, so they did.
theteapot 1y ago
Owning and renting a vacation accommodation is gig economy? Those poor renting seeking plebs.
- loloquwowndueo 1y ago
  Ever heard of airbnb? I think mainly it helps property owners skirt the whole “I’m a landlord” thing and all the legal obligations it entails.
  - theteapot 1y ago
    Yeah, I just don't really consider sitting on you fat butt and collecting rent a "gig". That's called rent seeking, or a scam.
kelvinjps10 1y ago
You can do the same as the cleaner example. For example get the rideshare numer, food delivery etc
- palata 1y ago
  I'm not convinced. What makes an app like Uber efficient is that it connects you to the closest driver when you need it. If you have the number of a driver, they may not be working at that time, or they may be far away. Same for food delivery. Very different for a cleaner: you never need a cleaner "right now", you can schedule it.
  - margalabargala 1y ago
    Well, sometimes. Sometimes you want a ride right here right now, other times you want "a ride to the airport at 6am tomorrow". Uber let's you "schedule rides" but that doesn't actually do anything to guarantee a ride. You could wind up without a driver if you're unlucky. Directly contacting the person driving you, 12 hours in advance, is a much better way to guarantee a ride.
    - AnthonyMouse 1y ago
      > Directly contacting the person driving you, 12 hours in advance, is a much better way to guarantee a ride. ...if they haven't had any car trouble, and haven't quit providing car service, and are intending to work then, and haven't scheduled another ride for the same time, and are willing to schedule something when they don't know where their unscheduled fares are going to leave them just before. The apps that match workers with customers are actually doing something useful. The main problem is that people keep trying to get them to be considered employers, which increases their costs, and then those costs get passed on so that more of what you pay goes to overhead and less of what you pay actually goes to the worker.
      - margalabargala 1y ago
        Sure, yes, you do actually have to have a conversation with the person you are personally contacting for a ride and get them to say "yes".
        AnthonyMouse 1y ago
        Which is a cost, because then you have to call around trying to find someone who is willing to do it then, which is exactly the thing the app does for you.
worik 1y ago
It will not work for discovery, but if you develop an ongoing relationship it can work for that. Apps seem to be very good at bringing people together initially, it is up to us to develop relationships after that, and apps are not as good for that. Well. Communication apps are! Signal et el.
bee_rider 1y ago
For vacation rentals, I have had the owner give me their card afterwards. For food delivery (at least takeout) and ride share, the app actually provides a real value; it handles matching drivers and customers who want to make a deal now, for a service that is not really super differentiated. It makes sense to stay in their ecosystem and it seems fair that they would be continuing to make a profit.
- jorvi 1y ago
  > For food delivery (at least takeout) and ride share, the app actually provides a real value The problem with a food delivery network is that it should be a dumb network, not a big profit center. It should be like an ISP, with the food being the high value packets being delivered to you. If you look at pre-UberEats times, each restaurant employed a couple of delivery drivers on scooters. Some might have shared those if the restaurants were on the same street, but that's about it. During low times these drivers would laze around doing nothing, effectively wasting productivity, whereas during peak times, the restaurant didn't have enough drivers. Having one delivery driver network for an entire city should have made things more efficient and cheaper. But because for example in Europe, JustEat-TakeAway and UberEats have inserted themselves as the middleman and crushed out all competition. Delivery has gotten more expensive and inconvenient because of it. These days delivery costs €3-5 and there is a €15 delivery minimum. Before, no delivery charge and there was no official minimum. One time one of my friends order a 6-pack of cola, although I doubt they would have delivered that to the edge of the city. Worst of it is, restaurants are not allowed to charge lower prices themselves than they offer on the app. On top of that, JustEat-TakeAway will make a branded store site on restaurantname.localdeliverycompany.com, of which they get a cut versus if you used the restaurant's own site. If delivery is more expensive, more inconvenient and often slower now than before 2015, what 'real value' was added?
  - sumeno 1y ago
    > If you look at pre-UberEats times, each restaurant employed a couple of delivery drivers on scooters. This was not my experience. Hardly any restaurants had delivery other than pizza. > If delivery is more expensive, more inconvenient and often slower now than before 2015, what 'real value' was added? More expensive maybe, but I strongly disagree that it's more inconvenient or slower.
johnisgood 1y ago
Because rideshare drivers and food deliveries are not done by a single individual only, they are in contract and they are doing it as an employee of a company. When you call up your local plumber, you are doing everything under the counter.
n4r9 1y ago
You used to be able to ring up certain restaurants and order a delivery. And it was often free.
freddie_mercury 1y ago
Even for cleaners it might not work. I know several people who tried this and the cleaner said no. I think (not sure) the cleaner signed some kind of contract/agreement with the website not to do that and worries that if they are discovered they will be banned from the site and thus lose the other 90% of their income. Dunno how rational that fear is.
- kjs3 1y ago
  It's very real, according some folks in the business I know. They are very aggressive in trying to prevent this, because otherwise why wouldn't someone paid what a cleaner is paid try and cut the middleman out.
asdff 1y ago
It does work pretty well for rideshare in my experience. I've settled cash with an uber driver before. Neighbor has a specific driver they use for the airport they pay a flat rate for.
mcv 1y ago
I've received cards from taxi drivers so I can contact them directly next time. Food delivery I prefer to do through the restaurant's own website.
gruturo 1y ago
It 100% works for vacation rentals. I found an AirBnB I liked in Spain, went there 3 more times over the past few years. One time it was already booked and the owner put me in an even better, larger (4BR) place at a discount. Caveat: your SO must not be allergic to going to the same place more than once in a lifetime. My ex was.
abustamam 1y ago
I heard a pitch by a company, its name escapes me, but it's like AirBnB for Muslims. The idea is to bring back the community aspect of hosting families, where values are aligned (ie you know that the cookware has never been used to cook bacon for example). Households pay $200 a year, they get 2 credits. Each credit grants you a stay at another member's house. Anytime someone stays at your house, you earn a credit. I think something like this, if it finds traction, is really cool. Of course, that probably means you probably wouldn't be able to use this network to stay in some random remote area, but if it's in a host happens to be in an area you want to stay in, it can be even cheaper than AirBnB.

That might work for cleaners, but not for rideshare, food delivery and vacation rentals, which probably account for the vast majority of the "gig economy".

by gruez 1y ago

That might work for cleaners, but not for rideshare, food delivery and vacation rentals, which probably account for the vast majority of the "gig economy".

mrandish 1y ago

Good point. I think lack of competition inflates the 'share of revenue' online marketing services can extract. And competitive alternatives are nerfed due to the app store hegemony and the anti-competitive behavior and dark patterns of giants like Google & FB. They needed to nerf the open web to maximize their profits, so they did.

theteapot 1y ago

Owning and renting a vacation accommodation is gig economy? Those poor renting seeking plebs.

loloquwowndueo 1y ago
Ever heard of airbnb? I think mainly it helps property owners skirt the whole “I’m a landlord” thing and all the legal obligations it entails.
- theteapot 1y ago
  Yeah, I just don't really consider sitting on you fat butt and collecting rent a "gig". That's called rent seeking, or a scam.

kelvinjps10 1y ago

You can do the same as the cleaner example. For example get the rideshare numer, food delivery etc

palata 1y ago
I'm not convinced. What makes an app like Uber efficient is that it connects you to the closest driver when you need it. If you have the number of a driver, they may not be working at that time, or they may be far away. Same for food delivery. Very different for a cleaner: you never need a cleaner "right now", you can schedule it.
- margalabargala 1y ago
  Well, sometimes. Sometimes you want a ride right here right now, other times you want "a ride to the airport at 6am tomorrow". Uber let's you "schedule rides" but that doesn't actually do anything to guarantee a ride. You could wind up without a driver if you're unlucky. Directly contacting the person driving you, 12 hours in advance, is a much better way to guarantee a ride.
  - AnthonyMouse 1y ago
    > Directly contacting the person driving you, 12 hours in advance, is a much better way to guarantee a ride. ...if they haven't had any car trouble, and haven't quit providing car service, and are intending to work then, and haven't scheduled another ride for the same time, and are willing to schedule something when they don't know where their unscheduled fares are going to leave them just before. The apps that match workers with customers are actually doing something useful. The main problem is that people keep trying to get them to be considered employers, which increases their costs, and then those costs get passed on so that more of what you pay goes to overhead and less of what you pay actually goes to the worker.
    - margalabargala 1y ago
      Sure, yes, you do actually have to have a conversation with the person you are personally contacting for a ride and get them to say "yes".
      - AnthonyMouse 1y ago
        Which is a cost, because then you have to call around trying to find someone who is willing to do it then, which is exactly the thing the app does for you.

worik 1y ago

It will not work for discovery, but if you develop an ongoing relationship it can work for that. Apps seem to be very good at bringing people together initially, it is up to us to develop relationships after that, and apps are not as good for that. Well. Communication apps are! Signal et el.

bee_rider 1y ago

For vacation rentals, I have had the owner give me their card afterwards. For food delivery (at least takeout) and ride share, the app actually provides a real value; it handles matching drivers and customers who want to make a deal now, for a service that is not really super differentiated. It makes sense to stay in their ecosystem and it seems fair that they would be continuing to make a profit.

jorvi 1y ago
> For food delivery (at least takeout) and ride share, the app actually provides a real value The problem with a food delivery network is that it should be a dumb network, not a big profit center. It should be like an ISP, with the food being the high value packets being delivered to you. If you look at pre-UberEats times, each restaurant employed a couple of delivery drivers on scooters. Some might have shared those if the restaurants were on the same street, but that's about it. During low times these drivers would laze around doing nothing, effectively wasting productivity, whereas during peak times, the restaurant didn't have enough drivers. Having one delivery driver network for an entire city should have made things more efficient and cheaper. But because for example in Europe, JustEat-TakeAway and UberEats have inserted themselves as the middleman and crushed out all competition. Delivery has gotten more expensive and inconvenient because of it. These days delivery costs €3-5 and there is a €15 delivery minimum. Before, no delivery charge and there was no official minimum. One time one of my friends order a 6-pack of cola, although I doubt they would have delivered that to the edge of the city. Worst of it is, restaurants are not allowed to charge lower prices themselves than they offer on the app. On top of that, JustEat-TakeAway will make a branded store site on restaurantname.localdeliverycompany.com, of which they get a cut versus if you used the restaurant's own site. If delivery is more expensive, more inconvenient and often slower now than before 2015, what 'real value' was added?
- sumeno 1y ago
  > If you look at pre-UberEats times, each restaurant employed a couple of delivery drivers on scooters. This was not my experience. Hardly any restaurants had delivery other than pizza. > If delivery is more expensive, more inconvenient and often slower now than before 2015, what 'real value' was added? More expensive maybe, but I strongly disagree that it's more inconvenient or slower.

johnisgood 1y ago

Because rideshare drivers and food deliveries are not done by a single individual only, they are in contract and they are doing it as an employee of a company. When you call up your local plumber, you are doing everything under the counter.

n4r9 1y ago

You used to be able to ring up certain restaurants and order a delivery. And it was often free.

freddie_mercury 1y ago

Even for cleaners it might not work. I know several people who tried this and the cleaner said no. I think (not sure) the cleaner signed some kind of contract/agreement with the website not to do that and worries that if they are discovered they will be banned from the site and thus lose the other 90% of their income. Dunno how rational that fear is.

kjs3 1y ago
It's very real, according some folks in the business I know. They are very aggressive in trying to prevent this, because otherwise why wouldn't someone paid what a cleaner is paid try and cut the middleman out.

asdff 1y ago

It does work pretty well for rideshare in my experience. I've settled cash with an uber driver before. Neighbor has a specific driver they use for the airport they pay a flat rate for.

mcv 1y ago

I've received cards from taxi drivers so I can contact them directly next time. Food delivery I prefer to do through the restaurant's own website.

gruturo 1y ago

It 100% works for vacation rentals. I found an AirBnB I liked in Spain, went there 3 more times over the past few years. One time it was already booked and the owner put me in an even better, larger (4BR) place at a discount. Caveat: your SO must not be allergic to going to the same place more than once in a lifetime. My ex was.

abustamam 1y ago

I heard a pitch by a company, its name escapes me, but it's like AirBnB for Muslims. The idea is to bring back the community aspect of hosting families, where values are aligned (ie you know that the cookware has never been used to cook bacon for example). Households pay $200 a year, they get 2 credits. Each credit grants you a stay at another member's house. Anytime someone stays at your house, you earn a credit. I think something like this, if it finds traction, is really cool. Of course, that probably means you probably wouldn't be able to use this network to stay in some random remote area, but if it's in a host happens to be in an area you want to stay in, it can be even cheaper than AirBnB.