5 ms·

We've figured that out, but certain members of society decided that extracting wealth through protectionist zoning/building code behavior is much, much more luc

We've figured that out, but certain members of society decided that extracting wealth through protectionist zoning/building code behavior is much, much more lucrative.

bryanrasmussen 1y ago
that just moves the figuring out one step to the right. knowing how something will work but not knowing how to get it implemented means the problem is not completely figured out yet.
- SoftTalker 1y ago
  Exactly. We haven't figured out how to solve the problem, because we still have the problem. Maybe it's unsolvable, and it's just a limitation in our ability to live together in large numbers. Or maybe we need to redirect our spending on (among other things) frightfully expensive experimental medicine and spend the money on things that are a lot cheaper and will help a lot more people.
MobiusHorizons 1y ago
Really? I think I can agree that the zoning isn't helping, but claiming we have figured it out seems like bold claim. Where _is_ it working? My impression is that housing costs are increasing faster than inflation and wages not only in North America, but also in the UK and EU, which don't have the same kinds of zoning laws.
- andrewmutz 1y ago
  It’s working in Japan
  - sadeshmukh 1y ago
    I wouldn't believe most in the US would live in Japanese style housing at all.
    - EstanislaoStan 1y ago
      Why not?
      - herewulf 1y ago
        The American Dream has become living in a McMansion in suburbia?
      - trallnag 1y ago
        Aren't Japanese homes super tiny? Even smaller than the already small homes and apartments in Europe? That's one reason. In the US, it seems that people live in bigger places, with higher ceilings.
    - kiba 1y ago
      Most homes in Japan aren't built in the traditional Japanese style at all IIRC.
      - sadeshmukh 1y ago
        I was referring to the little space and tiny storage. Pay isn't exactly great for the rent either.
  - MobiusHorizons 1y ago
    My understanding was that Japanese housing costs are only good in USD because the yen is devalued. I had the impression that housing is expensive relative to local wages. Is that not true?
    - andrewmutz 1y ago
      It's not true. Here is an apples-to-apples comparison of the price of residential property between the US and Japan in real (inflation adjusted) terms. https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/QJPR368BIS https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/QJPR368BIS https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/QUSR628BIS https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/QUSR628BIS

We've figured that out, but certain members of society decided that extracting wealth through protectionist zoning/building code behavior is much, much more lucrative.

bryanrasmussen 1y ago

that just moves the figuring out one step to the right. knowing how something will work but not knowing how to get it implemented means the problem is not completely figured out yet.

SoftTalker 1y ago
Exactly. We haven't figured out how to solve the problem, because we still have the problem. Maybe it's unsolvable, and it's just a limitation in our ability to live together in large numbers. Or maybe we need to redirect our spending on (among other things) frightfully expensive experimental medicine and spend the money on things that are a lot cheaper and will help a lot more people.

MobiusHorizons 1y ago

Really? I think I can agree that the zoning isn't helping, but claiming we have figured it out seems like bold claim. Where _is_ it working? My impression is that housing costs are increasing faster than inflation and wages not only in North America, but also in the UK and EU, which don't have the same kinds of zoning laws.

andrewmutz 1y ago
It’s working in Japan
- sadeshmukh 1y ago
  I wouldn't believe most in the US would live in Japanese style housing at all.
  - EstanislaoStan 1y ago
    Why not?
    - herewulf 1y ago
      The American Dream has become living in a McMansion in suburbia?
    - trallnag 1y ago
      Aren't Japanese homes super tiny? Even smaller than the already small homes and apartments in Europe? That's one reason. In the US, it seems that people live in bigger places, with higher ceilings.
  - kiba 1y ago
    Most homes in Japan aren't built in the traditional Japanese style at all IIRC.
    - sadeshmukh 1y ago
      I was referring to the little space and tiny storage. Pay isn't exactly great for the rent either.
- MobiusHorizons 1y ago
  My understanding was that Japanese housing costs are only good in USD because the yen is devalued. I had the impression that housing is expensive relative to local wages. Is that not true?
  - andrewmutz 1y ago
    It's not true. Here is an apples-to-apples comparison of the price of residential property between the US and Japan in real (inflation adjusted) terms. https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/QJPR368BIS https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/QJPR368BIS https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/QUSR628BIS https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/QUSR628BIS