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Was about to comment on this but you got right to the point. All of this is because people are lazy to build, let alone maintain, their own damn programs and se
by gethly 1y ago
Was about to comment on this but you got right to the point. All of this is because people are lazy to build, let alone maintain, their own damn programs and servers.
- 2OEH8eoCRo0 1y agoIt's not laziness, it's greed. People want to build and host their own things but that costs money.
- sophacles 1y agoAnd this sentiment of "every company should have to run their own servers and pay 'me' to do that at a higher cost" isn't greed?
- fibers 1y agoIs this even true for such a sensitive subject like email where there are insane blacklists/whitelists everywhere in which you are forced to use a middleman either way so your emails enter someone's inbox?
- hamdingers 1y agoA lot more people and organizations would self-host email if it wasn't a minefield. It's not laziness that Google and Microsoft have effectively decided nobody's allowed to do that.
- op00to 1y agoI was part of a team ran EMail services for a ~15,000 person campus of a ~80,000 person university in the late 90s and early 00s. It was a full-time job for a team of people to keep things running, up to date, control spam, etc. It was a minefield 25 years ago! Literal years before GMail was a thing.
- gjsman-1000 1y agoAlways has been; remember AOL basically reinventing DNS? And always will be.
- mbesto 1y agoYour website provides "paywalled hosting and sales platform for digital content creators" Are digital content creators lazy too? Why don't they just host their content on their own damn servers?
- gethly 1y agoI was obviously not talking about end customers but businesses. In my case, digital content creators should just do that - create digital content. They have no reason to tackle hosting, payments, access rules... as that is not their business. It's mine.
- NetOpWibby 1y agoOOF Do you talk to your customers with that mouth? For those who are lazy to click, this guy's business is hosting and maintaining a sales platform for people.
- overfeed 1y agoWhat's the problem? GP is addressing a market need consistent with their comment above. I wouldn't be surprised by a auto mechanic stating that (too) many people are too lazy to change their oil - they might be the best person to manke that observation, given their PoV.
- gethly 1y agoYes, this guy's business is that. And it is MY business, not my customers'. If you do not understand the nuance of what I am saying, rather keep your thoughts to yourself as you portray yourself in very ignorant light.
- toomuchtodo 1y agoI have more money than time. Take my money to do things I do not have time for. What you call lazy, I call time and capital/cashflow efficient. (cloudflare customer, in both personal and professional capacities; i pay Fastmail to host family email; both can easily be switched if needed to prevent lock in, with DNS changes and in the case of hosted email, an export of mailboxes and tenant config)
- layer8 1y agoWhat GP is effectively saying is that you don’t value independence enough to invest the necessary money and (for personal use) time into self-hosting. And there is a spectrum to this. For example, using a small, independent email or hosting provider may cost a little more time, but makes you more independent from big tech, and maybe more importantly, contributes to reducing the power of big tech. We are all paying for it, down the line.
- toomuchtodo 1y agoThis is a fallacy, as self hosting means you remain at the whims of receiving or interfacing systems. Does you hosting your own email change the concentration of email accounts hosted at Yahoo, Microsoft, and Gmail? It doesn't. Does hosting your own domain or website change Cloudflare's concentration and centralization of internet traffic? It doesn't. You vote with your dollars by picking providers who won't lock you in, you vote with your dollars by picking protocols over platforms that cannot lock you in. Paying Fastmail, along with others who do so, means Fastmail will remain as a non Big Tech option, for example (they also developed and championed, JMAP, for a more efficient user experience). Paying Kagi means Kagi will remain as a non Big Tech option. Donating to Let's Encrypt means Let's Encrypt will remain as a public good independent of Big Tech. I could go down the list of every service I pay for to de-Google and de-Big Tech, but that's likely unhelpful to further demonstrate the point. > We are all paying for it, down the line. Indeed, so establish and fund organizations that provide systems and services for benefit vs profit and control that cannot be captured. Self hosting your own box at home helps you (which is totally fine and reasonable, I run my own on prem infra across two continents at small business enterprise scale for use cases I cannot procure commercially at reasonable cost), but does nothing else, and doesn't scale. (think in systems)
- bakies 1y agorunning email servers is a huge and terrible time sink
- dwedge 1y agoHave you tried it?
- bakies 1y agoyeah I ran one for a while for myself and couldn't peer to any of the major email providers because they dont trust random email servers on the internet
- dwedge 1y agoAs long as you setup spf and dkim, and ideally reverse dns that matches the server mailname, the problems are greatly reduced