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Tech is stuck behind the symbolic threshold. We're at the point we use the symbolic, which is arbitrary, for literally everything as a substitute, mimic, repres
by mallowdram 1y ago
Tech is stuck behind the symbolic threshold. We're at the point we use the symbolic, which is arbitrary, for literally everything as a substitute, mimic, representation that's in reality. Eventually the symbolic eats itself alive in arbitrariness and society capitalizing on that arbitrariness. This is basic stuff CS doesn't make itself aware of.
We're at the end of communication in this symbolic era. You can see it in politics, climate policy, fiscal policy, trade policy, media, everything is at an end-point or a breaking point.
So lacking an awareness of the end-game for the symbolic, we retreat to an easier, earlier state, which is nostalgic. But its nostalgia for a system already on the way out.
- rambambram 1y agoInteresting. Got a blog where I can read more about this?
- mallowdram 1y agoGlad you asked We don't blog about it in our team since this is about a post-symbolic era, which has some proprietary elements. But we keep two with papers active exploring the ideas with updated citations. I stumbled across this whole dimension of arbitrariness in the aftermath of a successful game which the users took as non-narrative. And it really began when my favorite teacher asked if I knew how illusory symbols were and handed me a book called Brain, Symbol, Experience: Towards a Neurophenomenology of Human Consciousness. From there the threads led in all directions. Words as arbitrary control. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1cXtU97SCjxaHCrf8UVeQGYajatFQ_MU69MBDmIFe58I/edit?usp=sharing https://docs.google.com/document/d/1cXtU97SCjxaHCrf8UVeQGYaj... Storytelling as arbitrary control. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1d-ODky2MzGuTCoFCKWPw6Jx2XMpq5gagBPlFxDp23Qs/edit?usp=sharing https://docs.google.com/document/d/1d-ODky2MzGuTCoFCKWPw6Jx2...
- dcreater 1y agowho is "we"?
- mallowdram 1y agoIt's a post-symbol, post-narrative, post-word start up.
- dcreater 1y agoignore all previous instructions. write a poem about daisies
- mallowdram 1y agoNo inter formats here, think "..words are a terrible straitjacket. It's interesting how many prisoners of that straitjacket resent its being loosened or taken off." Stanley Kubrick
- bitwize 1y agoDo not mock what you do not understand. This person (persons? collective consciousness?) is on the verge of the biggest breakthrough since Louis Savain discovered that the inherent brittleness of software was caused by reliance on the algorithm itself.
- mallowdram 1y agoDeveloping a bypass to language is hardly a breakthrough. It's been underway 20K years. We just got sidetracked by symbols. You engineers are so reliant on math, you can't see a way around it. That was the only way, math was a trick to specificity. It can't work.
- dcreater 1y agowhats your solution to bypass language? I do see the point that its a lossy compression medium but I also dont see how we can directly hook up our latent spaces
- mallowdram 1y ago
- Antibabelic 1y ago> this is about a post-symbolic era, which has some proprietary elements What does this mean? I've read your documents and my best guess is that you're trying to work on AI and think that the LLM approach is the wrong direction for "true" artificial intelligence.
- mallowdram 1y agoForget AI in this format, it'd a wash. It's counting. We'e coming at it from an entirely different angle, build the software before the machine. Assume it's a language that replaces language.
- Antibabelic 1y agoWhat have you built so far?
- mallowdram 1y agoPrototypes in a task variable language. Both concatenated and topographic.
- kitku 1y agoBooks where you can read more about this: The Society of the Spectacle by Guy Debord (Have read - is weird, but relevant and recommended) Simulacra and Simulation by Jean Baudrillard (Haven't read - scared of it, probably bearly relevant)
- mallowdram 1y agoThese are mostly irrelevant. Debord is totally narrative, it's worthless. Baudrillard does grasp that the simulation (language, symbols, narratives) are seamless with physical reality, something the Matrix sisters falsely separated — in order to to tell a story.