5 ms·

Is it a cultural thing? Computers and copyright are fairly recent innovations in some parts of Europe such as Spain and Italy. Certainly well into the 90s you c

Is it a cultural thing? Computers and copyright are fairly recent innovations in some parts of Europe such as Spain and Italy. Certainly well into the 90s you could still buy pirated media, especially video games, from every mom and pop store.

amarcheschi 1y ago
At least in italy is more of a "people with economic interest in football are also in politics and thus are able to shape policies for their profit"
ioteg 1y ago
Computers and copyright are fairly recent in Spain and Italy? This is astonishingly ignorant, if not simple ragebait.
- anthk 1y ago
  Ah, yes, the ZX Spectrum arcade games and text adventures from the 80's in Spain, 'fairly recent'. https://base.speccy.org/ProyectoBASE_Historia.html https://base.speccy.org/ProyectoBASE_Historia.html The parent comment confuses Spain and Italy as if they were the same... as if Spain didn't had French and UK influences from the North at all since the 1600's and before... yeah sure. Spain had and has picaresca as the Italians, of course... but we aren't 100% the same and it shows off. We used to buy legal games in the 80's because the prices plumetted down because of the piracy, and between the shaddy game loaders and having to wait 15 minutes per load, everyone wanted at least to buy one or two original games in order to play something without losing literal hours trying to tweak the casette player. Italy in the meanwhile just resold foreing games as if they were local. Some Spaniards did the same too; but it had small powerhouses as Aventuras AD, Erbe Software and such, not just a few by any means.
- qingcharles 1y ago
  I probably could have worded it clearer. I meant computers + copyright. As in there was no copyright on computer software.
  - AshamedCaptain 1y ago
    It is not just bad wording. This is still a questionable remark that smells of wrong assumptions about southern EU (and thus gets people irritated).
  - tecleandor 1y ago
    Still false. There were already police raids for 'pirate' games in the 80s. Example, July 1986 [0]: "Nine Madrid university students involved in a thriving pirated video game business" -- 0: https://www.abc.es/archivo/periodicos/abc-sevilla-19860718-40.html
tecleandor 1y ago
Fairly recent innovations? Lol.
- anthk 1y ago
  The Jupiter ACE manuals in Spanish must had to came from another dimension. The same with the books for the ZX Spectrum in Spanish and such. And banks and big corporations owning IBM PC's, yeah, sure, there was no software in Spanish in the 80's, sure... Even my elementary school had DOS PC's with 5,25 floppies with Spanish and Basque translated games, even Logo... that in mid 90's. On Copyright... I'm pretty sure Spain was bound to the Berna convention. And, on piracy, in the 80's (in Spanish, your browser can translate it): https://www.retrogameshistory.com/2021/03/la-pirateria-espanola-en-los-80-y-el.html https://www.retrogameshistory.com/2021/03/la-pirateria-espan...
- qingcharles 1y ago
  My bad, bad wording :) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45327046 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45327046
EbNar 1y ago
> Computers and copyright are fairly recent innovations in some parts of Europe such as Spain and Italy LOL, what did you smoke, man?
- qingcharles 1y ago
  My bad, bad wording :) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45327046 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45327046
anthk 1y ago
Man, Spanioards bought LEGAL ZX Spectrum games on book stores and such in the 80's as a solution for the rampant piracy. The companies themselves pushed down the prices for convenience.
edgineer 1y ago
I'm interested in hearing more about the evolution of copyright law wrt computer media in Spain. I see an article from 2001 describing how compiled software was not copyrightable in Spain at that time. [0] From [1] I see that individual file sharing, except for software, is allowed there. Having seen how Sweden changed their copyright law in response to the Pirate Bay website [2], I wish everyone knew that it wasn't always this way, and that states maintain their own rules. The idea that "no one shall copy any corporation's media, ever" is a recent propaganda success. [0] https://www.mondaq.com/copyright/14472/technology-protection-in-spain https://www.mondaq.com/copyright/14472/technology-protection... [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_aspects_of_file_sharing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_aspects_of_file_sharing [2] http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/7978853.stm http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/7978853.stm
- AshamedCaptain 1y ago
  > I see an article from 2001 describing how compiled software was not copyrightable in Spain at that time Compiled software is not copyrightable in any country that I know of. Compilation is not an original creative process. The original software is copyrightable, and compiling it creates a (protected) derived work of it. > I see that individual file sharing, except for software, is allowed there. The Pirate Bay is censored in Spain as much as it is on France.

amarcheschi 1y ago

At least in italy is more of a "people with economic interest in football are also in politics and thus are able to shape policies for their profit"

ioteg 1y ago

Computers and copyright are fairly recent in Spain and Italy? This is astonishingly ignorant, if not simple ragebait.

anthk 1y ago
Ah, yes, the ZX Spectrum arcade games and text adventures from the 80's in Spain, 'fairly recent'. https://base.speccy.org/ProyectoBASE_Historia.html https://base.speccy.org/ProyectoBASE_Historia.html The parent comment confuses Spain and Italy as if they were the same... as if Spain didn't had French and UK influences from the North at all since the 1600's and before... yeah sure. Spain had and has picaresca as the Italians, of course... but we aren't 100% the same and it shows off. We used to buy legal games in the 80's because the prices plumetted down because of the piracy, and between the shaddy game loaders and having to wait 15 minutes per load, everyone wanted at least to buy one or two original games in order to play something without losing literal hours trying to tweak the casette player. Italy in the meanwhile just resold foreing games as if they were local. Some Spaniards did the same too; but it had small powerhouses as Aventuras AD, Erbe Software and such, not just a few by any means.
qingcharles 1y ago
I probably could have worded it clearer. I meant computers + copyright. As in there was no copyright on computer software.
- AshamedCaptain 1y ago
  It is not just bad wording. This is still a questionable remark that smells of wrong assumptions about southern EU (and thus gets people irritated).
- tecleandor 1y ago
  Still false. There were already police raids for 'pirate' games in the 80s. Example, July 1986 [0]: "Nine Madrid university students involved in a thriving pirated video game business" -- 0: https://www.abc.es/archivo/periodicos/abc-sevilla-19860718-40.html

tecleandor 1y ago

Fairly recent innovations? Lol.

anthk 1y ago
The Jupiter ACE manuals in Spanish must had to came from another dimension. The same with the books for the ZX Spectrum in Spanish and such. And banks and big corporations owning IBM PC's, yeah, sure, there was no software in Spanish in the 80's, sure... Even my elementary school had DOS PC's with 5,25 floppies with Spanish and Basque translated games, even Logo... that in mid 90's. On Copyright... I'm pretty sure Spain was bound to the Berna convention. And, on piracy, in the 80's (in Spanish, your browser can translate it): https://www.retrogameshistory.com/2021/03/la-pirateria-espanola-en-los-80-y-el.html https://www.retrogameshistory.com/2021/03/la-pirateria-espan...
qingcharles 1y ago
My bad, bad wording :) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45327046 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45327046

EbNar 1y ago

> Computers and copyright are fairly recent innovations in some parts of Europe such as Spain and Italy LOL, what did you smoke, man?

qingcharles 1y ago
My bad, bad wording :) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45327046 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45327046

anthk 1y ago

Man, Spanioards bought LEGAL ZX Spectrum games on book stores and such in the 80's as a solution for the rampant piracy. The companies themselves pushed down the prices for convenience.

edgineer 1y ago

I'm interested in hearing more about the evolution of copyright law wrt computer media in Spain. I see an article from 2001 describing how compiled software was not copyrightable in Spain at that time. [0] From [1] I see that individual file sharing, except for software, is allowed there. Having seen how Sweden changed their copyright law in response to the Pirate Bay website [2], I wish everyone knew that it wasn't always this way, and that states maintain their own rules. The idea that "no one shall copy any corporation's media, ever" is a recent propaganda success. [0] https://www.mondaq.com/copyright/14472/technology-protection-in-spain https://www.mondaq.com/copyright/14472/technology-protection... [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_aspects_of_file_sharing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_aspects_of_file_sharing [2] http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/7978853.stm http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/7978853.stm

AshamedCaptain 1y ago
> I see an article from 2001 describing how compiled software was not copyrightable in Spain at that time Compiled software is not copyrightable in any country that I know of. Compilation is not an original creative process. The original software is copyrightable, and compiling it creates a (protected) derived work of it. > I see that individual file sharing, except for software, is allowed there. The Pirate Bay is censored in Spain as much as it is on France.