4 ms·

I was unemployed for 14 months in 2023/2024. It definitely hit my self-esteem, as well as 401(k). I ended up taking a job with Microsoft, but it was a poor fi

I was unemployed for 14 months in 2023/2024. It definitely hit my self-esteem, as well as 401(k). I ended up taking a job with Microsoft, but it was a poor fit because I hate the company as well as the product area I was in. As soon as I could I found another employer that, while not perfect, I'm much happier with.

freetime2 1y ago
I think it's probably not your intent, but this sort of feels like a humble brag. Reason being that 14 months is far short of "over two years", and I think that a job offer from Microsoft is something that a lot of people would be thrilled with.
- windowshopping 1y ago
  It didn't come across to me that way at all, not even a little.
  - melenaboija 1y ago
    Because you might be in a similar situation. Don't know if true and if not might be close, but I recently saw the average compensation at Microsoft is ~200k...
    - CoastalCoder 1y ago
      I was paid closer to $145k while at Microsoft, and the health insurance fory locality kinda sucked (according to my wife, who manages that part of our lives).
    - CoastalCoder 1y ago
      I was paid closer to $145k while at Microsoft, and the health insurance fory locality kinda sucked (according to my wife, who manages that part of our lives). And I didn't stay long enough fory stock grant to vest at all (IIRC).
    - confidantlake 1y ago
      I got lowballed by a certain washington state based company. Was no where close to that number. Edit: was slightly lower than the number the sibling comment mentioned.
- apsurd 1y ago
  I guess I get it, but also the person just answered the question. I'm commenting because I get self-conscious of over sharing. Being asked a direct question and answering it, should be good shouldn't it?
  - freetime2 1y ago
    I don't really agree that they answered the question directly. The OP asks: > Has anyone else been unemployed for over two years? How are you coping? I view the first question as actually being more of a selector trying to narrow down the discussion to people who are in the same boat and are currently unemployed for 2+ years. So not applicable to the parent. And they don't even attempt to answer the second question. Of course anyone is free to comment on HN, and discussions in comments frequently go off topic. And I do think that 14 months is a long enough time to be able to empathize with with the OP is going through. But I guess what I personally would like to have seen is some acknowledgement that "I know the question was directed at people who are unemployed for 2+ years, but..." and trying to answer the OPs question of how to cope. And also some acknowledgement that a job at Microsoft, while maybe not a good fit for the parent, is actually quite a privilege.
- Aurornis 1y ago
  It's relevant even if not a perfect match. Discouraging people from posting positive anecdotes is not the goal, either. If anything, positive stories are very valuable in threads like this.
- CoastalCoder 1y ago
  I appreciate the feedback. I often fail to anticipate how my words will be heard until it's too late. FWIW, the main points I was trying to convey are: 1) Even 14 months was really hard me. 2) Only because I had a 401(k) to tap did I avoid disaster. 3) Even after long unemployment there can, in some cases, be a path back to a reasonable career.
martin-t 1y ago
And this is how corrupt abusive companies can keep thriving. People will tell you "vote with your feet" from their high horse but it just doesn't work. These companies will always find somebody else to fill that role. The person needs the job more than the company does. EDIT: Oh, wow, so much disagreement. 30 minutes, 3 downvotes, 0 comments. So tell me _where_ I am wrong.
- nosefurhairdo 1y ago
  Microsoft is not an abusive employer. Most people today or at any point in human history would envy the typical Microsoft job. Pretty much all large tech companies are similar in this respect. If your employer is actually abusing you in some way you should contact a lawyer. If you simply have a distaste for your employer you should seek alternative employment. The defeatist "all corps are evil" mentality will not do you any good.
  - martin-t 1y ago
    I didn't say it's an abusive employer but an abusive company. It always fought against open source. Embrace, extend, extinguish. It always stifled innovation. Internet Explorer 6. And now, it bought GitHub and then plagiarized all public and private projects hosted on it. GPL cannot exist in a world where you can build a statistical model of the code and mechanically reproduce its functionality while somehow losing the GPL licensing in the process. Also, calling it "defeatist" has no base in what I wrote. I didn't even write anything about corporations. Abuse has a much simpler description - using a power differential to benefit yourself at other people's expense.
    - nosefurhairdo 1y ago
      > I didn't say it's an abusive employer but an abusive company. A confusing distinction to make in a thread about employment. > It always fought against open source. They've since admitted this was a mistake, and in 2020 were cited as the single largest contributor to open source projects: https://www.theverge.com/2020/5/18/21262103/microsoft-open-source-linux-history-wrong-statement https://www.theverge.com/2020/5/18/21262103/microsoft-open-s... > And now, it bought GitHub and then plagiarized all public and private projects hosted on it. This is news to me. Are you claiming Microsoft/GitHub used or sold private source code for training LLMs?

freetime2 1y ago

I think it's probably not your intent, but this sort of feels like a humble brag. Reason being that 14 months is far short of "over two years", and I think that a job offer from Microsoft is something that a lot of people would be thrilled with.

windowshopping 1y ago
It didn't come across to me that way at all, not even a little.
- melenaboija 1y ago
  Because you might be in a similar situation. Don't know if true and if not might be close, but I recently saw the average compensation at Microsoft is ~200k...
  - CoastalCoder 1y ago
    I was paid closer to $145k while at Microsoft, and the health insurance fory locality kinda sucked (according to my wife, who manages that part of our lives).
  - CoastalCoder 1y ago
    I was paid closer to $145k while at Microsoft, and the health insurance fory locality kinda sucked (according to my wife, who manages that part of our lives). And I didn't stay long enough fory stock grant to vest at all (IIRC).
  - confidantlake 1y ago
    I got lowballed by a certain washington state based company. Was no where close to that number. Edit: was slightly lower than the number the sibling comment mentioned.
apsurd 1y ago
I guess I get it, but also the person just answered the question. I'm commenting because I get self-conscious of over sharing. Being asked a direct question and answering it, should be good shouldn't it?
- freetime2 1y ago
  I don't really agree that they answered the question directly. The OP asks: > Has anyone else been unemployed for over two years? How are you coping? I view the first question as actually being more of a selector trying to narrow down the discussion to people who are in the same boat and are currently unemployed for 2+ years. So not applicable to the parent. And they don't even attempt to answer the second question. Of course anyone is free to comment on HN, and discussions in comments frequently go off topic. And I do think that 14 months is a long enough time to be able to empathize with with the OP is going through. But I guess what I personally would like to have seen is some acknowledgement that "I know the question was directed at people who are unemployed for 2+ years, but..." and trying to answer the OPs question of how to cope. And also some acknowledgement that a job at Microsoft, while maybe not a good fit for the parent, is actually quite a privilege.
Aurornis 1y ago
It's relevant even if not a perfect match. Discouraging people from posting positive anecdotes is not the goal, either. If anything, positive stories are very valuable in threads like this.
CoastalCoder 1y ago
I appreciate the feedback. I often fail to anticipate how my words will be heard until it's too late. FWIW, the main points I was trying to convey are: 1) Even 14 months was really hard me. 2) Only because I had a 401(k) to tap did I avoid disaster. 3) Even after long unemployment there can, in some cases, be a path back to a reasonable career.

martin-t 1y ago

And this is how corrupt abusive companies can keep thriving. People will tell you "vote with your feet" from their high horse but it just doesn't work. These companies will always find somebody else to fill that role. The person needs the job more than the company does. EDIT: Oh, wow, so much disagreement. 30 minutes, 3 downvotes, 0 comments. So tell me _where_ I am wrong.

nosefurhairdo 1y ago
Microsoft is not an abusive employer. Most people today or at any point in human history would envy the typical Microsoft job. Pretty much all large tech companies are similar in this respect. If your employer is actually abusing you in some way you should contact a lawyer. If you simply have a distaste for your employer you should seek alternative employment. The defeatist "all corps are evil" mentality will not do you any good.
- martin-t 1y ago
  I didn't say it's an abusive employer but an abusive company. It always fought against open source. Embrace, extend, extinguish. It always stifled innovation. Internet Explorer 6. And now, it bought GitHub and then plagiarized all public and private projects hosted on it. GPL cannot exist in a world where you can build a statistical model of the code and mechanically reproduce its functionality while somehow losing the GPL licensing in the process. Also, calling it "defeatist" has no base in what I wrote. I didn't even write anything about corporations. Abuse has a much simpler description - using a power differential to benefit yourself at other people's expense.
  - nosefurhairdo 1y ago
    > I didn't say it's an abusive employer but an abusive company. A confusing distinction to make in a thread about employment. > It always fought against open source. They've since admitted this was a mistake, and in 2020 were cited as the single largest contributor to open source projects: https://www.theverge.com/2020/5/18/21262103/microsoft-open-source-linux-history-wrong-statement https://www.theverge.com/2020/5/18/21262103/microsoft-open-s... > And now, it bought GitHub and then plagiarized all public and private projects hosted on it. This is news to me. Are you claiming Microsoft/GitHub used or sold private source code for training LLMs?