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I'm afraid that by saying "My priorities are God, Family, Health" that you are just punting. You fall back on that when in every measurable way your life isn't

I'm afraid that by saying "My priorities are God, Family, Health" that you are just punting. You fall back on that when in every measurable way your life isn't what you hoped it would be so as a coping mechanism you redefine your values to measureless standards. You "value" your family. What does that mean? You spent one hour pushing your kid on a swing because you realized you don't have the confidence, discipline, or perseverance to do the things you really want to be doing. You "value" your family because you hate yourself, but you don't have the confidence to admit it. IOW, you live your life however you want to and when you feel like it you just move the goalposts to make sure you look successful. Depressed people are the ones with the integrity not to move the goalposts.

the_cat_kittles 14y ago
I'm not sure what your trying to get at, but for the sake of argument- wouldn't it be wise to move the goalposts if it means you aren't depressed?
- hermannj314 14y ago
  I'm not talking about clinical depression. But let's say the general, "I didn't get the promotion" style of depression. For me, you can view that problem two ways, "I'm going to work harder and prove my value to the company" or the move the goalposts approach, "I really didn't want that promotion anyway, I'll spend more time with my kids! No one will judge me as a failure if I do that." Shifting priorities can be rational if you honestly realize your tastes and interests have changed over time, but most often it seems shifting priorties are just a manifestation of weakness - a decision to flee rather than fight.
  - AlisdairO 14y ago
    > For me, you can view that problem two ways, "I'm going to work harder and prove my value to the company" Surely that might also be a realisation that the promotion you wanted takes more effort than you're willing to put in to it?
  - batista 14y ago
    >For me, you can view that problem two ways, "I'm going to work harder and prove my value to the company" or the move the goalposts approach, "I really didn't want that promotion anyway, I'll spend more time with my kids! No one will judge me as a failure if I do that." The idiocy of the comment is that "not getting that promotion" is not a failure anyway.
  - bdunn 14y ago
    Hang out around enough old people, and you'll realize the overwhelming majority of them would have preferred more time with their kids to that promotion.
    - robryan 14y ago
      Retrospectively. For some what they would have liked to do more of looking back and what they wanted to do at the time may be different. As we live in the present, the question really is what we would like to be doing now, not what we would liked to have done looking back.
benjaminwootton 14y ago
What a cynical view of the world. I value my career and achievements but I'd swap it in a second for my immediate family. It's nothing to do with depression, fear, or failing - it's absolutely the way it should be.
AlisdairO 14y ago
> You "value" your family. What does that mean? You spent one hour pushing your kid on a swing because you realized you don't have the confidence, discipline, or perseverance to do the things you really want to be doing. What if what you really want to be doing is being with and enjoying your family?
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]
tluyben2 14y ago
I think the comments here on your reaction are interesting; most people with careers (especially on HN) are working 24/7 to be able to spend, for instance, time with their family in the future (which, if you are an entrepreneur, statistically, is not likely to happen soon). And yet the responses here are saying that if you think family is important, you would let other things drop. There definitely are people who value family over all, and I know quite a few of them (my sister being one), but she is not on HN on a sunday. Neither does she value the amassing of money as something important in life. Reading most of HN shows that most people here do, no matter what (outside of killing others (at least openly; killing in China in factories is fine until the press finds out); killing yourself is acceptable risk). So i'm not sure how everyone is so '4 hour workweek' in their comments; you can be with your family and you don't need millions to do that. If you really want that, there is no reason you are not doing it right now. I think if you have passion for something and you are postponing that for 'something something pot of gold', you don't really consider it that valuable. Something for instance you quite often read in forums and such; 'I want to be with my family most, but I live in a city so I have this and that $$$$ costs per month minimum which is preventing me, in this economic climate to be with my family.' That's of course crap; move. There are tons of places in the world you can live of $500-600 / month and be happy with your family. But no there are a million excuses why 'thats not possible'. So you don't really want to be with your family that much, then, you have other goals topping that which you are trying to hide/disguise for yourself because you sound like a dick admitting that? You can exchange 'family' with any passion. I have a friend who's biggest dream in life is to be a musician. But he comes up with 1000s of reasons why it cannot happen now. For the last 15 years mind you...
Volpe 14y ago
Aren't people who say they "don't" value family just shifting the goal posts to an easy tangible goal? Given you are the product of a family (and, given your presence on HN, you were born into privilege). Have some respect for people who want to do well at raising a family. Depressed people have different brain chemistry than non-depressed people. It's unrelated to integrity, or goals. (Except for where the two effect brain chemistry, which is very little). Science FTW!
bpatrianakos 14y ago
I love this. Its very bleak but it's true. In reading all these comments I really like how they are at very opposite ends of the spectrum and all true all at once.

the_cat_kittles 14y ago

I'm not sure what your trying to get at, but for the sake of argument- wouldn't it be wise to move the goalposts if it means you aren't depressed?

hermannj314 14y ago
I'm not talking about clinical depression. But let's say the general, "I didn't get the promotion" style of depression. For me, you can view that problem two ways, "I'm going to work harder and prove my value to the company" or the move the goalposts approach, "I really didn't want that promotion anyway, I'll spend more time with my kids! No one will judge me as a failure if I do that." Shifting priorities can be rational if you honestly realize your tastes and interests have changed over time, but most often it seems shifting priorties are just a manifestation of weakness - a decision to flee rather than fight.
- AlisdairO 14y ago
  > For me, you can view that problem two ways, "I'm going to work harder and prove my value to the company" Surely that might also be a realisation that the promotion you wanted takes more effort than you're willing to put in to it?
- batista 14y ago
  >For me, you can view that problem two ways, "I'm going to work harder and prove my value to the company" or the move the goalposts approach, "I really didn't want that promotion anyway, I'll spend more time with my kids! No one will judge me as a failure if I do that." The idiocy of the comment is that "not getting that promotion" is not a failure anyway.
- bdunn 14y ago
  Hang out around enough old people, and you'll realize the overwhelming majority of them would have preferred more time with their kids to that promotion.
  - robryan 14y ago
    Retrospectively. For some what they would have liked to do more of looking back and what they wanted to do at the time may be different. As we live in the present, the question really is what we would like to be doing now, not what we would liked to have done looking back.

benjaminwootton 14y ago

What a cynical view of the world. I value my career and achievements but I'd swap it in a second for my immediate family. It's nothing to do with depression, fear, or failing - it's absolutely the way it should be.

AlisdairO 14y ago

> You "value" your family. What does that mean? You spent one hour pushing your kid on a swing because you realized you don't have the confidence, discipline, or perseverance to do the things you really want to be doing. What if what you really want to be doing is being with and enjoying your family?

deleted 14y ago

[deleted]

tluyben2 14y ago

I think the comments here on your reaction are interesting; most people with careers (especially on HN) are working 24/7 to be able to spend, for instance, time with their family in the future (which, if you are an entrepreneur, statistically, is not likely to happen soon). And yet the responses here are saying that if you think family is important, you would let other things drop. There definitely are people who value family over all, and I know quite a few of them (my sister being one), but she is not on HN on a sunday. Neither does she value the amassing of money as something important in life. Reading most of HN shows that most people here do, no matter what (outside of killing others (at least openly; killing in China in factories is fine until the press finds out); killing yourself is acceptable risk). So i'm not sure how everyone is so '4 hour workweek' in their comments; you can be with your family and you don't need millions to do that. If you really want that, there is no reason you are not doing it right now. I think if you have passion for something and you are postponing that for 'something something pot of gold', you don't really consider it that valuable. Something for instance you quite often read in forums and such; 'I want to be with my family most, but I live in a city so I have this and that $$$$ costs per month minimum which is preventing me, in this economic climate to be with my family.' That's of course crap; move. There are tons of places in the world you can live of $500-600 / month and be happy with your family. But no there are a million excuses why 'thats not possible'. So you don't really want to be with your family that much, then, you have other goals topping that which you are trying to hide/disguise for yourself because you sound like a dick admitting that? You can exchange 'family' with any passion. I have a friend who's biggest dream in life is to be a musician. But he comes up with 1000s of reasons why it cannot happen now. For the last 15 years mind you...

Volpe 14y ago

Aren't people who say they "don't" value family just shifting the goal posts to an easy tangible goal? Given you are the product of a family (and, given your presence on HN, you were born into privilege). Have some respect for people who want to do well at raising a family. Depressed people have different brain chemistry than non-depressed people. It's unrelated to integrity, or goals. (Except for where the two effect brain chemistry, which is very little). Science FTW!

bpatrianakos 14y ago

I love this. Its very bleak but it's true. In reading all these comments I really like how they are at very opposite ends of the spectrum and all true all at once.