4 ms·

It's not undemocratic. The behavior of the parliament reflects the reality that only a tiny minority of the population care at all about this issue. One might

It's not undemocratic. The behavior of the parliament reflects the reality that only a tiny minority of the population care at all about this issue. One might be tempted to blame a lack of media attention, but I don't think that's it. For example in the US, the Snowden revelations attracted tons and tons of media attention, yet it never became a major topic in elections, as far as I'm aware. No politician's career was ended over it, and neither did new politicians rise based on a platform of privacy-awareness. No one talks about mass surveillance today. No one cares. There is no reason to believe that the situation is different in Europe.

robertlagrant 1y ago
> The behavior of the parliament reflects the reality that only a tiny minority of the population care at all about this issue Then it's not very democratic to change it.
bondarchuk 1y ago
Parliamentary democracy just fundamentally has a weakness when it comes to single-issue voting. After picking a party to vote on based on housing, economic policy, crime, ..., how much voting power so to say is left for.. which guy the party says they'll send to the european commission? And what that guy's stance on chat-control is? If they're even publicizing that...
- account42 1y ago
  Not to mention that once voted in they are not bound by their campaign promises.
  - tracker1 1y ago
    It can sometimes happen... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contract_with_America https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contract_with_America
- Ntrails 1y ago
  > how much voting power so to say is left for.. which guy the party says they'll send to the european commission? Short of a direct (referendum based) democracy how do you resolve that?
  - gpm 1y ago
    In principle https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liquid_democracy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liquid_democracy is an interesting idea to address this sort of issue.
  - recursivecaveat 1y ago
    More expressive voting systems help. If your vote has meaning when cast for something other than 1 of 2 platforms it can encode more of your preferences. Referendums are also not the only variety of direct democracy, you can have sortition.
- tracker1 1y ago
  How many people participate in party candidate selection at all... it's a mixed bag to "primary" out an incumbent... sometimes it's easy as they don't see it coming or a threat... others the entrenchment goes deep.
- ookdatnog 1y ago
  I think the primary positive feature of democracy is simply that we have regular peaceful transitions of power. I'm not sure that the fact that the people choose their own leaders by itself leads to higher quality leadership, or even leadership that cares more about said people. But the fact that the baton passes every couple of years is absolutely invaluable.

robertlagrant 1y ago

> The behavior of the parliament reflects the reality that only a tiny minority of the population care at all about this issue Then it's not very democratic to change it.

bondarchuk 1y ago

Parliamentary democracy just fundamentally has a weakness when it comes to single-issue voting. After picking a party to vote on based on housing, economic policy, crime, ..., how much voting power so to say is left for.. which guy the party says they'll send to the european commission? And what that guy's stance on chat-control is? If they're even publicizing that...

account42 1y ago
Not to mention that once voted in they are not bound by their campaign promises.
- tracker1 1y ago
  It can sometimes happen... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contract_with_America https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contract_with_America
Ntrails 1y ago
> how much voting power so to say is left for.. which guy the party says they'll send to the european commission? Short of a direct (referendum based) democracy how do you resolve that?
- gpm 1y ago
  In principle https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liquid_democracy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liquid_democracy is an interesting idea to address this sort of issue.
- recursivecaveat 1y ago
  More expressive voting systems help. If your vote has meaning when cast for something other than 1 of 2 platforms it can encode more of your preferences. Referendums are also not the only variety of direct democracy, you can have sortition.
tracker1 1y ago
How many people participate in party candidate selection at all... it's a mixed bag to "primary" out an incumbent... sometimes it's easy as they don't see it coming or a threat... others the entrenchment goes deep.
ookdatnog 1y ago
I think the primary positive feature of democracy is simply that we have regular peaceful transitions of power. I'm not sure that the fact that the people choose their own leaders by itself leads to higher quality leadership, or even leadership that cares more about said people. But the fact that the baton passes every couple of years is absolutely invaluable.