5 ms·

Seeing the number of flagged comments, and going from past discussions where any discussion seen as pushback was flagged, this discussion really doesn't belong

Seeing the number of flagged comments, and going from past discussions where any discussion seen as pushback was flagged, this discussion really doesn't belong on hacker news.

Gud 1y ago
[flagged]
- Ethee 1y ago
  The problem is there obviously isn't any discussion happening. People are so entrenched on one side or the other and that's pretty apparent by this comment section. Everyone wants to virtue signal without taking any responsibility. The unfortunate reality of this situation is that it's extremely complex and weaves in a lot of historical context. But nobody cares about nuance anymore it's all just "killing bad!" within the framework of whatever controversial event is on the inciters mind. Well duh, but how did we get here? If we can't stop and consider both sides constructively then clearly we're never going to get anywhere and shit like this will just continue.
  - xg15 1y ago
    That's essentially the pro-Israel argument for decades (Including the opinion that killing somehow weren't always bad). It hasn't prevented the current situation. But don't let that stop you. Feel free to make a nuanced and well-researched counterargument why the UN report is wrong.
    - Ethee 1y ago
      I'm not sure what you're pointing to in my response to attribute it to Israeli support. I was attempting to make light of the fact that 'discussion' requires two sides. Right now both sides live in a different reality. I am in no way condoning Israel's genocide against Palestinians. But to say Israel is the only one at fault for this situation and to only point fingers to one side betrays the historical facts of the situation. I in no way tried to downplay the situation or play sides so please don't twist my words as if I did.
      - xg15 1y ago
        The problem is that there is a massive power imbalance in the conflict and insisting on "both sides" without acknowledging that is itself muddying the waters. Accusations of "one-sidedness" for everything that doesn't follow the Israeli narrative of the conflict has been a standard defense for decades, last employed against the two-states UN resolution. That's why I find (naive) insistence on seeing "both sides" problematic in this conflict. By all means, do see both sides, but see them with their respective amounts of power and historical context.
        Ethee 1y ago
        I 100% agree with you here. Which is why it's important to have the acknowledgement that this isn't an isolated situation. There is a 'one-sidedness' for Israel against the Palestinians, in the same way that there's a 'one-sidedness' for the entirety of the Arab nations against the Israeli's. For as long as Israel has existed they've been fighting against their own genocide. I haven't seen anyone acknowledging that? Or that the Arab nations were the ones to provoke the Israeli's in the first place? I find no love for Israel, but we make it waaaay too easy for them to justify these positions. Like it or not it's not as simple as everyone seems to make it out to be. The western nations and the other Arabs were the ones to give up on the Palestinians first, but now all of a sudden we care? Like I said, it's all virtue signaling.
        jedimind 1y ago
        > For as long as Israel has existed they've been fighting against their own genocide. I haven't seen anyone acknowledging that? Or that the Arab nations were the ones to provoke the Israeli's in the first place? It was so obvious that you were trying to carefully push Zionist propaganda from the very start, but here you went from 0 to 100% hasbara real quick. This isn't 1990, you won't get away with this kind of blatant Zionist revisionism; there are about 10000+ academic articles and videos now that teach the history in painful detail. So give it a rest with your lazy propaganda. [1] https://web.archive.org/web/20231029055310/ojp.gov/ncjrs/virtual-library/abstracts/jewish-zionist-terrorism-and-establishment-israel https://web.archive.org/web/20231029055310/ojp.gov/ncjrs/vir...
- dotancohen 1y ago
  [flagged]
  - nemomarx 1y ago
    As far as I understand, they've made many offers to release the hostages in exchange for their own people or for other concessions. You can track the negotiations pretty well, although occasionally the diplomats get bombed for some reason.
    - dotancohen 1y ago
      Diplomats - who don't even live in the strip - were recently (unsuccessfully) bombed. If Hamas wants to end the war (or supposed genocide) then they can release the hostages with no additional demands. The fact that the supposed genocide victims choose to continue the war is quite the sign that this is not genocide, in what other situation would a victim choose to continue a war that is a genocide against his people?
      - lentil_soup 1y ago
        The victims are the 60k+ dead people (including children), stop confusing things, you know this. No one here is defending Hamas
        dotancohen 1y ago
        > The victims are the 60k+ dead people (including children), stop confusing things, you know this. Agreed. And Hamas are responsible for igniting this war. And Hamas are responsible for not ending it by returning the hostages.
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
  - aqme28 1y ago
    They've offered! Israel's government is demonstrably not interested in the hostages.
runarberg 1y ago
The infrastructure for genocide needs a lot of technology and technology related subject. The victims of genocides include technology workers, hobbyists and hackers. No doubt there are HN members who are current victims of the ongoing genocide. They deserve our sympathy and their existence needs to be acknowledged.
- ethics13 1y ago
  The mental gymnastics to make this stick is truly incredible.
slt2021 1y ago
[flagged]
- _DeadFred_ 1y ago
  When peoples' comments are flagged to invisibility, there isn't discussion occuring. When people aren't willing to post, discussion isn't occurring.
bix6 1y ago
Technology enables so many of these problems and yet the technology builders want to flag it off the face of the internet?
- AlecSchueler 1y ago
  Hey stock prices might go down if you're not careful.
  - bix6 1y ago
    How will I afford my vegetables without my stocks?!?
GeoAtreides 1y ago
Oh no, people are commenting too hard. Only mild topics on HN, otherwise the servers explode... or something

Seeing the number of flagged comments, and going from past discussions where any discussion seen as pushback was flagged, this discussion really doesn't belong on hacker news.

Gud 1y ago

[flagged]

Ethee 1y ago
The problem is there obviously isn't any discussion happening. People are so entrenched on one side or the other and that's pretty apparent by this comment section. Everyone wants to virtue signal without taking any responsibility. The unfortunate reality of this situation is that it's extremely complex and weaves in a lot of historical context. But nobody cares about nuance anymore it's all just "killing bad!" within the framework of whatever controversial event is on the inciters mind. Well duh, but how did we get here? If we can't stop and consider both sides constructively then clearly we're never going to get anywhere and shit like this will just continue.
- xg15 1y ago
  That's essentially the pro-Israel argument for decades (Including the opinion that killing somehow weren't always bad). It hasn't prevented the current situation. But don't let that stop you. Feel free to make a nuanced and well-researched counterargument why the UN report is wrong.
  - Ethee 1y ago
    I'm not sure what you're pointing to in my response to attribute it to Israeli support. I was attempting to make light of the fact that 'discussion' requires two sides. Right now both sides live in a different reality. I am in no way condoning Israel's genocide against Palestinians. But to say Israel is the only one at fault for this situation and to only point fingers to one side betrays the historical facts of the situation. I in no way tried to downplay the situation or play sides so please don't twist my words as if I did.
    - xg15 1y ago
      The problem is that there is a massive power imbalance in the conflict and insisting on "both sides" without acknowledging that is itself muddying the waters. Accusations of "one-sidedness" for everything that doesn't follow the Israeli narrative of the conflict has been a standard defense for decades, last employed against the two-states UN resolution. That's why I find (naive) insistence on seeing "both sides" problematic in this conflict. By all means, do see both sides, but see them with their respective amounts of power and historical context.
      - Ethee 1y ago
        I 100% agree with you here. Which is why it's important to have the acknowledgement that this isn't an isolated situation. There is a 'one-sidedness' for Israel against the Palestinians, in the same way that there's a 'one-sidedness' for the entirety of the Arab nations against the Israeli's. For as long as Israel has existed they've been fighting against their own genocide. I haven't seen anyone acknowledging that? Or that the Arab nations were the ones to provoke the Israeli's in the first place? I find no love for Israel, but we make it waaaay too easy for them to justify these positions. Like it or not it's not as simple as everyone seems to make it out to be. The western nations and the other Arabs were the ones to give up on the Palestinians first, but now all of a sudden we care? Like I said, it's all virtue signaling.
        jedimind 1y ago
        > For as long as Israel has existed they've been fighting against their own genocide. I haven't seen anyone acknowledging that? Or that the Arab nations were the ones to provoke the Israeli's in the first place? It was so obvious that you were trying to carefully push Zionist propaganda from the very start, but here you went from 0 to 100% hasbara real quick. This isn't 1990, you won't get away with this kind of blatant Zionist revisionism; there are about 10000+ academic articles and videos now that teach the history in painful detail. So give it a rest with your lazy propaganda. [1] https://web.archive.org/web/20231029055310/ojp.gov/ncjrs/virtual-library/abstracts/jewish-zionist-terrorism-and-establishment-israel https://web.archive.org/web/20231029055310/ojp.gov/ncjrs/vir...
dotancohen 1y ago
[flagged]
- nemomarx 1y ago
  As far as I understand, they've made many offers to release the hostages in exchange for their own people or for other concessions. You can track the negotiations pretty well, although occasionally the diplomats get bombed for some reason.
  - dotancohen 1y ago
    Diplomats - who don't even live in the strip - were recently (unsuccessfully) bombed. If Hamas wants to end the war (or supposed genocide) then they can release the hostages with no additional demands. The fact that the supposed genocide victims choose to continue the war is quite the sign that this is not genocide, in what other situation would a victim choose to continue a war that is a genocide against his people?
    - lentil_soup 1y ago
      The victims are the 60k+ dead people (including children), stop confusing things, you know this. No one here is defending Hamas
      - dotancohen 1y ago
        > The victims are the 60k+ dead people (including children), stop confusing things, you know this. Agreed. And Hamas are responsible for igniting this war. And Hamas are responsible for not ending it by returning the hostages.
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
- aqme28 1y ago
  They've offered! Israel's government is demonstrably not interested in the hostages.

runarberg 1y ago

The infrastructure for genocide needs a lot of technology and technology related subject. The victims of genocides include technology workers, hobbyists and hackers. No doubt there are HN members who are current victims of the ongoing genocide. They deserve our sympathy and their existence needs to be acknowledged.

ethics13 1y ago
The mental gymnastics to make this stick is truly incredible.

slt2021 1y ago

[flagged]

_DeadFred_ 1y ago
When peoples' comments are flagged to invisibility, there isn't discussion occuring. When people aren't willing to post, discussion isn't occurring.

bix6 1y ago

Technology enables so many of these problems and yet the technology builders want to flag it off the face of the internet?

AlecSchueler 1y ago
Hey stock prices might go down if you're not careful.
- bix6 1y ago
  How will I afford my vegetables without my stocks?!?

GeoAtreides 1y ago

Oh no, people are commenting too hard. Only mild topics on HN, otherwise the servers explode... or something