4 ms·

I'm not a front end dev and only use JS stuff time to time for small personal project. There is so much JS framework out there that appear and disappear so fas

by Narew 1y ago

I'm not a front end dev and only use JS stuff time to time for small personal project. There is so much JS framework out there that appear and disappear so fast. I don't know if we can call it innovation. I have the impression they just reinvent the wheel with so little value added. I prefer to keep on React at least it will not disappear the next time I will do some change on my project.

uoaei 1y ago
My pet theory is that frontend devs have so little on the critical path, and are usually overqualified for the kind of work they do, that they keep reinventing these interesting paradigms for managing state in GUIs basically just so they can keep themselves entertained.
- whstl 1y ago
  I suspect it’s bimodal. There’s lots of people able to work anywhere on the stack but choose to work on the frontend because they feel super-productive compared to others. They can switch between frameworks and even come up with new ideas. On the other side, there’s way too many frontend engineers that can barely write tests, have extremely little ability with the visual part, have never setup a new project, but are still getting super small things done.
- satellite2 1y ago
  Could it be possible your pet theory is pretty generalisable? My pet theory is that innovation happens when you look at https://xkcd.com/1205/ https://xkcd.com/1205/ and estimates it's not worth it and do it anyway.
- robofanatic 1y ago
  > My pet theory is that frontend devs have so little on the critical path. Given that the frontend is the first thing users interact with, doesn’t that make it one of the most critical parts of the entire product experience?
- meh3749823 1y ago
  You are giving most front end devs way too much credit. Most just use React because that's what they were taught and see it as an end rather than as a means to an end as if it is an accomplishment. Computers have become faster while websites have become slower. You can go on a random webpage and usually see 100s of MBs of memory being used while we had computers in the 90s running 3D games with around 1/100 of that. LLMs have partly become popular because people don't want to enter the current wasteland of web pages who couldn't care less what framework you used and just want to get what they are looking for and to get out. You will see people write things like "powered by React" as if React is doing any thing except running more JS. You are not getting any closer to the CPU or any of your hardware that actually runs your machine. At best some of these front-end devs want to appear as if their job is far more complicated and sophisticated than it is.
  - emulatedmedia 1y ago
    Every software has become slower, not just websites
ixxie 1y ago
It's really hard to be sure, but my pet theory is that frontend tech has been rapidly evolving since it had to solve some real problems that are relatively new at scale: - Work with reactive variables - Combine three different languages - Write modular code - Enable highly response designs The target platform (the web) doesn't natively support all of these things elegantly, and maybe for good reasons. I've got the feeling that frontend frameworks are starting to converge to some consensus on some of these things (e.g. signals), and I hope the next decade will be more stable than the last.
- agos 1y ago
  That is my feeling/hope as well. Modules were a big win, even if the advantage was felt mostly in bundlers and it’s just now arriving in browsers and node. Hopefully signals will be a smoother thing
lopatin 1y ago
grug say ok to react
- modernerd 1y ago
  grug say react make complexity demon more powerful > i blame developers for picking tools whose complexity is inappropriate for the problem they are solving https://x.com/htmx_org/status/1967622941262168495 https://x.com/htmx_org/status/1967622941262168495 > > "mistakenly included a problematic object in its dependency array" https://x.com/htmx_org/status/1967577321940165024 https://x.com/htmx_org/status/1967577321940165024 [both by the author of grugbrain.dev] > react better for job and also some type application, but also you become alcolyte of complexity demon whether you like or no, sorry such is front end life https://grugbrain.dev/ https://grugbrain.dev/
ggregoire 1y ago
> There is so much JS framework out there that appear and disappear so fast. Like which ones?

by Narew 1y ago

uoaei 1y ago

My pet theory is that frontend devs have so little on the critical path, and are usually overqualified for the kind of work they do, that they keep reinventing these interesting paradigms for managing state in GUIs basically just so they can keep themselves entertained.

whstl 1y ago
I suspect it’s bimodal. There’s lots of people able to work anywhere on the stack but choose to work on the frontend because they feel super-productive compared to others. They can switch between frameworks and even come up with new ideas. On the other side, there’s way too many frontend engineers that can barely write tests, have extremely little ability with the visual part, have never setup a new project, but are still getting super small things done.
satellite2 1y ago
Could it be possible your pet theory is pretty generalisable? My pet theory is that innovation happens when you look at https://xkcd.com/1205/ https://xkcd.com/1205/ and estimates it's not worth it and do it anyway.
robofanatic 1y ago
> My pet theory is that frontend devs have so little on the critical path. Given that the frontend is the first thing users interact with, doesn’t that make it one of the most critical parts of the entire product experience?
meh3749823 1y ago
You are giving most front end devs way too much credit. Most just use React because that's what they were taught and see it as an end rather than as a means to an end as if it is an accomplishment. Computers have become faster while websites have become slower. You can go on a random webpage and usually see 100s of MBs of memory being used while we had computers in the 90s running 3D games with around 1/100 of that. LLMs have partly become popular because people don't want to enter the current wasteland of web pages who couldn't care less what framework you used and just want to get what they are looking for and to get out. You will see people write things like "powered by React" as if React is doing any thing except running more JS. You are not getting any closer to the CPU or any of your hardware that actually runs your machine. At best some of these front-end devs want to appear as if their job is far more complicated and sophisticated than it is.
- emulatedmedia 1y ago
  Every software has become slower, not just websites

ixxie 1y ago

It's really hard to be sure, but my pet theory is that frontend tech has been rapidly evolving since it had to solve some real problems that are relatively new at scale: - Work with reactive variables - Combine three different languages - Write modular code - Enable highly response designs The target platform (the web) doesn't natively support all of these things elegantly, and maybe for good reasons. I've got the feeling that frontend frameworks are starting to converge to some consensus on some of these things (e.g. signals), and I hope the next decade will be more stable than the last.

agos 1y ago
That is my feeling/hope as well. Modules were a big win, even if the advantage was felt mostly in bundlers and it’s just now arriving in browsers and node. Hopefully signals will be a smoother thing

lopatin 1y ago

grug say ok to react

modernerd 1y ago
grug say react make complexity demon more powerful > i blame developers for picking tools whose complexity is inappropriate for the problem they are solving https://x.com/htmx_org/status/1967622941262168495 https://x.com/htmx_org/status/1967622941262168495 > > "mistakenly included a problematic object in its dependency array" https://x.com/htmx_org/status/1967577321940165024 https://x.com/htmx_org/status/1967577321940165024 [both by the author of grugbrain.dev] > react better for job and also some type application, but also you become alcolyte of complexity demon whether you like or no, sorry such is front end life https://grugbrain.dev/ https://grugbrain.dev/

ggregoire 1y ago

> There is so much JS framework out there that appear and disappear so fast. Like which ones?