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I’m a long time Apple user. But I never do anything that locks me into Apple in a way that makes me dependent on Apple. I could move to Linux tomorrow and every

I’m a long time Apple user. But I never do anything that locks me into Apple in a way that makes me dependent on Apple. I could move to Linux tomorrow and everything I depend on would be fine. There’s no Apple service I actually need. I think Google and Android is worse in this way. The backup Android I had years ago forced me to login with my Gmail or I couldn’t use it. My old iPhone happily runs without being logged in. I just lose the cloud features. Whatever.

nixosbestos 1y ago
... That's theft protection, and iphones have similar mechanisms. You do not need to sign in, even to a pixel, to use it. Granted you won't get the app store, but you don't get that on iphone either.
petesergeant 1y ago
Doesn’t your hardware lock you in?
- 2muchcoffeeman 1y ago
  What? I can and have accessed everything I need on Linux. If you make sure none of your data is locked in, the hardware is just a computer. Absolute worst case, get a new computer.
- carlosjobim 1y ago
  No. You can always export your files and your passwords etc.
lwhi 1y ago
What are you going to do with all your Mac hardware? Throw it in the bin?
opan 1y ago
I've used my past several Android phones without signing into a Google account or using gapps. I pick something with LineageOS support (usually OnePlus stuff) and get it from eBay, update to latest stock firmware (gets newer baseband and such) then flash LineageOS over it and get my apps from F-Droid.
- 2muchcoffeeman 1y ago
  These, “just change the firmware” comments are silly. I should get basic phone functionality from my phone out of the box with exactly ZERO effort. I can use an iPhone without an Apple account. I cannot use an Android phone without a Google account unless they changed that in the last few years.
  - stonogo 1y ago
    You can, but you don't get access to the app store.
  - keyringlight 1y ago
    The other aspect with setting up third party firmware as a general "don't like the stock OS? then do this" option for many is besides the big headline limitations like safetynet/attestation, it also either involves a benevolent third party setting up and maintaining builds for your device (hope you bought a popular model) and any changes match what you want, or individuals doing so themselves
  - sillyfluke 1y ago
    Both Android and iphones require an account to download apps I believe. Am I mistaken here? Other than that they can be used in the same way without accounts. In fact, with Android an email account suffices and giving your phone number is "opt-in". Apple forces you to give your phone number to create an account last time I checked. Also no F-droid on iphones? But the iphone is the better "phone" experience because there is less bloat and UI nagging.
    - qmr 1y ago
      Android does not require an account to download apps, as grandparent pointed out. I haven't "signed in" to Android phone in 10 years.
      - sillyfluke 1y ago
        This has not been my experience. All the Android phones I've tried have forced me to sign in whenever I've opened the Play Store, it wouldn't let me continue without doing so.
vintagedave 1y ago
That may be true for you but it's not true for many people, like me. I have twenty years of iPhone data, eg messages, apps, etc. I can't easily move to some other phone. A desktop, maybe, but I'd still have to repurchase or find alternates to a bunch of software. It is far, far better if the existing system _stays useful_.
- sillyfluke 1y ago
  >It is far, far better if the existing system _stays useful_ I doubt anyone is arguing the opposite. The point of the parent is that the system staying useful and not turning hostile on your usecase is not under your control or something you can personally prevent, and until that magically changes it's best to structure your use case to be least affected by things not in your control.
- throwaway2037 1y ago
  "twenty years"? Wasn't the iPhone released in 2007?
  - selectodude 1y ago
    I think rounding over 18 years up to 20 is reasonable.

nixosbestos 1y ago

... That's theft protection, and iphones have similar mechanisms. You do not need to sign in, even to a pixel, to use it. Granted you won't get the app store, but you don't get that on iphone either.

petesergeant 1y ago

Doesn’t your hardware lock you in?

2muchcoffeeman 1y ago
What? I can and have accessed everything I need on Linux. If you make sure none of your data is locked in, the hardware is just a computer. Absolute worst case, get a new computer.
carlosjobim 1y ago
No. You can always export your files and your passwords etc.

lwhi 1y ago

What are you going to do with all your Mac hardware? Throw it in the bin?

opan 1y ago

I've used my past several Android phones without signing into a Google account or using gapps. I pick something with LineageOS support (usually OnePlus stuff) and get it from eBay, update to latest stock firmware (gets newer baseband and such) then flash LineageOS over it and get my apps from F-Droid.

2muchcoffeeman 1y ago
These, “just change the firmware” comments are silly. I should get basic phone functionality from my phone out of the box with exactly ZERO effort. I can use an iPhone without an Apple account. I cannot use an Android phone without a Google account unless they changed that in the last few years.
- stonogo 1y ago
  You can, but you don't get access to the app store.
- keyringlight 1y ago
  The other aspect with setting up third party firmware as a general "don't like the stock OS? then do this" option for many is besides the big headline limitations like safetynet/attestation, it also either involves a benevolent third party setting up and maintaining builds for your device (hope you bought a popular model) and any changes match what you want, or individuals doing so themselves
- sillyfluke 1y ago
  Both Android and iphones require an account to download apps I believe. Am I mistaken here? Other than that they can be used in the same way without accounts. In fact, with Android an email account suffices and giving your phone number is "opt-in". Apple forces you to give your phone number to create an account last time I checked. Also no F-droid on iphones? But the iphone is the better "phone" experience because there is less bloat and UI nagging.
  - qmr 1y ago
    Android does not require an account to download apps, as grandparent pointed out. I haven't "signed in" to Android phone in 10 years.
    - sillyfluke 1y ago
      This has not been my experience. All the Android phones I've tried have forced me to sign in whenever I've opened the Play Store, it wouldn't let me continue without doing so.

vintagedave 1y ago

That may be true for you but it's not true for many people, like me. I have twenty years of iPhone data, eg messages, apps, etc. I can't easily move to some other phone. A desktop, maybe, but I'd still have to repurchase or find alternates to a bunch of software. It is far, far better if the existing system _stays useful_.

sillyfluke 1y ago
>It is far, far better if the existing system _stays useful_ I doubt anyone is arguing the opposite. The point of the parent is that the system staying useful and not turning hostile on your usecase is not under your control or something you can personally prevent, and until that magically changes it's best to structure your use case to be least affected by things not in your control.
throwaway2037 1y ago
"twenty years"? Wasn't the iPhone released in 2007?
- selectodude 1y ago
  I think rounding over 18 years up to 20 is reasonable.