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> otherwise they would still be wondering what OpenGL vNext should look like. And the world would have been a better place. All we needed in OpenGL 5 was a thr
by HexDecOctBin 1y ago
> otherwise they would still be wondering what OpenGL vNext should look like.
And the world would have been a better place. All we needed in OpenGL 5 was a thread-safe API with encapsulated state and more work on AZDO and DSA. Now, everyone has to be a driver developer. And new extensions are released one-by-one to make Vulkan just a little more like what OpenGL 5 should have been in the first place. Maybe in 10 more years we'll get there.
- kg 1y agoIMO without SPIR-V, OpenGL 5 would still be at a disadvantage in many scenarios. It's possible we would have gotten widespread support for it even without Vulkan, though.
- HexDecOctBin 1y agoOpenGL supports SPIR-V: https://www.khronos.org/opengl/wiki/SPIR-V https://www.khronos.org/opengl/wiki/SPIR-V
- connicpu 1y agoI can't imagine the world without Vulkan because while it is a lot lower level and more difficult to work with, it makes things like DXVK not only possible but quite performant. Gaming on Linux has been accelerated super strongly by projects like that.
- pjmlp 1y agoGaming on Linux is doing just fine on Android/Linux. The problem is making gaming on GNU/Linux profitable, Vulkan will not fix that, while Proton is not a solution that will work out long term.
- mikestorrent 1y agoNothing is ever going to be profitable on GNU/Linux except for using it to drive SaaS and other such schemes. People that use Linux on the desktop are, on average, much less likely to want to pay for any kind of software; this has been true for 30 years... Steam might change this, we'll see.
- pjmlp 1y agoRelying on Microsoft being happy with Proton isn't a long term strategy, additionally no company management stays around forever.
- connicpu 1y agoIt doesn't matter what Microsoft thinks of Proton, Google v Oracle had a pretty solid outcome > In a 6–2 majority, the Court ruled that Google's use of the Java APIs was within the bounds of fair use, reversing the Federal Circuit Appeals Court ruling and remanding the case for further hearing. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_LLC_v._Oracle_America,_Inc https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_LLC_v._Oracle_America,_...
- pjmlp 1y agoKeep wishing.
- homebrewer 1y agoSure. > Linux Beats Mac Dramatically In Humble Bundle Total Payments https://web.archive.org/web/20150415180723/http://www.thepowerbase.com/2013/03/linux-beats-mac-dramatically-in-humble-bundle-total-payments/ https://web.archive.org/web/20150415180723/http://www.thepow... > Linux users pay 3x that of Windows users for Humble Indie Bundle 3 https://web.archive.org/web/20111130182955/https://www.geek.com/articles/games/linux-users-pay-3x-that-of-windows-users-for-humble-indie-bundle-3-2011082/ https://web.archive.org/web/20111130182955/https://www.geek.... Old links precisely because it happened before or soon after Steam came to Linux.
- connicpu 1y agoAs long as the Steam Deck remains popular, game developers do have an incentive to make sure their games work acceptably under Proton. I don't know why you think this isn't a viable long term strategy, the Win32 ABI is incredibly stable which is exactly what makes wine/proton work so well.
- pjmlp 1y agoZero effort, Valve is the one doing the work. Because apparently Linux folks haven't learnt the OS/2 lesson.
- pjmlp 1y agoI used to be a big OpenGL advocate all the way up to Long Peaks, eventually I came to realise it is another committee driven API, and writing a couple of plugin backends was never that much of a deal. Just see the shading mess as well, with GLSL lagging behind, most devs using HLSL due to its market share, and now Slang, which again was contributed by NVidia. Also the day LunarG loses out their Vulkan sponsorship, the SDK is gone.
- HexDecOctBin 1y agoOh, I agree that OpenGL 3 and 4 were absolute disasters, D3D11 is right there for how to do this mostly correctly, and OpenGL doesn't even stand close by comparison. But by the time 4.5 and 4.6 came out, things were going in the right direction. And then Vulkan killed the momentum. Imagine a OpenGL which takes inspiration from D3D11 and dares to be even more user-friendly and intuitive. Instead, we got Vulkan, yay.
- pjmlp 1y agoSpot on, and then on the Web we get 10 year delay on hardware capabilities, and still no debugging tools after 15 years.
- cyberax 1y agoHard disagree. OpenGL state management was unfixable if it had to keep compatibility with OpenGL 2. That's why OpenGL 3/4 ended up being such huge messes. The main problem with Vulkan is that Apple decided to go with its own Metal API, completely fracturing the graphics space.