4 ms·
We should know by now that all these RTO initiatives are not grounded in any reasonable logistics nor financial reasoning. Right now all of tech is in cut mode,
by johnnyanmac 1y ago
We should know by now that all these RTO initiatives are not grounded in any reasonable logistics nor financial reasoning. Right now all of tech is in cut mode, and RTO's are a great way to do layoffs without calling them layoffs. Note that when Google got "too many" people RTO'ing, they did layoffs anyway.
If your office does try to make things stricter, it's another layoff attempt. I don't think it will work, because at this point we're in a "sticky" job market; those out of work are facing some of the stiffest markets in decades, those in work are holding on for deal life.
- wordofx 1y ago[flagged]
- deejaaymac 1y agoWhen I was a teenager I played World of Warcraft for 5 years. During that time we did "raids" where 40 people have to pay attention and communicate, sometimes for longer than 8 hours, with people from around the globe. If teenagers can do it, adults can do it. Period. And if they can't, skill issue I guess.
- wordofx 1y ago[flagged]
- bingabingabinga 1y ago[flagged]
- mikewarot 1y agoThis assumes productive work in a highly collaborative environment. Meetings aren't usually any of those things. The rest can be done remotely.
- willio58 1y agoLove this example. So damn true
- yahoozoo 1y agoBased example
- JambalayaJimbo 1y agoI’m absolutely shocked that people think this example is a good comparison here. If only our jobs were exactly as stimulating as a video game, and the outcomes didn’t matter at all - then maybe we could use WOW raids as evidence.
- hervature 1y agoWhy does Liquid do the RWF in person then?
- plorkyeran 1y agoMostly because it’s a lot of fun to get in one room and play together. They’ve pretty consistently said that they’re not even sure that it’s a net benefit for winning.
- cwbriscoe 1y agoEvery recent RWF, including the one a couple of weeks ago, they have at least a few people who are still remote.
- skaksjshbz 1y agoBecause they all equally share in the struggle and accomplishment. It’s an actual team not an adult daycare like most jobs.
- Muromec 1y agoCitation needed period
- esseph 1y agoIf you have facts to show the class that haven't already been seen, otherwise...
- tomhow 1y agoYou could express this view without breaking the guidelines or dragging down the standard of discourse here. The guidelines address this specifically: Please don't fulminate. Please don't sneer, including at the rest of the community. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
- johnnyanmac 1y agoI have a more moderate view on RTO elsewhere in this post, so I'm not someone who things WFH is always the best approach. But for now, I have yet to see any study suggest that RTO is more productive across the board all the time.
- aeternum 1y agoThis theory is often-quoted but doesn't make much sense. Big tech including Microsoft already did multiple rounds of layoffs. Why not just do another round?
- yallpendantools 1y agoIf you quit (because of, say, RTO) then you quit. It's a fairly standard deal between you and your employer. If you get laid-off, employer has to give you a severance package for any number of reasons (local labor laws, agreement with the union, corporate PR). This is not a standard deal and is, simply put, more expensive than if the employee just quit of their own accord. In both cases, employer gets the benefit of reduced head count.
- itake 1y agoYes… but they are asking why now? Why did Microsoft start with traditional layoffs and then transition into RTO layoffs years later?
- fastily 1y agoIt’s just another tool in the downsizing toolbox. Also traditional layoffs and RTO “layoffs” don’t have to be mutually exclusive, both can easily occur at the same time
- itake 1y agoyou're still avoiding the question. Why does Microsoft decide RTO "layoffs" are the right tool for 2025, but not 2022-2024? Many companies used both tools at the same time. Why did Microsoft wait until 2025?
- Longlius 1y agoBecause it's politically expedient. They know the political climate is currently hostile to them requesting H1Bs while doing layoffs. RTO lets them get another round of layoffs without calling them layoffs and avoid the bad PR.