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Housing is only 'an investment' of the kind people expect to get fast returns on because of the shortage of housing. Everyone who benefits from that is effectiv

Housing is only 'an investment' of the kind people expect to get fast returns on because of the shortage of housing. Everyone who benefits from that is effectively extracting wealth from the people who are stuck outside of the housing market because of those shortages.

lazide 1y ago
When the line goes up, everyone hopes it keeps going up, and tries to figure out a way to profit from that. One way to stop that, is ensuring the line doesn’t go up. That has some pretty nasty side effects in other ways though. When the line stops or starts to go down, then bad things happen. People can’t sell and move without losing a ton of money. People go bankrupt, etc, etc.
- Jensson 1y ago
  > When the line stops or starts to go down, then bad things happen Only because many millions bought risky investments since they were told it was basically risk free. Normally things getting cheaper is a good thing, but we tricked people into thinking that housing being expensive is good for them.
  - lazide 1y ago
    This is true literally everywhere, in every country (and under every gov’t) I’ve ever seen. And I’ve seen a lot. If you think US property prices are nuts, look in Europe, Asia (especially East Asia), etc. Most people take crazy risks to buy the most/nicest house they can get a loan for because where you live is a huge factor for a number of other things in people’s lives. If people will give them loans for more than they can afford, many people will still do it. So easy credit? Housing market goes up. Tough credit? Housing market goes down. All things considered anyway. Eventually. Owners have a very, very strong incentive to stop it from going down, so unless they have to move, the market can stay locked up for a long time.
altruios 1y ago
'Abolish rent' is a good read. One thing we can do to drive down property prices without driving people out of their homes is to tax the ever-loving-bejebus out of second (or more) Single family homes, for individuals and corporations. Make it progressively worse the more SFM's corporations hold. An example would be to tax a second home and onward at (land tax)^(10nn) where n is the number of total homes you have. The point is to make it financially absurd to own a second home, let alone 20. This is only one particular point on a multi-prong approach. Removing the ability of Private equity to eat up all the local contractors to make a little mini-monopoly is also something that 100% needs to be done. The fastest way to remove 'your home is an investment to be reaped later' mentality is to limit the total sale price based on the last sale price (IE: only increasing the price of actually investment into the property, and legally allowing any sale price far below the estimated property value) which mostly removes all of the incentive of buying a house 'for investment'. That's extreme and would have downstream consequences, we still want to (financially) incentive people to improve their living conditions. It's also extremely hard to build a home! Regulations and zoning laws aside, America lost a fair bit of knowledge after we practically stopped building homes after the 2008 collapse. There's no silver bullet solutions. No company is going to solve the immensely complicated task of building a home in a warehouse to reduce production costs via automation: that's a pipe dream sold to venture capitalists. Any real solution would have consequences that would hurt some folks. Still: doing nothing hurts everyone (except for an extremely small subset of already wealthy individuals and corps) far more. Homes should be for 'living in': not to 'make a living from'.
- bluGill 1y ago
  That is a bad idea. It assumes the buying a house is something everybody must do. For some buying is a good idea, for some it is not. You have forced people who should rent to buy anyway, or pay massive rent to cover that taxes the investor who owns their house must charge. > Removing the ability of Private equity to eat up all the local contractors to make a little mini-monopoly is also something that 100% needs to be done. There is no need because private equity has not done that, and there is not current reason to think they will. If they ever to get a monopoly then we need to do something about it, but right now there is no sign they are. Plenty of little builders exist who are competitive with the large builders in both price and quality. There are also enough large builders to be competitive even without the small builders.

lazide 1y ago

When the line goes up, everyone hopes it keeps going up, and tries to figure out a way to profit from that. One way to stop that, is ensuring the line doesn’t go up. That has some pretty nasty side effects in other ways though. When the line stops or starts to go down, then bad things happen. People can’t sell and move without losing a ton of money. People go bankrupt, etc, etc.

Jensson 1y ago
> When the line stops or starts to go down, then bad things happen Only because many millions bought risky investments since they were told it was basically risk free. Normally things getting cheaper is a good thing, but we tricked people into thinking that housing being expensive is good for them.
- lazide 1y ago
  This is true literally everywhere, in every country (and under every gov’t) I’ve ever seen. And I’ve seen a lot. If you think US property prices are nuts, look in Europe, Asia (especially East Asia), etc. Most people take crazy risks to buy the most/nicest house they can get a loan for because where you live is a huge factor for a number of other things in people’s lives. If people will give them loans for more than they can afford, many people will still do it. So easy credit? Housing market goes up. Tough credit? Housing market goes down. All things considered anyway. Eventually. Owners have a very, very strong incentive to stop it from going down, so unless they have to move, the market can stay locked up for a long time.

altruios 1y ago

'Abolish rent' is a good read. One thing we can do to drive down property prices without driving people out of their homes is to tax the ever-loving-bejebus out of second (or more) Single family homes, for individuals and corporations. Make it progressively worse the more SFM's corporations hold. An example would be to tax a second home and onward at (land tax)^(10nn) where n is the number of total homes you have. The point is to make it financially absurd to own a second home, let alone 20. This is only one particular point on a multi-prong approach. Removing the ability of Private equity to eat up all the local contractors to make a little mini-monopoly is also something that 100% needs to be done. The fastest way to remove 'your home is an investment to be reaped later' mentality is to limit the total sale price based on the last sale price (IE: only increasing the price of actually investment into the property, and legally allowing any sale price far below the estimated property value) which mostly removes all of the incentive of buying a house 'for investment'. That's extreme and would have downstream consequences, we still want to (financially) incentive people to improve their living conditions. It's also extremely hard to build a home! Regulations and zoning laws aside, America lost a fair bit of knowledge after we practically stopped building homes after the 2008 collapse. There's no silver bullet solutions. No company is going to solve the immensely complicated task of building a home in a warehouse to reduce production costs via automation: that's a pipe dream sold to venture capitalists. Any real solution would have consequences that would hurt some folks. Still: doing nothing hurts everyone (except for an extremely small subset of already wealthy individuals and corps) far more. Homes should be for 'living in': not to 'make a living from'.

bluGill 1y ago
That is a bad idea. It assumes the buying a house is something everybody must do. For some buying is a good idea, for some it is not. You have forced people who should rent to buy anyway, or pay massive rent to cover that taxes the investor who owns their house must charge. > Removing the ability of Private equity to eat up all the local contractors to make a little mini-monopoly is also something that 100% needs to be done. There is no need because private equity has not done that, and there is not current reason to think they will. If they ever to get a monopoly then we need to do something about it, but right now there is no sign they are. Plenty of little builders exist who are competitive with the large builders in both price and quality. There are also enough large builders to be competitive even without the small builders.