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My point is that that attitude is useless. Great, you feel better for seeing something you don't like and calling it out. You know what you aren't doing? HELP

My point is that that attitude is useless. Great, you feel better for seeing something you don't like and calling it out. You know what you aren't doing? HELPING the victims? You REALLY care? Then step up, and engage. Swallow your pride and try and find ways to engage so that one day maybe things can be better. Because I'm pretty damn sure just sitting on our side of the fence and ignoring them or calling them names is not going to change anything.

Karunamon 14y ago
That's just it. You can't just change a culture and a religion like that - it has to happen organically. Ask a US armed services member what happens when you come in and try to force change on a nation. And it is coming around, albeit very, very slowly. Women just gained the right to drive in some places. There is nothing you or I can do, from within the USA, to effectively change the culture of a third world nation. I'd love to be proven wrong.
- mindstab 14y ago
  Oddly Saudi Arabia has just the other mindset, and is being wonderfully effective at working against the US. They are pouring tons of money into their religious schools which in many places are just the only place you can even go for any education. And so they are raising a new generation all over the world. All through out the middle east, but even more audaciously they recently opened on of their schools in central Paris to much controversy. So yes, I agree short term forced solutions like armed invasions are extremely poor ways to effect chance (except retrograde) I do believe economic engagement and education promotion are the key. And yes, it takes longer, I agree you can't really change anything this drastic in any kind of short term (10 years is a short time). But there are long term ways we can effect change faster than ignoring it (imho ignoring it will probably let it get much worse) So we can wait and see, does the American invade and destroy all infrastructure way work? Does the ignoring the problem and insulting it work? or does deep long term engagement and education work. My bet's on the way the Saudi's are taking it. Which imho sucks for everyone. EDIT: for example http://vimeo.com/46337060 http://vimeo.com/46337060 This is an example of what I think is EXACTLY the right way to be moving forward: empowering a new generation and showing them freedom and other of our beliefs rock and giving them education to think critically not emotionally. It will take time but this x100 or x1000 I think is the way to start changing things

Karunamon 14y ago

That's just it. You can't just change a culture and a religion like that - it has to happen organically. Ask a US armed services member what happens when you come in and try to force change on a nation. And it is coming around, albeit very, very slowly. Women just gained the right to drive in some places. There is nothing you or I can do, from within the USA, to effectively change the culture of a third world nation. I'd love to be proven wrong.

mindstab 14y ago
Oddly Saudi Arabia has just the other mindset, and is being wonderfully effective at working against the US. They are pouring tons of money into their religious schools which in many places are just the only place you can even go for any education. And so they are raising a new generation all over the world. All through out the middle east, but even more audaciously they recently opened on of their schools in central Paris to much controversy. So yes, I agree short term forced solutions like armed invasions are extremely poor ways to effect chance (except retrograde) I do believe economic engagement and education promotion are the key. And yes, it takes longer, I agree you can't really change anything this drastic in any kind of short term (10 years is a short time). But there are long term ways we can effect change faster than ignoring it (imho ignoring it will probably let it get much worse) So we can wait and see, does the American invade and destroy all infrastructure way work? Does the ignoring the problem and insulting it work? or does deep long term engagement and education work. My bet's on the way the Saudi's are taking it. Which imho sucks for everyone. EDIT: for example http://vimeo.com/46337060 http://vimeo.com/46337060 This is an example of what I think is EXACTLY the right way to be moving forward: empowering a new generation and showing them freedom and other of our beliefs rock and giving them education to think critically not emotionally. It will take time but this x100 or x1000 I think is the way to start changing things