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> also now includes a hazard perception test I took my test nearly 25 years ago, and this was present then -- for the avoidance of doubt, the UK test has alway

> also now includes a hazard perception test I took my test nearly 25 years ago, and this was present then -- for the avoidance of doubt, the UK test has always been very thorough, though not quite as thorough as those in places like Finland where apparently they have skid pans and similar!

bigfudge 1y ago
Interestingly, I saw data from a road safety programme for young people that showed skid pan training actually made young men less safe not more, because they became even more overconfident about their ability to “react quickly” if bad things happened. Turns out that a bit of humility and slowing down are the main skills needed to avoid accidents!
- hnlmorg 1y ago
  I’d imagine that differs from county to country. For example the risks of skidding might be higher in Finland due to the colder climate. Whereas in the UK, black ice isn’t as common so days when it’s icy, the best advice is just to take it slow and stick to salted routes.
- ninalanyon 1y ago
  That's true, on the other hand it made young women safer. This happened in Norway when the skid pan was made a compulsory part of the course a couple of decades ago and the insurance companies soon noticed an increase in reckless driving among young men but the opposite in young women.
  - throwaway2037 1y ago
    > an increase in reckless driving among young men but the opposite in young women This is fascinating. Does anyone know the root cause here?
    - ninalanyon 1y ago
      The usual 'explanation' is that young men had fun on the skid pan and came to no harm there and wanted to continue having fun on the road while young women discovered how little control they had of the car and hence became more cautious.
stevekemp 1y ago
Makes sense that Finland has such things though, when the roads are covered in snow and ice for a lot of the year. Though this year we did good in our capital: "Helsinki has not recorded a single traffic fatality in the past 12 months, city and police officials confirmed this week."
- robertlagrant 1y ago
  Well done Helsinki! Unless there's a massive problem with police recording practices.
ninalanyon 1y ago
Same in Norway. Skid pans and also motorway driving. The course also includes a piece where the instructor picks a place an hour's drive away and tells the student to get there and demonstrate that they can not only drive under instruction but also plan their own route and react properly to challenges along the way.
frereubu 1y ago
Seems like we were either side of a threshold - I took mine ~35 years ago and the only "theory" test was the examiner asking me three basic questions after the practical test, like "what can lead to skidding" to which the answer was "rapid acceleration, steering or braking". The theory side of things hardly existed essentially.

bigfudge 1y ago

Interestingly, I saw data from a road safety programme for young people that showed skid pan training actually made young men less safe not more, because they became even more overconfident about their ability to “react quickly” if bad things happened. Turns out that a bit of humility and slowing down are the main skills needed to avoid accidents!

hnlmorg 1y ago
I’d imagine that differs from county to country. For example the risks of skidding might be higher in Finland due to the colder climate. Whereas in the UK, black ice isn’t as common so days when it’s icy, the best advice is just to take it slow and stick to salted routes.
ninalanyon 1y ago
That's true, on the other hand it made young women safer. This happened in Norway when the skid pan was made a compulsory part of the course a couple of decades ago and the insurance companies soon noticed an increase in reckless driving among young men but the opposite in young women.
- throwaway2037 1y ago
  > an increase in reckless driving among young men but the opposite in young women This is fascinating. Does anyone know the root cause here?
  - ninalanyon 1y ago
    The usual 'explanation' is that young men had fun on the skid pan and came to no harm there and wanted to continue having fun on the road while young women discovered how little control they had of the car and hence became more cautious.

stevekemp 1y ago

Makes sense that Finland has such things though, when the roads are covered in snow and ice for a lot of the year. Though this year we did good in our capital: "Helsinki has not recorded a single traffic fatality in the past 12 months, city and police officials confirmed this week."

robertlagrant 1y ago
Well done Helsinki! Unless there's a massive problem with police recording practices.

ninalanyon 1y ago

Same in Norway. Skid pans and also motorway driving. The course also includes a piece where the instructor picks a place an hour's drive away and tells the student to get there and demonstrate that they can not only drive under instruction but also plan their own route and react properly to challenges along the way.

frereubu 1y ago

Seems like we were either side of a threshold - I took mine ~35 years ago and the only "theory" test was the examiner asking me three basic questions after the practical test, like "what can lead to skidding" to which the answer was "rapid acceleration, steering or braking". The theory side of things hardly existed essentially.