4 ms·

It should be a goal for Earth to send a probe to one of those stars. As the probe will be unmaned, a mission taking a hundred years or more is not out of questi

by ghssds 1y ago

It should be a goal for Earth to send a probe to one of those stars. As the probe will be unmaned, a mission taking a hundred years or more is not out of question.

pkaye 1y ago
How would it be powered?
- mattnewton 1y ago
  some combination of nuclear radiation and/or solar seems like it would fit the bill? 100 years is within the useful range of a large radioisotope generator. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radioisotope_thermoelectric_generator https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radioisotope_thermoelectric_...
  - lazide 1y ago
    RTGs lose power rapidly as the isotopes decay, and any sort of communication over those distances requires massive power. The Voyagers are essentially dead due to this issue, and they haven’t been out there nearly that long.
    - no_wizard 1y ago
      What about a fission reactor?
      - ekianjo 1y ago
        That runs for dozens of years without maintenance? And how do you dissipate the heat?
        yread 1y ago
        Open the rear end and you get propulsion as well. Just don't start close to earth
        sfink 1y ago
        You still need matter to carry the heat, and matter is heavy (by definition!) Radiating the heat isn't going to be enough if you want to send anything other than a blob of plasma. Which is an interesting thought when considered as a weapon. Fire a self-immolating fission reactor at your target...
        lazide 1y ago
        I miss the days when a Bussard Ramjet was a viable dream. Also, if there are aliens there, sending a highly radioactive blob of plasma at them at interstellar speeds might cause a little trouble.
      - lazide 1y ago
        It would likely need a standalone fission reactor that only ‘goes hot’ when it arrives. I’m not sure that we have the engineering ability to actually do that with any real chance of success after a 100 year deep space flight, or the willingness to wait that long to find out.
    - deleted 1y ago
      [deleted]
  - mcswell 1y ago
    Solar would not work when you're out past Uranus or so, and the Sun is just a bright star with barely a visible disk. There's simply not enough sunlight out there, and you won't get enough light from your destination(s) star until you're similarly close to it.
asdff 1y ago
There are already plans to reach alpha centauri in about 20 years with unmanned probes (1). There still remain some technical hurdles in terms of the laser design to propel these probes afaik but it seems like this could be solved with more funding. Too bad we are in the current era of eschewing scientific research in favor of crony politics. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakthrough_Starshot https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakthrough_Starshot
- chatmasta 1y ago
  This project is currently on hold, at least for the long-distance part. https://www.universetoday.com/articles/starshot-not-get-a-reality-check-on-the-search-for-alien-civilizations https://www.universetoday.com/articles/starshot-not-get-a-re...
- dyauspitr 1y ago
  Yeah given the current situation I bet China or India might end up sending those out before us.
  - pavel_lishin 1y ago
    Which, to be fair, is embarrassing for the US, but is just fine as far as species achievement is concerned.
    - JKCalhoun 1y ago
      Absolutely. At the same, I would love for U.S. embarrassment to spawn another "space race".
      - DonHopkins 1y ago
        Funded by ICE, to deport illegal aliens to space.
- pavel_lishin 1y ago
  Something like Starshot seems like it could benefit from future developments without holding back a launch today. Something with a sail can always have a laser aimed at it; maybe we launch it today with a tiny laser we fire from orbit, and in 50 years, we accelerate them to a significantly better cruising speed by firing from a laser array on the moon.
layer8 1y ago
One issue with the latter is that tech is likely to advance fast enough that a subsequent probe launched a couple of decades later would overtake the first probe. Regarding the former, various studies have been made and will certainly continue to be made: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstellar_travel#Designs_and_studies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstellar_travel#Designs_an... Exploration of the Very Local Interstellar Medium (VLISM) will likely come first: https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11214-022-00943-x https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11214-022-00943-x
- jsjddnnsndn 1y ago
  That's not an issue. Thats a good thing!
- no_wizard 1y ago
  I’d still settle for getting the probes out the door because no matter what advancement happens if you can’t get them into space it’s a moot point. I’d simply take something we can reasonably launch into space for research at this point. Also, I would love to see a lunar base happen in my lifetime
  - layer8 1y ago
    Yeah, I don’t think it will happen that fast. There are a lot of hard problems to solve, and you have to make a case for the expected scientific (or other) benefits to be worth the costs. Look at how long the JWST took from initial planning to launch, that was about twenty years, despite clear and specific objectives.
BobbyTables2 1y ago
Sadly if an alien civilization sent a probe to the Sun, would we even know?
- blacksmith_tb 1y ago
  Unlikely, but possible (if the probe was really big or really chatty in parts of the spectrum we pay attention to). Tiny probes could pass by us without us noticing them I'd think, though if they needed to send transmissions back toward their origin we might pick that up.
lovelearning 1y ago
As someone who has been fascinated by the universe and galaxies from a young age, I too thought interstellar was the way to go. Nowadays, however, I've started to feel that we've been wrongly conditioned by science fiction to see interstellar exploration as the next logical step for humanity. Our species is still very immature ethically, socially, and politically. We haven't even learned to accept each other and co-exist happily on Earth. Our distant hominin ancestors crossed entire continents but today we set up physical borders and cultural barriers to prevent even neighborly visits. We certainly won't become the broad-minded united ethical species that Star Trek TOS/TNG portrayed within the next 2-3 centuries. Gradual spatial expansion, and through that, gradual cognitive and worldview expansion, has been our track record. Whenever things got hairy for someone in our hominin tree at any time, they moved just a little bit more to survive. So, I feel exploring and settling other solar system bodies should be our next logical step. There are 4 solid planets, 5 dwarf planets, and as per Gemini, ~40 moons, ~3000 asteroid belt objects, and 200000+ Kuiper belt objects, all above 10 km radius. That's a lot of nearby space to explore and more practical than interstellar. Some of them will become the solutions or refuges from our current social and political problems on Earth. It'll take us 1000s of years more, maybe even 100s of 1000s, to do all this. Including a lot of violence, conflicts and injustice. But eventually, we will learn to develop the cooperative institutions and cognitive/ethical frameworks we currently lack to become a multi-planet species. Interplanetary cooperative institutions and technologies will emerge eventually, just like today we have airplanes, the Internet, UN, WHO, EU - institutions and technologies that, while far from perfect, seemed downright unlikely for 100s of 1000s of years of our hominin history.

by ghssds 1y ago

It should be a goal for Earth to send a probe to one of those stars. As the probe will be unmaned, a mission taking a hundred years or more is not out of question.

pkaye 1y ago

How would it be powered?

mattnewton 1y ago
some combination of nuclear radiation and/or solar seems like it would fit the bill? 100 years is within the useful range of a large radioisotope generator. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radioisotope_thermoelectric_generator https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radioisotope_thermoelectric_...
- lazide 1y ago
  RTGs lose power rapidly as the isotopes decay, and any sort of communication over those distances requires massive power. The Voyagers are essentially dead due to this issue, and they haven’t been out there nearly that long.
  - no_wizard 1y ago
    What about a fission reactor?
    - ekianjo 1y ago
      That runs for dozens of years without maintenance? And how do you dissipate the heat?
      - yread 1y ago
        Open the rear end and you get propulsion as well. Just don't start close to earth
        sfink 1y ago
        You still need matter to carry the heat, and matter is heavy (by definition!) Radiating the heat isn't going to be enough if you want to send anything other than a blob of plasma. Which is an interesting thought when considered as a weapon. Fire a self-immolating fission reactor at your target...
        lazide 1y ago
        I miss the days when a Bussard Ramjet was a viable dream. Also, if there are aliens there, sending a highly radioactive blob of plasma at them at interstellar speeds might cause a little trouble.
    - lazide 1y ago
      It would likely need a standalone fission reactor that only ‘goes hot’ when it arrives. I’m not sure that we have the engineering ability to actually do that with any real chance of success after a 100 year deep space flight, or the willingness to wait that long to find out.
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
- mcswell 1y ago
  Solar would not work when you're out past Uranus or so, and the Sun is just a bright star with barely a visible disk. There's simply not enough sunlight out there, and you won't get enough light from your destination(s) star until you're similarly close to it.

asdff 1y ago

There are already plans to reach alpha centauri in about 20 years with unmanned probes (1). There still remain some technical hurdles in terms of the laser design to propel these probes afaik but it seems like this could be solved with more funding. Too bad we are in the current era of eschewing scientific research in favor of crony politics. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakthrough_Starshot https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breakthrough_Starshot

chatmasta 1y ago
This project is currently on hold, at least for the long-distance part. https://www.universetoday.com/articles/starshot-not-get-a-reality-check-on-the-search-for-alien-civilizations https://www.universetoday.com/articles/starshot-not-get-a-re...
dyauspitr 1y ago
Yeah given the current situation I bet China or India might end up sending those out before us.
- pavel_lishin 1y ago
  Which, to be fair, is embarrassing for the US, but is just fine as far as species achievement is concerned.
  - JKCalhoun 1y ago
    Absolutely. At the same, I would love for U.S. embarrassment to spawn another "space race".
    - DonHopkins 1y ago
      Funded by ICE, to deport illegal aliens to space.
pavel_lishin 1y ago
Something like Starshot seems like it could benefit from future developments without holding back a launch today. Something with a sail can always have a laser aimed at it; maybe we launch it today with a tiny laser we fire from orbit, and in 50 years, we accelerate them to a significantly better cruising speed by firing from a laser array on the moon.

layer8 1y ago

One issue with the latter is that tech is likely to advance fast enough that a subsequent probe launched a couple of decades later would overtake the first probe. Regarding the former, various studies have been made and will certainly continue to be made: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstellar_travel#Designs_and_studies https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interstellar_travel#Designs_an... Exploration of the Very Local Interstellar Medium (VLISM) will likely come first: https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11214-022-00943-x https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s11214-022-00943-x

jsjddnnsndn 1y ago
That's not an issue. Thats a good thing!
no_wizard 1y ago
I’d still settle for getting the probes out the door because no matter what advancement happens if you can’t get them into space it’s a moot point. I’d simply take something we can reasonably launch into space for research at this point. Also, I would love to see a lunar base happen in my lifetime
- layer8 1y ago
  Yeah, I don’t think it will happen that fast. There are a lot of hard problems to solve, and you have to make a case for the expected scientific (or other) benefits to be worth the costs. Look at how long the JWST took from initial planning to launch, that was about twenty years, despite clear and specific objectives.

BobbyTables2 1y ago

Sadly if an alien civilization sent a probe to the Sun, would we even know?

blacksmith_tb 1y ago
Unlikely, but possible (if the probe was really big or really chatty in parts of the spectrum we pay attention to). Tiny probes could pass by us without us noticing them I'd think, though if they needed to send transmissions back toward their origin we might pick that up.

lovelearning 1y ago

As someone who has been fascinated by the universe and galaxies from a young age, I too thought interstellar was the way to go. Nowadays, however, I've started to feel that we've been wrongly conditioned by science fiction to see interstellar exploration as the next logical step for humanity. Our species is still very immature ethically, socially, and politically. We haven't even learned to accept each other and co-exist happily on Earth. Our distant hominin ancestors crossed entire continents but today we set up physical borders and cultural barriers to prevent even neighborly visits. We certainly won't become the broad-minded united ethical species that Star Trek TOS/TNG portrayed within the next 2-3 centuries. Gradual spatial expansion, and through that, gradual cognitive and worldview expansion, has been our track record. Whenever things got hairy for someone in our hominin tree at any time, they moved just a little bit more to survive. So, I feel exploring and settling other solar system bodies should be our next logical step. There are 4 solid planets, 5 dwarf planets, and as per Gemini, ~40 moons, ~3000 asteroid belt objects, and 200000+ Kuiper belt objects, all above 10 km radius. That's a lot of nearby space to explore and more practical than interstellar. Some of them will become the solutions or refuges from our current social and political problems on Earth. It'll take us 1000s of years more, maybe even 100s of 1000s, to do all this. Including a lot of violence, conflicts and injustice. But eventually, we will learn to develop the cooperative institutions and cognitive/ethical frameworks we currently lack to become a multi-planet species. Interplanetary cooperative institutions and technologies will emerge eventually, just like today we have airplanes, the Internet, UN, WHO, EU - institutions and technologies that, while far from perfect, seemed downright unlikely for 100s of 1000s of years of our hominin history.