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Also her husband died a few year ago. These people want to do things that they know are extremely dangerous, and some times die. I don't empathize. Compare to

Also her husband died a few year ago. These people want to do things that they know are extremely dangerous, and some times die. I don't empathize. Compare to those people who die by no fault of their own. Drunk driver, war, etc. Am I callous to believe that the two are not equally deserving of our empathy?

afthonos 1y ago
I think making a point broadcasting that one doesn’t care if other people who weren’t harming anyone die is callous, yes. Doubly so when one does it on a news story about people dying.
- jrm4 1y ago
  Hmm. I don't know. I am glad they're not harming anyone else, but also -- like, I have kids. And if they were to get into this sort of thing, I'd at the least be like "Well, that's STUPID. Why put yourselves in harm's way deliberately like this. Stressing me and mom out. Do something that helps someone else instead."
  - afthonos 1y ago
    That’s fair, but there’s a way to say that without bringing “deserving” into it. As you did. For my part, there’s a big part of me that still is moved by Tennyson: “As tho’ to breathe were life!”
  - dmix 1y ago
    My uncle promised his kid $10k if he did not buy a motorcycle he was planning to buy
    - kyleee 1y ago
      Gos bless your uncle. Smart man. Did it work?
      - stavros 1y ago
        It did. The kid went on to spend the $10k on a new motorcycle.
- jemmyw 1y ago
  The thing is, they can and do harm others. Not just family and friends when they perish, but rescue workers who risk their own lives to save people who get into trouble. The article talks of 2 people who delivered her supplies, one died, the other has gone to Germany for frostbite treatment - as fellow climbers maybe they don't count in quite the same way, but rescue workers do die or get injured as well.
  - inglor_cz 1y ago
    Rescue workers do their job willingly. No one really forces them to (usual exceptions for North Korea et al. apply here). I know an old emergency doctor who once survived a helicopter crash. He still walks with a limp and still flies missions with a helo, even though he is pushing sixty. It is a specific sort of mentality on their part and frankly my experience with them is that they neither need nor appreciate any white-knighting for their safety. If they wanted a safe job, they could easily switch to pushing papers around, there is no shortage of such jobs in the modern world.
  - amluto 1y ago
    According to the article, the person who died bringing her supplies was a member of her original expedition group, not an unrelated rescue worker.
- inglor_cz 1y ago
  TBH daily, about 150 000 humans die, and I don't have the capacity to mourn them all. That said, as you say, broadcasting that one does not care without even being asked is already an attitude and I wouldn't like to be in any sort of relationship with a person which spontaneously emits such messages.
  - bxsioshc 1y ago
    [dead]
- bxsioshc 1y ago
  [dead]
CamperBob2 1y ago
Drunk driver, war, etc. Am I callous to believe that the two are not equally deserving of our empathy? I've always thought that a good comparison was drug addiction. Ultimately, what's the difference between someone who engages in high-risk extreme sports and someone who just sits at home doing meth in the basement? They are both doing dangerous, unnecessary things to manipulate their brain chemistry, without creating or learning anything useful or affecting anything in the larger world around them. Why is one considered heroic and adventurous, and the other criminal or at best pathetic? I'm not saying that pleasure-seeking for its own sake is inherently bad or wrong, but how would you compare and contrast the behavior of a drug addict and a high-risk climber, if you were explaining it to an alien anthropologist?
- foldingmoney 1y ago
  >I'm not saying that pleasure-seeking for its own sake is inherently bad or wrong, but how would you compare and contrast the behavior of a drug addict and a high-risk climber, if you were explaining it to an alien anthropologist? the argument is probably that today's extreme sports risk takers were last epoch's explorers who helped humanity conquer the planet.
  - CamperBob2 1y ago
    I'd be willing to buy that if she had died while diving in an unexplored cave system, for instance, working to bring us knowledge and insights about nature that we didn't already have. But there was nothing left to discover on that mountain peak, except how much frostbite sucks.
- afthonos 1y ago
  I find the analogy quite apt. I have known drug addicts who I thought were recovered, but who could not fathom simply going to work and then going home to their families every night. They thought that was an incredibly boring life. Predictably, they relapsed. They could’ve caused significantly less stress to their families and loved ones by having more socially acceptable thrillseeking methods.
- fatbird 1y ago
cgh 1y ago
[flagged]
like_any_other 1y ago
That is a path towards a more boring humanity.
antod 1y ago
Did you mean sympathy rather than empathy?
watwut 1y ago
There is not caring about an unknown person which is default stance. And then there is going out of your way to make everyone know other people do not deserve empathy or whatever and how worthless they are to you. The two are not the same. Why do you want us all to compare them to other people who died? You are not callous. You are angry and emotional over others having interest in the story.

afthonos 1y ago

I think making a point broadcasting that one doesn’t care if other people who weren’t harming anyone die is callous, yes. Doubly so when one does it on a news story about people dying.

jrm4 1y ago
Hmm. I don't know. I am glad they're not harming anyone else, but also -- like, I have kids. And if they were to get into this sort of thing, I'd at the least be like "Well, that's STUPID. Why put yourselves in harm's way deliberately like this. Stressing me and mom out. Do something that helps someone else instead."
- afthonos 1y ago
  That’s fair, but there’s a way to say that without bringing “deserving” into it. As you did. For my part, there’s a big part of me that still is moved by Tennyson: “As tho’ to breathe were life!”
- dmix 1y ago
  My uncle promised his kid $10k if he did not buy a motorcycle he was planning to buy
  - kyleee 1y ago
    Gos bless your uncle. Smart man. Did it work?
    - stavros 1y ago
      It did. The kid went on to spend the $10k on a new motorcycle.
jemmyw 1y ago
The thing is, they can and do harm others. Not just family and friends when they perish, but rescue workers who risk their own lives to save people who get into trouble. The article talks of 2 people who delivered her supplies, one died, the other has gone to Germany for frostbite treatment - as fellow climbers maybe they don't count in quite the same way, but rescue workers do die or get injured as well.
- inglor_cz 1y ago
  Rescue workers do their job willingly. No one really forces them to (usual exceptions for North Korea et al. apply here). I know an old emergency doctor who once survived a helicopter crash. He still walks with a limp and still flies missions with a helo, even though he is pushing sixty. It is a specific sort of mentality on their part and frankly my experience with them is that they neither need nor appreciate any white-knighting for their safety. If they wanted a safe job, they could easily switch to pushing papers around, there is no shortage of such jobs in the modern world.
- amluto 1y ago
  According to the article, the person who died bringing her supplies was a member of her original expedition group, not an unrelated rescue worker.
inglor_cz 1y ago
TBH daily, about 150 000 humans die, and I don't have the capacity to mourn them all. That said, as you say, broadcasting that one does not care without even being asked is already an attitude and I wouldn't like to be in any sort of relationship with a person which spontaneously emits such messages.
- bxsioshc 1y ago
  [dead]
bxsioshc 1y ago
[dead]

CamperBob2 1y ago

Drunk driver, war, etc. Am I callous to believe that the two are not equally deserving of our empathy? I've always thought that a good comparison was drug addiction. Ultimately, what's the difference between someone who engages in high-risk extreme sports and someone who just sits at home doing meth in the basement? They are both doing dangerous, unnecessary things to manipulate their brain chemistry, without creating or learning anything useful or affecting anything in the larger world around them. Why is one considered heroic and adventurous, and the other criminal or at best pathetic? I'm not saying that pleasure-seeking for its own sake is inherently bad or wrong, but how would you compare and contrast the behavior of a drug addict and a high-risk climber, if you were explaining it to an alien anthropologist?

foldingmoney 1y ago
>I'm not saying that pleasure-seeking for its own sake is inherently bad or wrong, but how would you compare and contrast the behavior of a drug addict and a high-risk climber, if you were explaining it to an alien anthropologist? the argument is probably that today's extreme sports risk takers were last epoch's explorers who helped humanity conquer the planet.
- CamperBob2 1y ago
  I'd be willing to buy that if she had died while diving in an unexplored cave system, for instance, working to bring us knowledge and insights about nature that we didn't already have. But there was nothing left to discover on that mountain peak, except how much frostbite sucks.
afthonos 1y ago
I find the analogy quite apt. I have known drug addicts who I thought were recovered, but who could not fathom simply going to work and then going home to their families every night. They thought that was an incredibly boring life. Predictably, they relapsed. They could’ve caused significantly less stress to their families and loved ones by having more socially acceptable thrillseeking methods.
fatbird 1y ago

cgh 1y ago

[flagged]

like_any_other 1y ago

That is a path towards a more boring humanity.

antod 1y ago

Did you mean sympathy rather than empathy?

watwut 1y ago

There is not caring about an unknown person which is default stance. And then there is going out of your way to make everyone know other people do not deserve empathy or whatever and how worthless they are to you. The two are not the same. Why do you want us all to compare them to other people who died? You are not callous. You are angry and emotional over others having interest in the story.