4 ms·

As an avid cyclist I have decades of data on aggressive driving, and the most aggressive drivers (those who try to run me off the road) are almost always pickup

As an avid cyclist I have decades of data on aggressive driving, and the most aggressive drivers (those who try to run me off the road) are almost always pickup trucks. If I limit my dataset to just country roads, that statistic goes to 100%. Cyclists and pickup trucks are the American cultural polar opposites.

RandomBacon 1y ago
"As an acid cyclist," do you stop at every red light and stop sign? Or do you constantly break the law because you claim it's for your safety? As an avid car and truck driver, I give bicycles the full lane like any other vehicle on the road, and I give them plenty of distance before switching lanes in front of them to mitigate turbulence. I almost never ride my bike on the street, so please let me know if there is anything else I can do to help. But it's annoying to see every bicycle that I encounter at an intersection, breaking the law. I always wait instead of assuming they are going to stop, because I don't want them crashing into my vehicle.
- dreamcompiler 1y ago
  Bicyclists who break the law rarely kill other people.
  - RandomBacon 1y ago
    Ah, so that's why it's okay to break the law!
- noahjk 1y ago
  > But it's annoying to see every bicycle that I encounter at an intersection, breaking the law. I always wait instead of assuming they are going to stop, because I don't want them crashing into my vehicle. This is a great example of an internal narrative which you could reframe (if you chose to). Instead of framing the interaction as "breaking the law" and you protecting your property from the adversarial cyclist, you could instead see each of these as an opportunity for a friendly community gesture of allowing a cyclist to continue on without expending extra energy stopping and starting, plus helping them stay safer through movement (since most cyclists don't have a brake light to signal they are slowing or stopping and can't always use hand signals when navigating situations, and being rear ended is a real concern for bikes). Either way you're doing the same thing, right? So you can internally decide to view it through a negative or a positive lens. But either way, I'm sure the cyclists you stop and wait for are grateful!
  - RandomBacon 1y ago
    ^ This is a great example of an internal narrative which you could reframe (if you chose to). Instead of framing my comment as negative, you could choose to see the positive: I give all bicyclists extra room and ask how I can even do better. Everyone should strive to learn and be safe on the road like this guy! Note I didn't say it was to protect my property like you assumed. I've seen pictures of nasty crashes and don't want that happening to any bicyclists. Dealing with my insurance is secondary. Notice that OP tries to make me look bad in his other comment, rather than answering my question on how I can help him and other cyclists.
- FourteenthTime 1y ago
  "do you stop at every red light and stop sign?" Yes, because my life depends on it. Do you follow every single law when you drive? Probably not, because the consequences are far less mortal for you in a truck or car. I also don't blame rape victims for wearing short skirts.
  - RandomBacon 1y ago
    Asking if someone breaks the law means the person asking probably breaks the law? Thank you for trying to make me look bad instead of answering my question on how I can help bicyclists like you. Unless you think just trying to blindly criticize all car drivers is going to help you. > blame rape victims ...
    - FourteenthTime 1y ago
      >> Thank you for trying to make me look bad I didn't really have to try. You came out of the gate applying your stereotypes at me and your following questions riddled with spite were pretty obvious you don't really GAF. This isn't my first day on the internet.
      - RandomBacon 1y ago
        > questions riddled with spite Dude? I think your emotions are blinding you. > pretty obvious you don't really GAF. I tried to ask what I (and other people who drive cars) can do to help make your ride safer... > This isn't my first day on the internet. Looking at your username, is this your fourteenth HN account? Is that because your previous ones have been banned?
- throw0101c 1y ago
  > But it's annoying to see every bicycle that I encounter at an intersection, breaking the law. And as a motorist, motorcyclist, and bicyclist, it's annoying to see drivers break the law, which they statistically do more often than bicyclists per a Danish government study: * https://politiken.dk/danmark/art7185605/Rygterne-om-cyklister-som-lovløse-banditter-er-stærkt-overdrevne https://politiken.dk/danmark/art7185605/Rygterne-om-cykliste... * Via: https://electrek.co/2024/01/11/cars-or-bikes-surprising-results-of-study-reveal-who-breaks-more-road-laws/ https://electrek.co/2024/01/11/cars-or-bikes-surprising-resu... Studies out of the UK and Florida have similar results: cyclists either follow the law at the same rate, or better. Motorists breaking the law has been so normalized that most people don't notice it.
  - RandomBacon 1y ago
    Interesting, thank you. I didn't see where the Electrek article mentioned any U.S./Florida study though. I'm inclined to believe that bicyclists still might be better overall compared to car drivers, but perhaps not at the same rate as Denmark.
    - throw0101a 1y ago
      Florida re-orged their site, so all the old links are broken: * https://www.fdot.gov/docs/default-source/research/Completed-Proj/Summary-SF/FDOT-BDV25-977-13-rpt.pdf https://www.fdot.gov/docs/default-source/research/Completed-... Do a search for "FDOT-BDV25-977-13" I guess. That study ("Naturalistic bicycling behavior pilot study") is referenced here: * https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/2023-03/Bicyclist-Yield-As-Stop-Fact-Sheet_032123_v5_tag.pdf https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/2023-03/Bicyclis...
silisili 1y ago
This logically tracks, but remember that correlation isn't causation. It stands to reason that people who see driving as an aggressive venture choose the largest vehicle they can. But as pickups make up 20ish percent of all passenger vehicles, it's obvious that not all pickup drivers are aggressive or traffic would probably never actually be moving.
amy_petrik 1y ago
I disagree. The pickup driver still has hope. A dream, a wish, a future. They may be aggressive jerks on average, surely, maybe they think they're better, maybe they're a bit emotionally out of control, sure. But if they're in a game of chicken, if the icy spectre of death appears before them, they will still give pause to consider the stakes, to think of their loved ones. There is another type of driver, completely void of fear, a driver who has stared into the abyss and become the dragon. And that is the minivan driver. All hope is lost for the minivan driver. First of all, they're driving a minivan, speaks for itself. Second, we're talking about a 20 year old beater minivan held together with duct tape, driven not by fuel but by a sort of vacuum energy, the bleak desolation of it all, of life, nihilism on wheels. If such a vehicle is faced with a game of chicken, the driver won't blink but embrace the mortal transition to nirvana knowing their estate will only lose the market value of 1 beater minivan, about $20 and that death will be a sweet release from their miserable life
- silisili 1y ago
  Absolutely hilarious and beautiful writing. Do you have a blog by chance?
- bdangubic 1y ago
  fuck now I have to sell my car…

RandomBacon 1y ago

"As an acid cyclist," do you stop at every red light and stop sign? Or do you constantly break the law because you claim it's for your safety? As an avid car and truck driver, I give bicycles the full lane like any other vehicle on the road, and I give them plenty of distance before switching lanes in front of them to mitigate turbulence. I almost never ride my bike on the street, so please let me know if there is anything else I can do to help. But it's annoying to see every bicycle that I encounter at an intersection, breaking the law. I always wait instead of assuming they are going to stop, because I don't want them crashing into my vehicle.

dreamcompiler 1y ago
Bicyclists who break the law rarely kill other people.
- RandomBacon 1y ago
  Ah, so that's why it's okay to break the law!
noahjk 1y ago
> But it's annoying to see every bicycle that I encounter at an intersection, breaking the law. I always wait instead of assuming they are going to stop, because I don't want them crashing into my vehicle. This is a great example of an internal narrative which you could reframe (if you chose to). Instead of framing the interaction as "breaking the law" and you protecting your property from the adversarial cyclist, you could instead see each of these as an opportunity for a friendly community gesture of allowing a cyclist to continue on without expending extra energy stopping and starting, plus helping them stay safer through movement (since most cyclists don't have a brake light to signal they are slowing or stopping and can't always use hand signals when navigating situations, and being rear ended is a real concern for bikes). Either way you're doing the same thing, right? So you can internally decide to view it through a negative or a positive lens. But either way, I'm sure the cyclists you stop and wait for are grateful!
- RandomBacon 1y ago
  ^ This is a great example of an internal narrative which you could reframe (if you chose to). Instead of framing my comment as negative, you could choose to see the positive: I give all bicyclists extra room and ask how I can even do better. Everyone should strive to learn and be safe on the road like this guy! Note I didn't say it was to protect my property like you assumed. I've seen pictures of nasty crashes and don't want that happening to any bicyclists. Dealing with my insurance is secondary. Notice that OP tries to make me look bad in his other comment, rather than answering my question on how I can help him and other cyclists.
FourteenthTime 1y ago
"do you stop at every red light and stop sign?" Yes, because my life depends on it. Do you follow every single law when you drive? Probably not, because the consequences are far less mortal for you in a truck or car. I also don't blame rape victims for wearing short skirts.
- RandomBacon 1y ago
  Asking if someone breaks the law means the person asking probably breaks the law? Thank you for trying to make me look bad instead of answering my question on how I can help bicyclists like you. Unless you think just trying to blindly criticize all car drivers is going to help you. > blame rape victims ...
  - FourteenthTime 1y ago
    >> Thank you for trying to make me look bad I didn't really have to try. You came out of the gate applying your stereotypes at me and your following questions riddled with spite were pretty obvious you don't really GAF. This isn't my first day on the internet.
    - RandomBacon 1y ago
      > questions riddled with spite Dude? I think your emotions are blinding you. > pretty obvious you don't really GAF. I tried to ask what I (and other people who drive cars) can do to help make your ride safer... > This isn't my first day on the internet. Looking at your username, is this your fourteenth HN account? Is that because your previous ones have been banned?
throw0101c 1y ago
> But it's annoying to see every bicycle that I encounter at an intersection, breaking the law. And as a motorist, motorcyclist, and bicyclist, it's annoying to see drivers break the law, which they statistically do more often than bicyclists per a Danish government study: * https://politiken.dk/danmark/art7185605/Rygterne-om-cyklister-som-lovløse-banditter-er-stærkt-overdrevne https://politiken.dk/danmark/art7185605/Rygterne-om-cykliste... * Via: https://electrek.co/2024/01/11/cars-or-bikes-surprising-results-of-study-reveal-who-breaks-more-road-laws/ https://electrek.co/2024/01/11/cars-or-bikes-surprising-resu... Studies out of the UK and Florida have similar results: cyclists either follow the law at the same rate, or better. Motorists breaking the law has been so normalized that most people don't notice it.
- RandomBacon 1y ago
  Interesting, thank you. I didn't see where the Electrek article mentioned any U.S./Florida study though. I'm inclined to believe that bicyclists still might be better overall compared to car drivers, but perhaps not at the same rate as Denmark.
  - throw0101a 1y ago
    Florida re-orged their site, so all the old links are broken: * https://www.fdot.gov/docs/default-source/research/Completed-Proj/Summary-SF/FDOT-BDV25-977-13-rpt.pdf https://www.fdot.gov/docs/default-source/research/Completed-... Do a search for "FDOT-BDV25-977-13" I guess. That study ("Naturalistic bicycling behavior pilot study") is referenced here: * https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/2023-03/Bicyclist-Yield-As-Stop-Fact-Sheet_032123_v5_tag.pdf https://www.nhtsa.gov/sites/nhtsa.gov/files/2023-03/Bicyclis...

silisili 1y ago

This logically tracks, but remember that correlation isn't causation. It stands to reason that people who see driving as an aggressive venture choose the largest vehicle they can. But as pickups make up 20ish percent of all passenger vehicles, it's obvious that not all pickup drivers are aggressive or traffic would probably never actually be moving.

amy_petrik 1y ago

I disagree. The pickup driver still has hope. A dream, a wish, a future. They may be aggressive jerks on average, surely, maybe they think they're better, maybe they're a bit emotionally out of control, sure. But if they're in a game of chicken, if the icy spectre of death appears before them, they will still give pause to consider the stakes, to think of their loved ones. There is another type of driver, completely void of fear, a driver who has stared into the abyss and become the dragon. And that is the minivan driver. All hope is lost for the minivan driver. First of all, they're driving a minivan, speaks for itself. Second, we're talking about a 20 year old beater minivan held together with duct tape, driven not by fuel but by a sort of vacuum energy, the bleak desolation of it all, of life, nihilism on wheels. If such a vehicle is faced with a game of chicken, the driver won't blink but embrace the mortal transition to nirvana knowing their estate will only lose the market value of 1 beater minivan, about $20 and that death will be a sweet release from their miserable life

silisili 1y ago
Absolutely hilarious and beautiful writing. Do you have a blog by chance?
bdangubic 1y ago
fuck now I have to sell my car…