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I don't own a phone, but the most shocking revelation came when my child's school required us to use an app to specify how our children will be picked up or rid

I don't own a phone, but the most shocking revelation came when my child's school required us to use an app to specify how our children will be picked up or ride the bus. So far I've been able to avoid using apps for pretty much anything, but when the school says "use an app or you won't get your kids" and then also say they will call CPS and have your kids seized if you don't get them in time, that puts you in a real fucked up situation.

W3zzy 1y ago
I work for some local governments in Belgium and with every system they put in place I keep insisting on a analogous version. Online forms? Great but if anyone chooses the should be able to send in a paper form or get assisted by someone who fills in the online form for them.
- lvspiff 1y ago
  As the spouse of someone blind it's becoming increasingly difficult to get accomodations from doctors and govt things. Surprisingly so much so that even making ada complaints goes nowhere. Very few offices are willing to sit and fill out paperwork nor willing to provide an accessible version. The only saving grace has been be my eyes and other apps that allow for some level of access without needing another human available. It really sucks though as back in the early 2000s strides were being made for the blind community but now it feels like things have regressed because of technology and basic human dignity and kindness has lost out.
rhines 1y ago
We've reached the point where people without devices or common online services are so rare that society no longer accommodates them. It's similar to how we need legislation to ensure that disabled people have accessible infrastructure, except I doubt there will ever be legislation mandating offline/off-app accessibility.
- fauigerzigerk 1y ago
  Yes, but to me there is a very big difference between being forced to adopt a class of technologies (online services in general) along with the rest of society and being forced to contract with a handful of specific companies that impose extremely one-sided contractual terms on everybody, touching almost every aspect of life.
  - eMPee584 1y ago
    Yes, but both permutations of digital coercion suck, right? ^^D
    - fauigerzigerk 1y ago
      General technological progress may well suck in some cases, but it's not coercion.
- adiabatichottub 1y ago
  File it under faulty assumptions organizations make about their clients or customers. If you live in a rural area in the United States it is still quite possible to have: * No cellular service * No landline service * No postal delivery to your property, and a physical address that isn't in any database * No public utilities It can be very frustrating to deal with services that assume you have the ability to receive SMS messages, and almost anything requiring identity these days demands a phone number.
  - wilg 1y ago
    I don't think its unreasonable for private companies not to bother to offer their services to these people. Why should they have to? Many services require nearby physical infrastructure. Electing to live in the woods is not really a disability. Plus you can just get internet out there if you want and thereby receive SMS.
    - adiabatichottub 1y ago
etherealG 1y ago
I think I might enjoy the CPS scenario... let them call CPS, and wait for CPS to arrive, and then discuss with CPS who is endangering the child, the parent or the school. I'm pretty sure a judge will quickly decide whether their rule makes sense or not, and I think judges in child protection cases are going to quickly side with what's important for the child. I HATE this kind of nonsense, and threatening you as a parent is only making things worse. Why not offer a way to handle this on a simple website? It would have lower cost to the school and be more accessible to anyone with any device able to access websites. Nonsense.
- mothballed 1y ago
  Well the judge will likely rule the app is bullshit, but in the meantime CPS will argue they need to go into your house, look to see if you have a dirty dish, or the wrong proportion of snacks to vegetables, or maybe take notice your child is playing independently outside while they come around. Then they will portray that in the most insane way possible, and since it is a civil and not criminal process their is no requirement anything is shown beyond a reasonable doubt. There's also the problem that once they have your kid, the tables are completely turned, rather than them showing why they should take them, now you have to show why you should get them back and that is a process that can be dragged out for over a year. Unfortunately CPS has wide latitude, secret courts, and the ability to unendingly fuck with you, so it's better just to not "invite" them in your life if you can. And if they do manage to snatch your kid, note they give so little fucks for the kid that their contractors will leave a kid in a hot car to die because apparently that's safer than being with their parents.[] [] https://abcnews.go.com/US/3-year-dies-hot-car-custody-contract-worker/story?id=124128631 https://abcnews.go.com/US/3-year-dies-hot-car-custody-contra...
  - asyx 1y ago
    Damn. When I had a child in Germany, our version of CPS came over and told me what fun things the city offers for children and asked me about my plans for day care and how I can get help to get a spot. I once called them because the day care lady of a friend‘s kid is a bit of an idiot and kinda scared us about mass closure of day care centers and it was probably the nicest interaction I’ve ever had with a government agency. But from what I’ve heard, America in general is a whole other beast both regarding expectations for parents, trust in the kids and the trouble you can get in for minor things.
bigstrat2003 1y ago
That's pretty fucked. It should be utterly illegal to put parents in a triple bind like that. You have my sympathies.
1over137 1y ago
What country is that in?!??
- eloisant 1y ago
  CPS is in the US I believe
stock_toaster 1y ago
I'm sure the app is perfectly ADA complaint too. /sarcasm

W3zzy 1y ago

I work for some local governments in Belgium and with every system they put in place I keep insisting on a analogous version. Online forms? Great but if anyone chooses the should be able to send in a paper form or get assisted by someone who fills in the online form for them.

lvspiff 1y ago
As the spouse of someone blind it's becoming increasingly difficult to get accomodations from doctors and govt things. Surprisingly so much so that even making ada complaints goes nowhere. Very few offices are willing to sit and fill out paperwork nor willing to provide an accessible version. The only saving grace has been be my eyes and other apps that allow for some level of access without needing another human available. It really sucks though as back in the early 2000s strides were being made for the blind community but now it feels like things have regressed because of technology and basic human dignity and kindness has lost out.

rhines 1y ago

We've reached the point where people without devices or common online services are so rare that society no longer accommodates them. It's similar to how we need legislation to ensure that disabled people have accessible infrastructure, except I doubt there will ever be legislation mandating offline/off-app accessibility.

fauigerzigerk 1y ago
Yes, but to me there is a very big difference between being forced to adopt a class of technologies (online services in general) along with the rest of society and being forced to contract with a handful of specific companies that impose extremely one-sided contractual terms on everybody, touching almost every aspect of life.
- eMPee584 1y ago
  Yes, but both permutations of digital coercion suck, right? ^^D
  - fauigerzigerk 1y ago
    General technological progress may well suck in some cases, but it's not coercion.
adiabatichottub 1y ago
File it under faulty assumptions organizations make about their clients or customers. If you live in a rural area in the United States it is still quite possible to have: * No cellular service * No landline service * No postal delivery to your property, and a physical address that isn't in any database * No public utilities It can be very frustrating to deal with services that assume you have the ability to receive SMS messages, and almost anything requiring identity these days demands a phone number.
- wilg 1y ago
  I don't think its unreasonable for private companies not to bother to offer their services to these people. Why should they have to? Many services require nearby physical infrastructure. Electing to live in the woods is not really a disability. Plus you can just get internet out there if you want and thereby receive SMS.
  - adiabatichottub 1y ago

etherealG 1y ago

I think I might enjoy the CPS scenario... let them call CPS, and wait for CPS to arrive, and then discuss with CPS who is endangering the child, the parent or the school. I'm pretty sure a judge will quickly decide whether their rule makes sense or not, and I think judges in child protection cases are going to quickly side with what's important for the child. I HATE this kind of nonsense, and threatening you as a parent is only making things worse. Why not offer a way to handle this on a simple website? It would have lower cost to the school and be more accessible to anyone with any device able to access websites. Nonsense.

mothballed 1y ago
Well the judge will likely rule the app is bullshit, but in the meantime CPS will argue they need to go into your house, look to see if you have a dirty dish, or the wrong proportion of snacks to vegetables, or maybe take notice your child is playing independently outside while they come around. Then they will portray that in the most insane way possible, and since it is a civil and not criminal process their is no requirement anything is shown beyond a reasonable doubt. There's also the problem that once they have your kid, the tables are completely turned, rather than them showing why they should take them, now you have to show why you should get them back and that is a process that can be dragged out for over a year. Unfortunately CPS has wide latitude, secret courts, and the ability to unendingly fuck with you, so it's better just to not "invite" them in your life if you can. And if they do manage to snatch your kid, note they give so little fucks for the kid that their contractors will leave a kid in a hot car to die because apparently that's safer than being with their parents.[] [] https://abcnews.go.com/US/3-year-dies-hot-car-custody-contract-worker/story?id=124128631 https://abcnews.go.com/US/3-year-dies-hot-car-custody-contra...
- asyx 1y ago
  Damn. When I had a child in Germany, our version of CPS came over and told me what fun things the city offers for children and asked me about my plans for day care and how I can get help to get a spot. I once called them because the day care lady of a friend‘s kid is a bit of an idiot and kinda scared us about mass closure of day care centers and it was probably the nicest interaction I’ve ever had with a government agency. But from what I’ve heard, America in general is a whole other beast both regarding expectations for parents, trust in the kids and the trouble you can get in for minor things.

bigstrat2003 1y ago

That's pretty fucked. It should be utterly illegal to put parents in a triple bind like that. You have my sympathies.

1over137 1y ago

What country is that in?!??

eloisant 1y ago
CPS is in the US I believe

stock_toaster 1y ago

I'm sure the app is perfectly ADA complaint too. /sarcasm