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< Vulnerable members of society should be protected from scams. There are three ways to deliver protection: build better walls, defeat attackers after successf

< Vulnerable members of society should be protected from scams. There are three ways to deliver protection: build better walls, defeat attackers after successful initial attacks, defeat attackers before successful initial attacks. The article ties itself into knots because it recognizes that the first way cannot deliver 100% security. But it refuses to recognize that there are two additional ways. The United States military could go after scammers operating from foreign compounds. It could treat the economic targeting of American citizens as acts of economic war. It chooses not to. Freedom is not free, and when your country chooses to literally not fight for your freedom, it's hardly any wonder that your freedoms are eroded. Remember XKCD 538: https://xkcd.com/538/ https://xkcd.com/538/ Cybersecurity and physical security are fundamentally linked.

deleted 1y ago
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woliveirajr 1y ago
>> Vulnerable members of society should be protected from scams. > There are three ways to deliver protection While I agree with your idea I'd like to remember that there are previous steps: teach people to be less vulnerable. Teach people to be less greedy. Teach people the consequences of actions. Being less vulnerable is an obvious definition: know how to not fall for some scams. Less greedy: some scams revolve around the idea of quick and ease profits and the comeback is hurtful because the person thinks he would get x and ends up losing 500x. Consequences of actions: there's a lot of value to the group that observes the (bad) consequences of one actions. Pain, even from others, teaches something. The more we protect people from consequences, the better and safer it is about small losses until the actions go beyond the protection and the consequences are catastrophic.
- solatic 1y ago
  I fully agree that there's a different strategy for before the line is crossed, one that is often more humane, more freedom-respecting, and cheaper to boot. Too often those strategies are sadly under-funded. That's beside the point that the line, too often, is being crossed, and perpetrators are allowed to perpetuate their crimes, instead of the military and/or law enforcement stepping in and performing their organization's missions to protect us, especially the most vulnerable among us.
rafram 1y ago
Scammers can operate from literally any country in the world, in any location where they have access to the internet. The idea of the military busting into a Bin Laden-style scammer compound is very romantic, but plenty of these operate from regular offices or homes, and it’s trivial for someone new to get into the scamming business if a big scammer is taken down.
- solatic 1y ago
  People forget both why the US invaded Afghanistan in the first place, and why US financial sanctions are so effective. The US invaded Afghanistan, a country whose government was not directly involved in the 9/11 attacks, because that government refused to extradite OBL and other senior Taliban leadership, to bring them to justice in the United States. US financial sanctions are so effective because they cut off foreign institutions from the US financial system if those institutions do business with those who harm Americans and American interests. Soft power is backed by hard power, first against organizations hosted by governments willing to cooperate with the US, and eventually against governments unwilling to cooperate. That scammers can operate from anywhere is beside the point. More often than not, law enforcement and the military know where that is. A conscious decision is made not to prioritize or fund fighting it.
  - avianlyric 1y ago
    That’s easy when you’re dealing with people operating in countries where your existing relationship is poor or non-existent. There’s nothing practical that country can do to fight back against U.S. demands. But try applying that approach to India or China. Do you think those countries are going to allow the U.S. military to operate on their home turf, shooting at their citizens, and not retaliate? It doesn’t even have to be military retaliation, the U.S. economy is heavily intertwined with those countries, just look at the consequences of Trumps tariffs. Do you honestly think U.S. citizens would be willing to trade off the trade benefits of working with those countries, just so you run a military raid on building of scammers?
    - rafram 1y ago

deleted 1y ago

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woliveirajr 1y ago

>> Vulnerable members of society should be protected from scams. > There are three ways to deliver protection While I agree with your idea I'd like to remember that there are previous steps: teach people to be less vulnerable. Teach people to be less greedy. Teach people the consequences of actions. Being less vulnerable is an obvious definition: know how to not fall for some scams. Less greedy: some scams revolve around the idea of quick and ease profits and the comeback is hurtful because the person thinks he would get x and ends up losing 500x. Consequences of actions: there's a lot of value to the group that observes the (bad) consequences of one actions. Pain, even from others, teaches something. The more we protect people from consequences, the better and safer it is about small losses until the actions go beyond the protection and the consequences are catastrophic.

solatic 1y ago
I fully agree that there's a different strategy for before the line is crossed, one that is often more humane, more freedom-respecting, and cheaper to boot. Too often those strategies are sadly under-funded. That's beside the point that the line, too often, is being crossed, and perpetrators are allowed to perpetuate their crimes, instead of the military and/or law enforcement stepping in and performing their organization's missions to protect us, especially the most vulnerable among us.

rafram 1y ago

Scammers can operate from literally any country in the world, in any location where they have access to the internet. The idea of the military busting into a Bin Laden-style scammer compound is very romantic, but plenty of these operate from regular offices or homes, and it’s trivial for someone new to get into the scamming business if a big scammer is taken down.

solatic 1y ago
People forget both why the US invaded Afghanistan in the first place, and why US financial sanctions are so effective. The US invaded Afghanistan, a country whose government was not directly involved in the 9/11 attacks, because that government refused to extradite OBL and other senior Taliban leadership, to bring them to justice in the United States. US financial sanctions are so effective because they cut off foreign institutions from the US financial system if those institutions do business with those who harm Americans and American interests. Soft power is backed by hard power, first against organizations hosted by governments willing to cooperate with the US, and eventually against governments unwilling to cooperate. That scammers can operate from anywhere is beside the point. More often than not, law enforcement and the military know where that is. A conscious decision is made not to prioritize or fund fighting it.
- avianlyric 1y ago
  That’s easy when you’re dealing with people operating in countries where your existing relationship is poor or non-existent. There’s nothing practical that country can do to fight back against U.S. demands. But try applying that approach to India or China. Do you think those countries are going to allow the U.S. military to operate on their home turf, shooting at their citizens, and not retaliate? It doesn’t even have to be military retaliation, the U.S. economy is heavily intertwined with those countries, just look at the consequences of Trumps tariffs. Do you honestly think U.S. citizens would be willing to trade off the trade benefits of working with those countries, just so you run a military raid on building of scammers?
  - rafram 1y ago