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At a 1,000$ pricepoint I'm not so sure it will be good enough for the masses, especially for such a standard powered longboard setup. Longboards can be found f

At a 1,000$ pricepoint I'm not so sure it will be good enough for the masses, especially for such a standard powered longboard setup. Longboards can be found for 100$, add two 50$ brushless motors, a belt-drive setup and a controller, I don't think they can justify that profit margin. I'd expect that with a BMW StreetCarver truck setup, it would be a much easier sell (in fact I would probably buy one). With regards to the product design, I think you'll find the unsupported belt pulley to cause motor failure in normal use (these type of brushless motors are not designed for sideloading, even with dual ball bearings).

pg 14y ago
Like all technology it will get cheaper. Even now it seems empirically to be a good deal if you can afford it, judging from the reactions of the three YC partners that bought one.
- jonnycowboy 14y ago
  I'd like to add, I love the controller design. That alone must be worth a couple of hundred ;) Does it use bluetooth? I hope it is not a standard RC transmitter because they can get jammed fairly easily (leading to injury and death, etc etc) even on the new(ish) frequency-hopping 2.4Ghz models. PS. are you hiring ? ;)
  - eurleif 14y ago
    >they can get jammed fairly easily (leading to injury and death, etc etc) Wouldn't a failsafe that activated the brakes if contact with the remote were lost pretty much avoid any serious problems? I don't think getting rear-ended should be much of a concern, since the maximum speed is 20 MPH, and cars will (hopefully) be careful behind someone on a skateboard in general.
    - andrewjshults 14y ago
      Sudden deceleration (or acceleration) is probably the last thing you want if the remote disconnects. I'd guess some audible alarm letting you know the remote is no longer functioning + disconnecting the drive system (motors and brakes) so it functions as a regular skateboard would be the safest way to handle that issue.
      - eurleif 14y ago
        That might be less than ideal if you were going downhill. Or if you had accelerated to maximum speed, were heading toward an intersection, and planned to hit the brakes before you got there.
        exDM69 14y ago
        I speak from (literally) painful experience. You do not want to have a board decelerating under you, especially when going down hill. If you do not have a decent foot braking technique, you should not ride longboards downhill. Foot braking is (IMO) the most difficult part of longboarding and very easy to screw up, sometimes it's better to try to stay on the board than even attempt braking. A very slow brake application might be fine, but there has to be an alarm to the rider before that. Longboards are very dangerous. Usually it's fear and inadequate kicking technique that keeps you from going too fast. I hope that people riding these boards will learn breaking do not rely solely on the engines.
    - vacri 14y ago
      Perhaps it also has a weight switch - no weight detected on the board for a second or two and it powers down?
jonmrodriguez 14y ago
As far as the profit margin, one barrier to just building this yourself is the NRE for a suitable brushless motor controller that does speed control, handles unknown and varying load torque, and does motor braking. Or do you know of an existing alternative controller?
- jonnycowboy 14y ago
  They are using off-the-shelf brushless motor controllers (from what I can gather) and off-the-shelf brushless motors. There are many makers of ESCs with your requirements including from the now-ubiquitous HobbyKing, both sensored and sensorless (for RC car applications) including this one: http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__17234__Hobby_King_80A_Sensored_Sensorless_Car_ESC_1_8_1_5_.html http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__17234__Hobby_King... which will do variable engine braking as well.
  - skdoo 14y ago
    Our motor control ESCs, remote control electronics, battery management systems, and software are entirely custom. Off-the-shelf RC parts aren't smooth, reliable, safe, or quiet enough.
    - jonnycowboy 14y ago
      My bad, I misunderstood your comment that you were using "(relatively) cheap brushless motor controllers".
    - khafra 14y ago
      JohnnyCowboy's concern about early motor failure from the sideloading--do you have estimates on the mean mileage between component failures, and how much replacements would cost?
skdoo 14y ago
We're starting with a longboard setup that costs over $300 retail. The reason those sell is because they have lots of advantages over $100 longboards. We are still refining our transmission design, but even in its current form, we haven't had a bearing issue or motor failure in the past year of continuous and rigorous testing.
- Brashman 14y ago
  I've tended to find the $300+ price tags on Loaded boards to be a bit high, but they are head and shoulders much better than anything you can find for $100. This is really exciting to see a motorized version of an actual good longboard.
wheels 14y ago
They're expensive, but keep in mind that almost by the nature of the product, the customer base is going to be mostly 20-something urban professionals -- i.e. folks that make $1000 in two working days and are less likely to have a family cutting into their gadget fund.
- Tloewald 14y ago
  As a late 40s father of two who has never ridden a skateboard, I started researching how hard it would be to learn and whether I should get a conventional longboard skateboard to learn on while I wait. I think the website could use some FAQs targeted at non-skateboarders. This is a VERY compelling product, the price point is just fine. But I do want to know if I could, practically, learn to ride it from scratch in a few hours.
  - qbit 14y ago
    This might be inspirational for you: http://shelterpub.com/_lloyd/skateboard.html http://shelterpub.com/_lloyd/skateboard.html
  - calebmpeterson 14y ago
    I'm a bit younger and the father of two little boys; I had a very similar reaction. "Cool, I wonder how I can talk my sons into long boarding in the parks nearby when they get a little older." And yes, as someone who lives less than five miles from work, it is a VERY compelling product. The only problem is traffic. In normal suburban traffic a long board + a helmet would make a motorcycle look downright benign in the safety department.
TylerE 14y ago
Take a deep breath, step back, and read what you wrote. That's like saying, who would ever buy a MacBook Pro? Why, just can just buy a motherboard, a block of aluminium, some commodity chips. Just break out the vertical mill and soldering iron and spend a few weekends on it. Why spend $1300 on $500 of components?
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
bambax 14y ago
The battery itself is likely to add $400-600 to the total...
khafra 14y ago
Interesting point on durability. This product fits my use case, but at $1200, if I bought it and it breaks after 100 miles I would be very unhappy.

pg 14y ago

Like all technology it will get cheaper. Even now it seems empirically to be a good deal if you can afford it, judging from the reactions of the three YC partners that bought one.

jonnycowboy 14y ago
I'd like to add, I love the controller design. That alone must be worth a couple of hundred ;) Does it use bluetooth? I hope it is not a standard RC transmitter because they can get jammed fairly easily (leading to injury and death, etc etc) even on the new(ish) frequency-hopping 2.4Ghz models. PS. are you hiring ? ;)
- eurleif 14y ago
  >they can get jammed fairly easily (leading to injury and death, etc etc) Wouldn't a failsafe that activated the brakes if contact with the remote were lost pretty much avoid any serious problems? I don't think getting rear-ended should be much of a concern, since the maximum speed is 20 MPH, and cars will (hopefully) be careful behind someone on a skateboard in general.
  - andrewjshults 14y ago
    Sudden deceleration (or acceleration) is probably the last thing you want if the remote disconnects. I'd guess some audible alarm letting you know the remote is no longer functioning + disconnecting the drive system (motors and brakes) so it functions as a regular skateboard would be the safest way to handle that issue.
    - eurleif 14y ago
      That might be less than ideal if you were going downhill. Or if you had accelerated to maximum speed, were heading toward an intersection, and planned to hit the brakes before you got there.
      - exDM69 14y ago
        I speak from (literally) painful experience. You do not want to have a board decelerating under you, especially when going down hill. If you do not have a decent foot braking technique, you should not ride longboards downhill. Foot braking is (IMO) the most difficult part of longboarding and very easy to screw up, sometimes it's better to try to stay on the board than even attempt braking. A very slow brake application might be fine, but there has to be an alarm to the rider before that. Longboards are very dangerous. Usually it's fear and inadequate kicking technique that keeps you from going too fast. I hope that people riding these boards will learn breaking do not rely solely on the engines.
  - vacri 14y ago
    Perhaps it also has a weight switch - no weight detected on the board for a second or two and it powers down?

jonmrodriguez 14y ago

As far as the profit margin, one barrier to just building this yourself is the NRE for a suitable brushless motor controller that does speed control, handles unknown and varying load torque, and does motor braking. Or do you know of an existing alternative controller?

jonnycowboy 14y ago
They are using off-the-shelf brushless motor controllers (from what I can gather) and off-the-shelf brushless motors. There are many makers of ESCs with your requirements including from the now-ubiquitous HobbyKing, both sensored and sensorless (for RC car applications) including this one: http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__17234__Hobby_King_80A_Sensored_Sensorless_Car_ESC_1_8_1_5_.html http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__17234__Hobby_King... which will do variable engine braking as well.
- skdoo 14y ago
  Our motor control ESCs, remote control electronics, battery management systems, and software are entirely custom. Off-the-shelf RC parts aren't smooth, reliable, safe, or quiet enough.
  - jonnycowboy 14y ago
    My bad, I misunderstood your comment that you were using "(relatively) cheap brushless motor controllers".
  - khafra 14y ago
    JohnnyCowboy's concern about early motor failure from the sideloading--do you have estimates on the mean mileage between component failures, and how much replacements would cost?

skdoo 14y ago

We're starting with a longboard setup that costs over $300 retail. The reason those sell is because they have lots of advantages over $100 longboards. We are still refining our transmission design, but even in its current form, we haven't had a bearing issue or motor failure in the past year of continuous and rigorous testing.

Brashman 14y ago
I've tended to find the $300+ price tags on Loaded boards to be a bit high, but they are head and shoulders much better than anything you can find for $100. This is really exciting to see a motorized version of an actual good longboard.

wheels 14y ago

They're expensive, but keep in mind that almost by the nature of the product, the customer base is going to be mostly 20-something urban professionals -- i.e. folks that make $1000 in two working days and are less likely to have a family cutting into their gadget fund.

Tloewald 14y ago
As a late 40s father of two who has never ridden a skateboard, I started researching how hard it would be to learn and whether I should get a conventional longboard skateboard to learn on while I wait. I think the website could use some FAQs targeted at non-skateboarders. This is a VERY compelling product, the price point is just fine. But I do want to know if I could, practically, learn to ride it from scratch in a few hours.
- qbit 14y ago
  This might be inspirational for you: http://shelterpub.com/_lloyd/skateboard.html http://shelterpub.com/_lloyd/skateboard.html
- calebmpeterson 14y ago
  I'm a bit younger and the father of two little boys; I had a very similar reaction. "Cool, I wonder how I can talk my sons into long boarding in the parks nearby when they get a little older." And yes, as someone who lives less than five miles from work, it is a VERY compelling product. The only problem is traffic. In normal suburban traffic a long board + a helmet would make a motorcycle look downright benign in the safety department.

TylerE 14y ago

Take a deep breath, step back, and read what you wrote. That's like saying, who would ever buy a MacBook Pro? Why, just can just buy a motherboard, a block of aluminium, some commodity chips. Just break out the vertical mill and soldering iron and spend a few weekends on it. Why spend $1300 on $500 of components?

deleted 14y ago
[deleted]

bambax 14y ago

The battery itself is likely to add $400-600 to the total...

khafra 14y ago

Interesting point on durability. This product fits my use case, but at $1200, if I bought it and it breaks after 100 miles I would be very unhappy.