3 ms·

Speaking of forgotten fruit. The evolution of watermelon is fascinating. It happened in (relatively) recent human history and has really stark changes. There

Speaking of forgotten fruit. The evolution of watermelon is fascinating. It happened in (relatively) recent human history and has really stark changes. There are old paintings of watermelon from the 17th century and it looks nothing like modern watermelon. [1] Another wild human guided evolution is the evolution of the chicken. [2] That one literally happened in the last 100 years. A modern chicken is 3x larger than a chicken from the 1950s. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Watermelon#/media/File:Pasteques,_extrait_d'un_tableau_de_Giovanni_Stanchi.jpeg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Watermelon#/media/File:Pastequ... [2] https://www.zmescience.com/feature-post/how-chickens-tripled-in-size/ https://www.zmescience.com/feature-post/how-chickens-tripled...

webstrand 1y ago
I have trouble believing this, though I've heard it before. The watermelon in the painting looks exactly like the insides I've seen in my homegrown watermelons when things don't go right, i.e. under watered, not fully pollinated, or just underripe.
- lmm 1y ago
  That's pretty normal for selectively bred plants - under stressed or unusual conditions it reverts to the older phenotype.
- IAmBroom 1y ago
  You have trouble believing the contemporary painting is accurate? Look at the linked art.
  - Cpoll 1y ago
    No, their point is that the painting isn't evidence of changes, because they've seen modern watermelons that look the same.
vkou 1y ago
The watermelon in [1] is what you'll get when you try to grow one in your garden. The chicken in [2] is what you'll see when you look at a feral chicken.
- IAmBroom 1y ago
  If your watermelons look like [1], you are a bad gardener. Mine look supermarket-ready. And I've never heard of a feral chicken. How do they survive? And where? They are a fully domesticated species, with almost no defences. Flying 8' up to a branch is a major effort for them. My neighbor loses about half of them each year to predators, and they are kept in a coop at night.
  - HankStallone 1y ago
    Yeah, it's not that hard to grow good garden fruits and vegetables. Plant them at the right time in good soil, keep the weeds down (that's 95% of the job in the Midwest US), water them if it gets too dry, and watch out for pests. Do that, and your produce will be as good or better than what you can buy. I'd like to see a feral chicken too. Maybe they exist in regions with no natural predators. If mine aren't well-protected, I lose them to foxes during the day or coons at night.
bitwize 1y ago
I'm reminded of what we did to the pug, which used to look like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pug#/media/File:Henry_Bernard_Chalon_-_A_favourite_Pug_bitch_(1802).jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pug#/media/File:Henry_Bernard_... Some breeders are trying to breed these traits back in, yielding the "Retro Pug" unofficial breed. Even the old pug is quite a heavy hand we've exerted on dog evolution.
- IAmBroom 1y ago
  I have a hard time with owners of malformed dog breeds like this. Yes, they can be charming animals, but... it's like wanting to adopt a Down Syndrome child because you think they're cute. Don't use your money to promote breeding of animals that will predictably suffer due to inbred qualities.

webstrand 1y ago

I have trouble believing this, though I've heard it before. The watermelon in the painting looks exactly like the insides I've seen in my homegrown watermelons when things don't go right, i.e. under watered, not fully pollinated, or just underripe.

lmm 1y ago
That's pretty normal for selectively bred plants - under stressed or unusual conditions it reverts to the older phenotype.
IAmBroom 1y ago
You have trouble believing the contemporary painting is accurate? Look at the linked art.
- Cpoll 1y ago
  No, their point is that the painting isn't evidence of changes, because they've seen modern watermelons that look the same.

vkou 1y ago

The watermelon in [1] is what you'll get when you try to grow one in your garden. The chicken in [2] is what you'll see when you look at a feral chicken.

IAmBroom 1y ago
If your watermelons look like [1], you are a bad gardener. Mine look supermarket-ready. And I've never heard of a feral chicken. How do they survive? And where? They are a fully domesticated species, with almost no defences. Flying 8' up to a branch is a major effort for them. My neighbor loses about half of them each year to predators, and they are kept in a coop at night.
- HankStallone 1y ago
  Yeah, it's not that hard to grow good garden fruits and vegetables. Plant them at the right time in good soil, keep the weeds down (that's 95% of the job in the Midwest US), water them if it gets too dry, and watch out for pests. Do that, and your produce will be as good or better than what you can buy. I'd like to see a feral chicken too. Maybe they exist in regions with no natural predators. If mine aren't well-protected, I lose them to foxes during the day or coons at night.

bitwize 1y ago

I'm reminded of what we did to the pug, which used to look like this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pug#/media/File:Henry_Bernard_Chalon_-_A_favourite_Pug_bitch_(1802).jpg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pug#/media/File:Henry_Bernard_... Some breeders are trying to breed these traits back in, yielding the "Retro Pug" unofficial breed. Even the old pug is quite a heavy hand we've exerted on dog evolution.

IAmBroom 1y ago
I have a hard time with owners of malformed dog breeds like this. Yes, they can be charming animals, but... it's like wanting to adopt a Down Syndrome child because you think they're cute. Don't use your money to promote breeding of animals that will predictably suffer due to inbred qualities.