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I don't know much, so feel free to tell me if I'm wrong but a quick rebuttal of this article would point out how half of china's cities are sinking, their debt
by magicmicah85 1y ago
I don't know much, so feel free to tell me if I'm wrong but a quick rebuttal of this article would point out how half of china's cities are sinking, their debt to GDP ratio was 300% before a GDP revision and they ignore international patents and intellectual property. I'm happy that China lifted their people out of poverty, though. Their achievements are certainly real.
https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-68844731 https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-68844731
https://carnegieendowment.org/posts/2025/02/the-relationship-between-chinese-debt-and-chinas-trade-surplus?lang=en https://carnegieendowment.org/posts/2025/02/the-relationship...
https://www.hudson.org/technology/china-ignores-rule-of-law-to-dominate-global-telecommunications https://www.hudson.org/technology/china-ignores-rule-of-law-...
- ronsor 1y ago> ignore international patents and intellectual property I'm no CCP shill, but I wish we'd do that too.
- magicmicah85 1y agoWe'd be playing by the same rules in that case. And there are some companies that ignore that already. No AI company, to my knowledge, was built on ethically sourced material.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- _DeadFred_ 1y agoYes, let's end all reward for intellectual development other than directly through commercialization of products. That will help our society grow/think/learn.
- Buttons840 1y agoEvidently, yes. The evidence being that the country that ignored those incentives grew faster than us.
- _DeadFred_ 1y agoBecause they had access to what our incentives generated.
- ZeroGravitas 1y agoThey're now filing lots of patents and will get to use your "I planted a flag on some knowledge so now I control it" system against you.
- dheera 1y agoAlso, ignore international laws about the internet. No China website spews stupid GDPR popups. They don't listen to the EU, even if they have EU users. I don't think the US should, either. I don't disagree with privacy laws, but GDPR popups isn't it, and the US should grow its own. Don't set precedents that other countries can just make up laws and you'll just blindly follow them outside their jurisdiction.
- fsflover 1y agoGDPR popups are not about the law but about malicious compliance.
- riku_iki 1y ago> their debt to GDP ratio was 300% before a GDP revision government debt is 83% of GDP vs 123% for US as per: https://www.imf.org/external/datamapper/GG_DEBT_GDP@GDD/CHN/FRA/DEU/ITA/JPN/GBR/USA/FADGDWORLD https://www.imf.org/external/datamapper/GG_DEBT_GDP@GDD/CHN/... > they ignore international patents and intellectual property so what? They got what they want and won multiple markets without major consequences.
- _DeadFred_ 1y agoNow include state (not notional) debt, and state/national owned institutions.
- riku_iki 1y agothen we would need to include major US institutions debt too(for example top N banks)?
- _DeadFred_ 1y agoOnly those backed by government guarantee like China has for state owned business. So I guess up to the depositary insurance amounts? But that isn't debt, so no, it's not the same.
- riku_iki 1y agoWe can argue that US saved major banks in the past too, and not much prevents China from bankrupting state owned companies.
- Fricken 1y agoI recall, in my final year of high school, in 1995, reading a Sunday op-ed about China's rising prospects. The article predicted that China would surpass the west in the mid-2020s. I never forgot that prediction, and, like clockwork, here we are 30 years later. It's astonishing.
- magicmicah85 1y agoI've been watching the "China is going to fail" articles every few years and they just keep winning. The only option left for other superpowers is to just be competitive where you can be, cooperative where you have to be.
- maxglute 1y agoThe rebuttal to the classic Chinese collapse #s. - 300% is one measure of PRC aggregate debt that PRC collapsers want to compare with US government debt, ~120%. US aggregate debt is like 700-800%. - The cities are generally fine, the recent retarded 1/2 local gov "sinking" / revenue chart being passed around based on Shih/Elkobi study using none standard metrics. The chart itself collated by retard who doesn't know PRC cities receive lots of central gov funding (~60%), so structurally local gov can spend more % of local revenue paying off debt. Seems like they're 100% debt servicing when it's minority share. Or else you know... all the those cities would have collapsed from no service. Also PRC also does try to pay off debt when it's prudent i.e. the principle, instead of rolling YoY forever. Hence they still have much better borrowing rates. Yes LGFVs and some shadow debts get roll overs, but PRC also does structural deleveraging to actually pay off debt - why local gov debt repayment is high last few years. TLDR, think of PRC as household with ~1/2 the total debt as US, meanwhile PRC tries pays off principle and interest. US just largely services interest, but reserve currency allows a lot of stupid spending until spending catches up. I Why debt is fucking crazy in the states, is a political concern, except at the same time politicians can play fuckarounditis like it doesn't matter. A trillion here, a trillion there, and pretty soon you're talking bout real money. Maybe.
- advenai20 1y ago[dead]