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> That is quite the defeatist attitude. Society becoming shittier isn’t inevitable, though inaction and giving up certainly helps that along. The hypothetical

> That is quite the defeatist attitude. Society becoming shittier isn’t inevitable, though inaction and giving up certainly helps that along. The hypothetical that we're 8x as productive but the work isn't as fun isn't "society becoming shittier".

Steven420 1y ago
How is everyone working shitty jobs not "society becoming shittier"? Seems pretty awful
- furyofantares 1y ago
  "Society" is more than just software developers. We are very well paid for very cushy work. It's not good for anyone's work to get worse, but it's not a huge hit to society if a well-paid cushy job gets less cushy. And presumably people buy our work because it's valuable to them. Multiplying that by 8 would be a pretty big benefit to society. I don't want my job to get less fun, but I would press that button without hesitation. It would be an incredible trade for society at large.
  - codr7 1y ago
    If you think software development is cushy, I wonder what kind of software you're writing. Because there are different levels; getting something to work is not the same thing as writing maintainable, high quality software. I've seen plenty enough people try, really try, to get into software development; but they just can't do it.
  - bluefirebrand 1y ago
    My cushy software job has burned me out so badly that I am on medical leave with massive memory problems and a bit of concern about my heart So I mean... Yeah Is software more comfortable generally than many other lines of work? Yes probably Is it always soft and cushy? No, not at all. It is often high pressure and high stress
    - griffiths 1y ago
      What kind of massive memory problems? I might have this but didn't think to attribute it to burnout.
      - mrbombastic 1y ago
        Also asking for a friend…
        bluefirebrand 1y ago
        Really sorry to hear that All I can suggest is see a doctor as soon as possible and talk to them about it
      - ModernMech 1y ago
        When I burned out I experienced skill regression and short term memory loss. Like, an inability to remember specific events of the day before, inability to perform skills I had done for decades like play an instrument. Took over a year to stabilize and return to normal.
        bluefirebrand 1y ago
        Yes, this is extremely similar to my experience I cannot remember events, conversations, or details about important things. I have partially lost my ability to code, because I get partway through implementing a feature and forget what pieces I've done and which pieces still need to be done I can still write it, but the quality of my work has plummeted, which is part of why I'm off on leave now
        ModernMech 1y ago
        Hang in there, it gets better and the skills come back. From my github: 2,350 contributions in 2021 2,661 contributions in 2022 381 contributions in 2023 <--- burnout 794 contributions in 2024 <--- recovery 1,632 contributions in 2025 (so far) My recovery took about 18 months. It took time, and a lot of rest. I'd have to sleep like 12 hours a day sometimes.
  - pempem 1y ago
    Well lets think about it. Software devs jobs getting less cushy is no biggie. We can afford to amp up the efficiency. Teachers jobs got "less cushy" -> not great for users/consumers or the ppl in those jobs. Doctors jobs got "less cushy" -> not great for users/consumers or the ppl in those jobs. Even waiters/ check-out staff, stockists jobs at restaurants, groceries and AMZ got "less cushy" -> not great for users/consumers or the ppl in those jobs. at least not when you need to call someone for help. These things are not as disconnected as they seem. Businesses are in fact made up of people.
  - pdntspa 1y ago
    Maybe everybody's job should be cushy instead. We were not put on this earth to toil away for a bunch of rich fucks
  - advael 1y ago
    This places a lot of faith in the following assumptions: 1. Efficiency measures as written to benchmark this coupling with economic productivity overall 2. Monetary assessments of value in the context of businesses spending money corresponding with social value 3. The gains of economic productivity being distributed across society to any degree, or the effect of this disparity itself being negligible 4. The negative externalities of these processes scaling less quickly than whatever we're measuring in our productivity metric 5. Aforementioned externalities being able to scale to even a lesser degree in lockstep with productivity without crashing all of the above, if not causing even more catastrophic outcomes I have very little faith in any of these assumptions
anothernewdude 1y ago
Okay, but the reality of society becoming shittier is society becoming shittier.

Steven420 1y ago

How is everyone working shitty jobs not "society becoming shittier"? Seems pretty awful

furyofantares 1y ago
"Society" is more than just software developers. We are very well paid for very cushy work. It's not good for anyone's work to get worse, but it's not a huge hit to society if a well-paid cushy job gets less cushy. And presumably people buy our work because it's valuable to them. Multiplying that by 8 would be a pretty big benefit to society. I don't want my job to get less fun, but I would press that button without hesitation. It would be an incredible trade for society at large.
- codr7 1y ago
  If you think software development is cushy, I wonder what kind of software you're writing. Because there are different levels; getting something to work is not the same thing as writing maintainable, high quality software. I've seen plenty enough people try, really try, to get into software development; but they just can't do it.
- bluefirebrand 1y ago
  My cushy software job has burned me out so badly that I am on medical leave with massive memory problems and a bit of concern about my heart So I mean... Yeah Is software more comfortable generally than many other lines of work? Yes probably Is it always soft and cushy? No, not at all. It is often high pressure and high stress
  - griffiths 1y ago
    What kind of massive memory problems? I might have this but didn't think to attribute it to burnout.
    - mrbombastic 1y ago
      Also asking for a friend…
      - bluefirebrand 1y ago
        Really sorry to hear that All I can suggest is see a doctor as soon as possible and talk to them about it
    - ModernMech 1y ago
      When I burned out I experienced skill regression and short term memory loss. Like, an inability to remember specific events of the day before, inability to perform skills I had done for decades like play an instrument. Took over a year to stabilize and return to normal.
      - bluefirebrand 1y ago
        Yes, this is extremely similar to my experience I cannot remember events, conversations, or details about important things. I have partially lost my ability to code, because I get partway through implementing a feature and forget what pieces I've done and which pieces still need to be done I can still write it, but the quality of my work has plummeted, which is part of why I'm off on leave now
        ModernMech 1y ago
        Hang in there, it gets better and the skills come back. From my github: 2,350 contributions in 2021 2,661 contributions in 2022 381 contributions in 2023 <--- burnout 794 contributions in 2024 <--- recovery 1,632 contributions in 2025 (so far) My recovery took about 18 months. It took time, and a lot of rest. I'd have to sleep like 12 hours a day sometimes.
- pempem 1y ago
  Well lets think about it. Software devs jobs getting less cushy is no biggie. We can afford to amp up the efficiency. Teachers jobs got "less cushy" -> not great for users/consumers or the ppl in those jobs. Doctors jobs got "less cushy" -> not great for users/consumers or the ppl in those jobs. Even waiters/ check-out staff, stockists jobs at restaurants, groceries and AMZ got "less cushy" -> not great for users/consumers or the ppl in those jobs. at least not when you need to call someone for help. These things are not as disconnected as they seem. Businesses are in fact made up of people.
- pdntspa 1y ago
  Maybe everybody's job should be cushy instead. We were not put on this earth to toil away for a bunch of rich fucks
- advael 1y ago
  This places a lot of faith in the following assumptions: 1. Efficiency measures as written to benchmark this coupling with economic productivity overall 2. Monetary assessments of value in the context of businesses spending money corresponding with social value 3. The gains of economic productivity being distributed across society to any degree, or the effect of this disparity itself being negligible 4. The negative externalities of these processes scaling less quickly than whatever we're measuring in our productivity metric 5. Aforementioned externalities being able to scale to even a lesser degree in lockstep with productivity without crashing all of the above, if not causing even more catastrophic outcomes I have very little faith in any of these assumptions

anothernewdude 1y ago

Okay, but the reality of society becoming shittier is society becoming shittier.