8 ms·

The thing you have to understand is that the average Brit wants and possibly needs the government to tell them how to live their lives. It's a completely foreig

The thing you have to understand is that the average Brit wants and possibly needs the government to tell them how to live their lives. It's a completely foreign paradigm to the average American, though alarming "progress" has been made on the American front as of late.

torginus 1y ago
Are you (or do you know) many 'average Brits' who would agree with this statement (as applying to themselves)?
- luke727 1y ago
  I am not nor will I ever be a Brit, let alone an average one. But I live here and I have seen and heard things from seemingly average Brits. Would they describe themselves using my exact words? Doubtful. But what other conclusion can one draw from their observed behavior? The Online Safety Act in particular enjoys extraordinarily high support among the general public.
  - kypro 1y ago
    For what it's worth as a Brit I agree with you. When I talk to people in Britain about sugar-taxes, smoking bans, porn bans, hate-speech laws, etc, most people will explain that without these things people will say/do harmful things therefore the government should stop them. I remember when they started rolling out biometric facing scanning technology in stores and using it to ban people from all supermarkets within a designated area – basically forcing them to shop in smaller stores without these cameras or get their friends and family to buy their groceries. I thought this was utterly insane but to be horror Brits seem to almost universally support of this stuff because face scanning is a great way to identity people which private companies have flagged high-risk. Our opinion of others is very low, and are comfort with authoritarianism is relatively high.
    - luke727 1y ago
      It's disturbing to me that so much of this type of legislation originates with the "Conservatives", and the only viable alternative in Labour thinks this type of legislation doesn't go far enough. I guess at least things will be interesting with Farage in Number 10.
    - lazide 1y ago
      They think (like many Americans right now) that it will only be done against ‘those other people’. When they realize it’s been applied to them, it’s too late (they’ve been ‘othered’ now) and people will ignore them - or they’ll have to blame themselves or cover it up in order to fit in. It’s classic. Eventually, enough people will have been fucked by it that the numbers will shift back the other way - and then the opposite end of the pathology (not being able to recognize the main groups own needs enough to defend them or pull together as a coherent group) starts building. Lather, rinse, repeat.
  - tim333 1y ago
    >The Online Safety Act in particular enjoys extraordinarily high support among the general public does not mean >the average Brit wants and possibly needs the government to tell them how to live their lives The average Brit doesn't want foreign entities pushing porn and self harm / pro suicide stuff to their kids. Can you perhaps see the difference there? I notice most of the outrage in HN is from foreign entities wanting freedom to push whatever. The Brits are ok telling JD Vance et all chill.
    - throw7 1y ago
      The Brits can go bugger off and build their own China Firewall™.
    - account42 1y ago
      It does mean exactly that. If parents want to control what their kids see online they can take control of the situation and limit screen time to where it can be supervised. It might even make sense to have legislation to ensure that that is possible (that schools can't require devices for young children, that device makers need to implement effective parental controls, etc.). But that's not what the OSA is. Instead it's the government deciding how all kids should be parented. And of course it doesn't just affect the kids now because to be effective all adults need to prove they are not kids to view "harmful" materials, with all the chilling effects and collection of sensitive data that that entails. > I notice most of the outrage in HN is from foreign entities wanting freedom to push whatever. Hence the original acknowledgement: > The thing you have to understand is that the average Brit wants and possibly needs the government to tell them how to live their lives.
- PickledJesus 1y ago
  Obviously few would with that framing, but if they're given policies, lots of British people across the political spectrum would support ones that are more paternalistic. Support for the OSA is very high: https://yougov.co.uk/technology/articles/52693-how-have-britons-reacted-to-age-verification https://yougov.co.uk/technology/articles/52693-how-have-brit... British people are much happier with the state being paternalistic, across the political spectrum, it is a very strong differentiator between the US and the UK. "The government should do something!" You can see it in attitudes to the NHS, pensions, welfare. At its peak, in the 70s, 32% of people lived in social housing! Labour voters, young and old, are generally quite paternalistic. Lots of Conservative voters are too, depending on the flavour. The exceptions are the Lib Dems and some conservative tribes. I am consistently surprised when talking to highly-educated, politically engaged people, left or right, how much the default is that the state should act.
  - lazide 1y ago
    As much as US folks bemoan the ‘nanny state’, it’s because they look at the UK and cringe.
  - rdm_blackhole 1y ago
    We have the same issue in France as well. Why won't the government do something is the refrain that everyone including opposing parties are saying. God forbid anyone should take initiative on anything. And the state keeps on expanding year after year. I cannot remember the last time someone did not promise to shrink the state/government and once elected did a complete 180. It's bonkers.
sailorganymede 1y ago
Average Brit here - we do not like this and the way politics here has been so tumultuous has shown the general public are sick of this behaviour too.
- ghufran_syed 1y ago
  and yet they keep voting for blue labour or red labour…
  - inglor_cz 1y ago
    Current opinion polls for both are abysmal, but I don't think that civic freedoms are the main reason; the main reason is immigration, which all the previous governments promised to limit and then silently decided not to.
    - bigfudge 1y ago
      Decided not to, but continued to actively campaign on. It’s created a really weird situation where the actual policy choices are hugely disconnected from the rhetoric and emotion in the debate. Legal immigration from South Asia dominates illegal immigration by an order of magnitude, but nobody wants to lose seats in Birmingham, so essentially doesn’t figure in the arguments about small numbers of afghans in miserable hotels in Essex.
    - pydry 1y ago
      Immigration is sucking support more from the tories than labour. They rode into power based upon a promise to do something about it and then massively increased it. Labour are recently leaning into being anti immigration because it's one of the few wealthy-donor-friendly policies they can pursue which will potentially gain them votes.
    - tomatocracy 1y ago
      For the Conservatives it's all about irregular/illegal immigration. Labour are hugely unpopular on that having apparently no idea what to do about it but they also have massive challenges on the economy/cost of living and the state of publicly funded services.
_nada 1y ago
[flagged]
- luke727 1y ago
  My comment provoked you enough to create an account just to make a throwaway insult reply to it. I think perhaps it hit closer to home than you would care to acknolwedge.
  - kachapopopow 1y ago
    they're kinda right, in europe we really don't give a shit about politics and if we do you're doing something wrong.
    - luke727 1y ago
      You should give a shit because Europe is on its way to implementing its own horrible legislation [0]. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulation_to_Prevent_and_Combat_Child_Sexual_Abuse https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulation_to_Prevent_and_Comb...
      - monkey_monkey 1y ago
        https://legiscan.com/MS/text/HB1126/id/2988284 https://legiscan.com/MS/text/HB1126/id/2988284 America ! America! God Shine Her Light On Theeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
        account42 1y ago
        In what way is this supposed to be a response to the statement that Europeans should give a shit a bout chat control? Do you think this is a contest where as long as you can find other countries with similar shit you don't score last?
    - throwaway65042 1y ago
      Going by that reasoning someone must be clearly doing something wrong considering they seem to voice their political will at about the same rate as the politically active Americans. Turnout in the latest presidential/general elections: 2025 German federal election 82.5% 2024 United Kingdom general election 59.7% 2022 French presidential election 73.69%(I)/71.99%(II) 2022 Italian general election 63.85% 2023 Spanish general election 66.6% 2024 United States presidential election 64.1%
choult 1y ago
[flagged]
- luke727 1y ago
  I'm speaking like someone who has to live with the consequences of horrible legislation like this because I live here.
DrBazza 1y ago
No. We were typically indifferent to our Government. Very much a case of 'go to the Winchester, have a nice cold pint, and wait for all of this to blow over.' But substitute 'tea'. But in the last couple of decades, things have changed. Arguably, a public referendum in 2016, was very much a protest vote against several Parliaments that didn't listen to its citizens. And the last decade shows nothing has changed. My friends and family, and myself included, were never very political, and very much a case of 'No Matter Who You Vote For The Government Always Gets In', but now everyone is talking about the Government. Interesting times ahead.
- boppo1 1y ago
  > now everyone is talking about the Government How are they talking about it?
nly 1y ago
The average Brit isn't even aware this is happening. The OSA is the first time people may actually notice, because their porn habits will be disrupted.
lttlrck 1y ago
There is a kernel of truth. But I think you are, maybe to a large extent, misattributing political apathy.
- account42 1y ago
  Apathy is approval of the status quo.
Yeul 1y ago
The average American needs church to tell them how to live. And there are now openly right wing Christians in government...

torginus 1y ago

Are you (or do you know) many 'average Brits' who would agree with this statement (as applying to themselves)?

luke727 1y ago
I am not nor will I ever be a Brit, let alone an average one. But I live here and I have seen and heard things from seemingly average Brits. Would they describe themselves using my exact words? Doubtful. But what other conclusion can one draw from their observed behavior? The Online Safety Act in particular enjoys extraordinarily high support among the general public.
- kypro 1y ago
  For what it's worth as a Brit I agree with you. When I talk to people in Britain about sugar-taxes, smoking bans, porn bans, hate-speech laws, etc, most people will explain that without these things people will say/do harmful things therefore the government should stop them. I remember when they started rolling out biometric facing scanning technology in stores and using it to ban people from all supermarkets within a designated area – basically forcing them to shop in smaller stores without these cameras or get their friends and family to buy their groceries. I thought this was utterly insane but to be horror Brits seem to almost universally support of this stuff because face scanning is a great way to identity people which private companies have flagged high-risk. Our opinion of others is very low, and are comfort with authoritarianism is relatively high.
  - luke727 1y ago
    It's disturbing to me that so much of this type of legislation originates with the "Conservatives", and the only viable alternative in Labour thinks this type of legislation doesn't go far enough. I guess at least things will be interesting with Farage in Number 10.
  - lazide 1y ago
    They think (like many Americans right now) that it will only be done against ‘those other people’. When they realize it’s been applied to them, it’s too late (they’ve been ‘othered’ now) and people will ignore them - or they’ll have to blame themselves or cover it up in order to fit in. It’s classic. Eventually, enough people will have been fucked by it that the numbers will shift back the other way - and then the opposite end of the pathology (not being able to recognize the main groups own needs enough to defend them or pull together as a coherent group) starts building. Lather, rinse, repeat.
- tim333 1y ago
  >The Online Safety Act in particular enjoys extraordinarily high support among the general public does not mean >the average Brit wants and possibly needs the government to tell them how to live their lives The average Brit doesn't want foreign entities pushing porn and self harm / pro suicide stuff to their kids. Can you perhaps see the difference there? I notice most of the outrage in HN is from foreign entities wanting freedom to push whatever. The Brits are ok telling JD Vance et all chill.
  - throw7 1y ago
    The Brits can go bugger off and build their own China Firewall™.
  - account42 1y ago
    It does mean exactly that. If parents want to control what their kids see online they can take control of the situation and limit screen time to where it can be supervised. It might even make sense to have legislation to ensure that that is possible (that schools can't require devices for young children, that device makers need to implement effective parental controls, etc.). But that's not what the OSA is. Instead it's the government deciding how all kids should be parented. And of course it doesn't just affect the kids now because to be effective all adults need to prove they are not kids to view "harmful" materials, with all the chilling effects and collection of sensitive data that that entails. > I notice most of the outrage in HN is from foreign entities wanting freedom to push whatever. Hence the original acknowledgement: > The thing you have to understand is that the average Brit wants and possibly needs the government to tell them how to live their lives.
PickledJesus 1y ago
Obviously few would with that framing, but if they're given policies, lots of British people across the political spectrum would support ones that are more paternalistic. Support for the OSA is very high: https://yougov.co.uk/technology/articles/52693-how-have-britons-reacted-to-age-verification https://yougov.co.uk/technology/articles/52693-how-have-brit... British people are much happier with the state being paternalistic, across the political spectrum, it is a very strong differentiator between the US and the UK. "The government should do something!" You can see it in attitudes to the NHS, pensions, welfare. At its peak, in the 70s, 32% of people lived in social housing! Labour voters, young and old, are generally quite paternalistic. Lots of Conservative voters are too, depending on the flavour. The exceptions are the Lib Dems and some conservative tribes. I am consistently surprised when talking to highly-educated, politically engaged people, left or right, how much the default is that the state should act.
- lazide 1y ago
  As much as US folks bemoan the ‘nanny state’, it’s because they look at the UK and cringe.
- rdm_blackhole 1y ago
  We have the same issue in France as well. Why won't the government do something is the refrain that everyone including opposing parties are saying. God forbid anyone should take initiative on anything. And the state keeps on expanding year after year. I cannot remember the last time someone did not promise to shrink the state/government and once elected did a complete 180. It's bonkers.

sailorganymede 1y ago

Average Brit here - we do not like this and the way politics here has been so tumultuous has shown the general public are sick of this behaviour too.

ghufran_syed 1y ago
and yet they keep voting for blue labour or red labour…
- inglor_cz 1y ago
  Current opinion polls for both are abysmal, but I don't think that civic freedoms are the main reason; the main reason is immigration, which all the previous governments promised to limit and then silently decided not to.
  - bigfudge 1y ago
    Decided not to, but continued to actively campaign on. It’s created a really weird situation where the actual policy choices are hugely disconnected from the rhetoric and emotion in the debate. Legal immigration from South Asia dominates illegal immigration by an order of magnitude, but nobody wants to lose seats in Birmingham, so essentially doesn’t figure in the arguments about small numbers of afghans in miserable hotels in Essex.
  - pydry 1y ago
    Immigration is sucking support more from the tories than labour. They rode into power based upon a promise to do something about it and then massively increased it. Labour are recently leaning into being anti immigration because it's one of the few wealthy-donor-friendly policies they can pursue which will potentially gain them votes.
  - tomatocracy 1y ago
    For the Conservatives it's all about irregular/illegal immigration. Labour are hugely unpopular on that having apparently no idea what to do about it but they also have massive challenges on the economy/cost of living and the state of publicly funded services.

_nada 1y ago

[flagged]

luke727 1y ago
My comment provoked you enough to create an account just to make a throwaway insult reply to it. I think perhaps it hit closer to home than you would care to acknolwedge.
- kachapopopow 1y ago
  they're kinda right, in europe we really don't give a shit about politics and if we do you're doing something wrong.
  - luke727 1y ago
    You should give a shit because Europe is on its way to implementing its own horrible legislation [0]. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulation_to_Prevent_and_Combat_Child_Sexual_Abuse https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulation_to_Prevent_and_Comb...
    - monkey_monkey 1y ago
      https://legiscan.com/MS/text/HB1126/id/2988284 https://legiscan.com/MS/text/HB1126/id/2988284 America ! America! God Shine Her Light On Theeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
      - account42 1y ago
        In what way is this supposed to be a response to the statement that Europeans should give a shit a bout chat control? Do you think this is a contest where as long as you can find other countries with similar shit you don't score last?
  - throwaway65042 1y ago
    Going by that reasoning someone must be clearly doing something wrong considering they seem to voice their political will at about the same rate as the politically active Americans. Turnout in the latest presidential/general elections: 2025 German federal election 82.5% 2024 United Kingdom general election 59.7% 2022 French presidential election 73.69%(I)/71.99%(II) 2022 Italian general election 63.85% 2023 Spanish general election 66.6% 2024 United States presidential election 64.1%

choult 1y ago

[flagged]

luke727 1y ago
I'm speaking like someone who has to live with the consequences of horrible legislation like this because I live here.

DrBazza 1y ago

No. We were typically indifferent to our Government. Very much a case of 'go to the Winchester, have a nice cold pint, and wait for all of this to blow over.' But substitute 'tea'. But in the last couple of decades, things have changed. Arguably, a public referendum in 2016, was very much a protest vote against several Parliaments that didn't listen to its citizens. And the last decade shows nothing has changed. My friends and family, and myself included, were never very political, and very much a case of 'No Matter Who You Vote For The Government Always Gets In', but now everyone is talking about the Government. Interesting times ahead.

boppo1 1y ago
> now everyone is talking about the Government How are they talking about it?

nly 1y ago

The average Brit isn't even aware this is happening. The OSA is the first time people may actually notice, because their porn habits will be disrupted.

lttlrck 1y ago

There is a kernel of truth. But I think you are, maybe to a large extent, misattributing political apathy.

account42 1y ago
Apathy is approval of the status quo.

Yeul 1y ago

The average American needs church to tell them how to live. And there are now openly right wing Christians in government...