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Unless you have good insurance, and then you get everything, the best, the quickest. Australia is a joke compared to healthcare in the US with good insurance.

Unless you have good insurance, and then you get everything, the best, the quickest. Australia is a joke compared to healthcare in the US with good insurance. Now, the US sucks really bad if you don't have good insurance / any insurance....

XorNot 1y ago
Such as? Have you ever had a major medical event using your health insurance in America? "We have the best!". But like, so do dictators of 3rd world countries. Do you actually have access to the best care? Are you sure? Because about 1 in 10 Americans are uninsured[1] and a substantially larger percentage are underinsured[2]. Meanwhile Australian life expectancy is higher then America[3] (I mean let's be fair: most of the western world's life expectancy is higher then America...I wonder what common trait most of those places have...) [1] https://www.kff.org/uninsured/key-facts-about-the-uninsured-population/ https://www.kff.org/uninsured/key-facts-about-the-uninsured-... [2] https://www.forbes.com/sites/joshuacohen/2024/01/01/us-healthcare-system-leaves-far-too-many-people-underinsured/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/joshuacohen/2024/01/01/us-healt... [3] https://www.psu.edu/news/research/story/australia-offers-lessons-increasing-american-life-expectancy https://www.psu.edu/news/research/story/australia-offers-les...
- lurking_swe 1y ago
  I don’t disagree about the overall healthcare system being broken in the US, but I find it pretty funny that you replied to that person with more arguments about how healthcare sucks for the average person… When they were discussing healthcare being excellent for folks with great insurance. you two are talking past each other, and talking about two different cohorts of people.
  - XorNot 1y ago
    The person talking about "good insurance" provided no examples of even what that statement is meant to mean, or what they actually expected to get from it. Just "the best care ever", no qualifiers, examples and no indication of costs. Just what does "good healthcare" in America get you, that you imagine people in other countries do not get?
    - lurking_swe 1y ago
      Good question. I actually think the US should have a healthcare system more like other countries, don’t get me wrong. But I can directly answer your question, as someone who lives in the U.S. and is very happy with the care i receive. In the U.S. i’d consider good health insurance to be: - low monthly premiums (majority of cost is covered by a generous employer). Say $30-50 per paycheck for a single adult. - A PPO plan, not an HMO (HMO limits your options when picking doctors). - A plan that does NOT require pre-authorizations for most procedures and tests. They are a pain in the butt. And many crappy insurance companies like United Healthcare tend to auto-deny many things as “not medically necessary”. - A medical plan that covers almost every non-experimental drug prescription, at low cost ($30 or less). Including antibiotics, EpiPen, GLP-1 (Ozempic), inhalers, etc. - A reasonably low annual out-of-pocket max, say $2,500 or less? ALL costs after that max are fully covered by insurance. So you have peace of mind if something really bad happens. - $0 or very low deductible for seeing your doctor. Also a very low coinsurance rate, say 20% or less. Coinsurance is the % of the bill you pay before your insurance covers the remainder. All the above basically means, “low stress” when you get sick or into an accident, or get pregnant. What does good “care” look like? I think we all know. In the U.S. this is _very_ region dependent. Most people don’t consider this when buying a home for some reason lol. There are many cities with excellent hospitals and medical centers and also some top notch hospitals GLOBALLY. And then there are many “medical deserts”, typically cheaper areas to live, where care is harder to come by. Examples of good care: - QUICK access to your primary doctor/PCP (within 1-2 weeks) - ability to get care urgently, within a days notice, from another doctor. urgent care, etc. - ability to see a specialist within 3 months, ideally less than 1 month. Yes this is possible in some parts of the U.S. believe it or not. - Living near (45 min or less) a major, well-rated hospital, in case you have a heart attack, get into a nasty car accident, etc. The unfortunate truth is a LOT of americans are in a “healthcare desert”, or they are poor and can’t afford care, or their employers are not generous and offer them crappy plans. For example where the out of pocket max is $15k lol. Or where monthly premiums for a single person are $400. The US is not a fun place to live if you’re lower class or lower-middle class. And our healthcare system is a confusing mess. :)
    - danielmarkbruce 1y ago
      "good" is a relative term. In health care insurance world, it's the expensive plans, with broad coverage, and the best facilities in network (who participate in research and are at the forefront of treatment - MD Anderson, Mayo, Cleveland, Sloan Kettering etc). You get fast access to the best facilities with the best doctors and best treatments. Maybe look at the rankings of best treatment facilities globally. Here is the list for oncology. Choose any dropdown you like. You are going to see a lot of "US" at the top. https://rankings.newsweek.com/worlds-best-specialized-hospitals-2025/oncology https://rankings.newsweek.com/worlds-best-specialized-hospit...
- danielmarkbruce 1y ago
  Yes, I'm sure I do. Yes, several, both in the US and Australia. You seem to not understand what "good" is. You do at least seem to agree with my second point....
mrguyorama 1y ago
>Unless you have good insurance This magical "good insurance" doesn't exist, because it's not up to the insurance company. Scheduling is controlled by the hospital. Right now american hospitals are insanely booked out, and have been for many years. There's no magical insurance that bumps someone else out of the line. If you aren't experiencing 3 month delays for non-emergency medicine, it's not that you have "good insurance", it's that you live in a place where the local medical infrastructure is seriously underutilized. This might mean you just live in a rich enough place where more hospitals than needed were built, or it could mean that a lot of your neighbors just aren't getting the healthcare the local hospitals were expecting to serve. Or maybe what you are hinting at is that in your state, the affordable health insurance for most people doesn't actually get them any real treatment options, so only very wealthy people can afford to actually get treated, so hospitals around you don't do much healing. And that's fucking ghastly and should be seen as the abhorrent thing it is. You have hospitals around you that are not treating people even though there are plenty of people needing healthcare. A lot of resources were already spent building that hospital and training doctors and we are not utilizing those resources because of some abhorrent "but then I might have to wait a month for a completely non-threatening medical concern" ideology. Yes, that's called efficient use of resources. Triage is a core part of healthcare. Sometimes that means someone else gets treated before you, and that's because they need it more than you do.
- danielmarkbruce 1y ago
  So you agree that people with good health insurance have access to insanely good health care. I didn't say "affordable". I said good.

XorNot 1y ago

Such as? Have you ever had a major medical event using your health insurance in America? "We have the best!". But like, so do dictators of 3rd world countries. Do you actually have access to the best care? Are you sure? Because about 1 in 10 Americans are uninsured[1] and a substantially larger percentage are underinsured[2]. Meanwhile Australian life expectancy is higher then America[3] (I mean let's be fair: most of the western world's life expectancy is higher then America...I wonder what common trait most of those places have...) [1] https://www.kff.org/uninsured/key-facts-about-the-uninsured-population/ https://www.kff.org/uninsured/key-facts-about-the-uninsured-... [2] https://www.forbes.com/sites/joshuacohen/2024/01/01/us-healthcare-system-leaves-far-too-many-people-underinsured/ https://www.forbes.com/sites/joshuacohen/2024/01/01/us-healt... [3] https://www.psu.edu/news/research/story/australia-offers-lessons-increasing-american-life-expectancy https://www.psu.edu/news/research/story/australia-offers-les...

lurking_swe 1y ago
I don’t disagree about the overall healthcare system being broken in the US, but I find it pretty funny that you replied to that person with more arguments about how healthcare sucks for the average person… When they were discussing healthcare being excellent for folks with great insurance. you two are talking past each other, and talking about two different cohorts of people.
- XorNot 1y ago
  The person talking about "good insurance" provided no examples of even what that statement is meant to mean, or what they actually expected to get from it. Just "the best care ever", no qualifiers, examples and no indication of costs. Just what does "good healthcare" in America get you, that you imagine people in other countries do not get?
  - lurking_swe 1y ago
    Good question. I actually think the US should have a healthcare system more like other countries, don’t get me wrong. But I can directly answer your question, as someone who lives in the U.S. and is very happy with the care i receive. In the U.S. i’d consider good health insurance to be: - low monthly premiums (majority of cost is covered by a generous employer). Say $30-50 per paycheck for a single adult. - A PPO plan, not an HMO (HMO limits your options when picking doctors). - A plan that does NOT require pre-authorizations for most procedures and tests. They are a pain in the butt. And many crappy insurance companies like United Healthcare tend to auto-deny many things as “not medically necessary”. - A medical plan that covers almost every non-experimental drug prescription, at low cost ($30 or less). Including antibiotics, EpiPen, GLP-1 (Ozempic), inhalers, etc. - A reasonably low annual out-of-pocket max, say $2,500 or less? ALL costs after that max are fully covered by insurance. So you have peace of mind if something really bad happens. - $0 or very low deductible for seeing your doctor. Also a very low coinsurance rate, say 20% or less. Coinsurance is the % of the bill you pay before your insurance covers the remainder. All the above basically means, “low stress” when you get sick or into an accident, or get pregnant. What does good “care” look like? I think we all know. In the U.S. this is _very_ region dependent. Most people don’t consider this when buying a home for some reason lol. There are many cities with excellent hospitals and medical centers and also some top notch hospitals GLOBALLY. And then there are many “medical deserts”, typically cheaper areas to live, where care is harder to come by. Examples of good care: - QUICK access to your primary doctor/PCP (within 1-2 weeks) - ability to get care urgently, within a days notice, from another doctor. urgent care, etc. - ability to see a specialist within 3 months, ideally less than 1 month. Yes this is possible in some parts of the U.S. believe it or not. - Living near (45 min or less) a major, well-rated hospital, in case you have a heart attack, get into a nasty car accident, etc. The unfortunate truth is a LOT of americans are in a “healthcare desert”, or they are poor and can’t afford care, or their employers are not generous and offer them crappy plans. For example where the out of pocket max is $15k lol. Or where monthly premiums for a single person are $400. The US is not a fun place to live if you’re lower class or lower-middle class. And our healthcare system is a confusing mess. :)
  - danielmarkbruce 1y ago
    "good" is a relative term. In health care insurance world, it's the expensive plans, with broad coverage, and the best facilities in network (who participate in research and are at the forefront of treatment - MD Anderson, Mayo, Cleveland, Sloan Kettering etc). You get fast access to the best facilities with the best doctors and best treatments. Maybe look at the rankings of best treatment facilities globally. Here is the list for oncology. Choose any dropdown you like. You are going to see a lot of "US" at the top. https://rankings.newsweek.com/worlds-best-specialized-hospitals-2025/oncology https://rankings.newsweek.com/worlds-best-specialized-hospit...
danielmarkbruce 1y ago
Yes, I'm sure I do. Yes, several, both in the US and Australia. You seem to not understand what "good" is. You do at least seem to agree with my second point....

mrguyorama 1y ago

>Unless you have good insurance This magical "good insurance" doesn't exist, because it's not up to the insurance company. Scheduling is controlled by the hospital. Right now american hospitals are insanely booked out, and have been for many years. There's no magical insurance that bumps someone else out of the line. If you aren't experiencing 3 month delays for non-emergency medicine, it's not that you have "good insurance", it's that you live in a place where the local medical infrastructure is seriously underutilized. This might mean you just live in a rich enough place where more hospitals than needed were built, or it could mean that a lot of your neighbors just aren't getting the healthcare the local hospitals were expecting to serve. Or maybe what you are hinting at is that in your state, the affordable health insurance for most people doesn't actually get them any real treatment options, so only very wealthy people can afford to actually get treated, so hospitals around you don't do much healing. And that's fucking ghastly and should be seen as the abhorrent thing it is. You have hospitals around you that are not treating people even though there are plenty of people needing healthcare. A lot of resources were already spent building that hospital and training doctors and we are not utilizing those resources because of some abhorrent "but then I might have to wait a month for a completely non-threatening medical concern" ideology. Yes, that's called efficient use of resources. Triage is a core part of healthcare. Sometimes that means someone else gets treated before you, and that's because they need it more than you do.

danielmarkbruce 1y ago
So you agree that people with good health insurance have access to insanely good health care. I didn't say "affordable". I said good.