5 ms·

I do care about would-be founders' opinions, but surely I don't have to use every essay I write to convince people to apply to YC. I've already written elsewhe

by pg 14y ago

I do care about would-be founders' opinions, but surely I don't have to use every essay I write to convince people to apply to YC. I've already written elsewhere about the founder's eye view of YC (e.g. http://ycombinator.com/atyc.html http://ycombinator.com/atyc.html). This essay is just an exploration of the strangeness of startup investing as a business. The goal is not to convince anyone to do anything.

thaumaturgy 14y ago
Off-topic, but something I've been chewing on lately: what's it like to have your every written (or spoken!) word analyzed by a bunch of people? Esp. people that you end up having some form of contact with. It seems like it would be difficult to just have a public conversation about a topic. Do you think about that much when you write?
- pg 14y ago
  It's pretty grim. I think that's one of the reasons I write fewer essays now. After I wrote this one, I had to go back and armor it by pre-empting anything I could imagine anyone willfully misunderstanding to use as a weapon in comment threads. The whole of footnote 1 is such armor for example. I essentially anticipated all the "No, what I said was" type comments I'd have had to make on HN and just included them in the essay. It's a uniquely bad combination to both write essays and run a forum. It's like having comments enabled on your blog whether you want them or not.
  - cperciva 14y ago
    Having people pick over every detail of what I write is something I like about HN -- it forces me to think more carefully about what I'm saying, and on a few occasions (tptacek, I'm looking at you) has even prompted me to go back and write further blog posts about specific points. Of course, my blog posts don't get nearly as much attention as your essays, and I don't have the problem of having people try to draw attention to themselves in the hopes of being remembered when applications are considered for the next YC round.
    - thaumaturgy 14y ago
      I can't tell here if you're just off-hand mentioning something you like about HN, or if you're also suggesting that it's something other people should like too. Your posts are more technical in nature, and can benefit from debate. Other people might write things that are more personal, or opinion, or thinking-aloud, and while a little bit of good-natured feedback from trusted people might be appreciated, lots of nitpicking and debate and very public arguing is not.
      - cperciva 14y ago
        I can't tell here if you're just off-hand mentioning something you like about HN, or if you're also suggesting that it's something other people should like too. The point I was trying to make was that I would be disappointed if what pg clearly saw as a problem was "fixed", because for me it's a feature.
        thaumaturgy 14y ago
        For you it is, for others it is not. You would be disappointed, others would be contented. (I'm not picking on you btw, I have a tremendous amount of respect for you. But I don't think your desire for debate on what you write is suitable justification for other people putting up with the same, especially when it's discouraging them from writing.)
        cperciva 14y ago
        I claim no privileged position for my preferences. I was just stating what they were. :-)
        RickHull 14y ago
        You should have preempted this thread with more armor.
  - deleted 14y ago
    [deleted]
  - jseliger 14y ago
    Well, I still enjoy your essays. Let this comment be the generic encouragement of those who aren't trying to pointless dispute and who are usually silent. At least some of the people who are questioning you are probably doing so out of intellectual curiosity, rather than animosity. You probably know that intellectually, but for many people—including me—it's sometimes hard to remember that in the heat of the reading moment.
    - Poiesis 14y ago
      I hope this buried comment isn't overlooked, but let me caution the reader that intellectual curiosity is often interpreted as animosity. It took me many years to realize that my constant barrage of questions on, well, anything was offputing to a significant fraction of people I interacted with. Perhaps this is obvious to many of you, but it was not to me.
  - notJim 14y ago
    > I had to go back and armor it by pre-empting anything I could imagine anyone willfully misunderstanding to use as a weapon in comment threads This is perhaps the worst thing about discourse on the internet. If you and I were having a conversation in room, you'd never pretend to not understand me to rip into me (maybe to understand my point better.) But on the internet, so many people are just trying to score points that it's nearly impossible to have a conversation.
  - dave1619 14y ago
    PG, thanks for writing the essays. They're definitely thought-provoking and a lot of people appreciate them. Keep writing. :)
  - ctl 14y ago
    After I wrote this one, I had to go back and armor it by pre-empting anything I could imagine anyone willfully misunderstanding to use as a weapon in comment threads. The whole of footnote 1 is such armor for example. You don't give your detractors enough credit. Many of these misunderstandings are not willful, and actively seeking to avoid them is almost always good practice on your part. (In my opinion.) For the record, I found footnote 1 illuminating. I'm sure that the intense scrutiny you get would annoy any writer. But I think it genuinely makes your essays stronger, too, and I hope you don't hate it too much.
  - richardw 14y ago
    Two thoughts. 1, that's terrible. So many benefit from the ability to read (and interact with) your opinions. It's so much more valuable than a random once-off Reddit AMA. It's a shame the value is reduced through the actions of a few. 2, this community attracts young smart people, exactly those who might want to match wits with you. Some of it is valuable, some is just annoying. I'm reminded of the niceness value in discussion; if everyone was nice about it, maybe you wouldn't feel as apprehensive or besieged and we could still have a good debate to extract the maximum benefit. In the end, I hope you find some way to care less about the opinions, because what you do and write about are so valuable. In the spirit of "If you aren't writing enough wrong stuff, maybe you're being too cautious."
  - brlewis 14y ago
    When I saw this comment (before reading the essay) I was ready to decry this armoring. But now, having read the essay, I think it's a good thing. This essay flows nicely and is clear. Footnote 1 is a good clarification, especially if someone hadn't read your other essays. I think at least half of the misunderstandings that arise in HN comment threads are honest misunderstandings.
    - pg 14y ago
      That seems a reasonable estimate, but it means up to half are dishonest misunderstandings, which is quite a lot if you think about it.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
cperciva 14y ago
You're missing my point -- I was objecting to the "(at least among the innumerate)" bit. It would hurt YC's reputation among everybody who matters, whether innumerate or not, if 70% of YC companies didn't survive past Demo Day.
- csallen 14y ago
  Hence the "at least", no?
  - cperciva 14y ago
    Maybe this is just idiomatic, but when I see "it is thought (at least by people with property foo) that...", I read the parenthetical comment as meaning "people without property foo don't think this way".
Alex3917 14y ago
"I do care about would-be founders' opinions, but surely I don't have to use every essay I write to convince people to apply to YC." The essay reminds me a bit of the argument that the Native Americans actually got a great deal when they sold Manhattan for $24, because that money would be worth about $30 trillion today if it had been invested at a return of just 7.5% for the past 385 years. I think it's interesting and worthwhile to explore these sorts of mathematical ideas, but at the same time it's impossible to make good business decisions without fundamentally basing them on human needs, human scales, and human timeframes.
fleitz 14y ago
Do you think it might be possible to run this kind of program under a separate brand, similar to the relationship between Touchstone and Disney?

by pg 14y ago

thaumaturgy 14y ago

Off-topic, but something I've been chewing on lately: what's it like to have your every written (or spoken!) word analyzed by a bunch of people? Esp. people that you end up having some form of contact with. It seems like it would be difficult to just have a public conversation about a topic. Do you think about that much when you write?

pg 14y ago
It's pretty grim. I think that's one of the reasons I write fewer essays now. After I wrote this one, I had to go back and armor it by pre-empting anything I could imagine anyone willfully misunderstanding to use as a weapon in comment threads. The whole of footnote 1 is such armor for example. I essentially anticipated all the "No, what I said was" type comments I'd have had to make on HN and just included them in the essay. It's a uniquely bad combination to both write essays and run a forum. It's like having comments enabled on your blog whether you want them or not.
- cperciva 14y ago
  Having people pick over every detail of what I write is something I like about HN -- it forces me to think more carefully about what I'm saying, and on a few occasions (tptacek, I'm looking at you) has even prompted me to go back and write further blog posts about specific points. Of course, my blog posts don't get nearly as much attention as your essays, and I don't have the problem of having people try to draw attention to themselves in the hopes of being remembered when applications are considered for the next YC round.
  - thaumaturgy 14y ago
    I can't tell here if you're just off-hand mentioning something you like about HN, or if you're also suggesting that it's something other people should like too. Your posts are more technical in nature, and can benefit from debate. Other people might write things that are more personal, or opinion, or thinking-aloud, and while a little bit of good-natured feedback from trusted people might be appreciated, lots of nitpicking and debate and very public arguing is not.
    - cperciva 14y ago
      I can't tell here if you're just off-hand mentioning something you like about HN, or if you're also suggesting that it's something other people should like too. The point I was trying to make was that I would be disappointed if what pg clearly saw as a problem was "fixed", because for me it's a feature.
      - thaumaturgy 14y ago
        For you it is, for others it is not. You would be disappointed, others would be contented. (I'm not picking on you btw, I have a tremendous amount of respect for you. But I don't think your desire for debate on what you write is suitable justification for other people putting up with the same, especially when it's discouraging them from writing.)
        cperciva 14y ago
        I claim no privileged position for my preferences. I was just stating what they were. :-)
        RickHull 14y ago
        You should have preempted this thread with more armor.
- deleted 14y ago
  [deleted]
- jseliger 14y ago
  Well, I still enjoy your essays. Let this comment be the generic encouragement of those who aren't trying to pointless dispute and who are usually silent. At least some of the people who are questioning you are probably doing so out of intellectual curiosity, rather than animosity. You probably know that intellectually, but for many people—including me—it's sometimes hard to remember that in the heat of the reading moment.
  - Poiesis 14y ago
    I hope this buried comment isn't overlooked, but let me caution the reader that intellectual curiosity is often interpreted as animosity. It took me many years to realize that my constant barrage of questions on, well, anything was offputing to a significant fraction of people I interacted with. Perhaps this is obvious to many of you, but it was not to me.
- notJim 14y ago
  > I had to go back and armor it by pre-empting anything I could imagine anyone willfully misunderstanding to use as a weapon in comment threads This is perhaps the worst thing about discourse on the internet. If you and I were having a conversation in room, you'd never pretend to not understand me to rip into me (maybe to understand my point better.) But on the internet, so many people are just trying to score points that it's nearly impossible to have a conversation.
- dave1619 14y ago
  PG, thanks for writing the essays. They're definitely thought-provoking and a lot of people appreciate them. Keep writing. :)
- ctl 14y ago
  After I wrote this one, I had to go back and armor it by pre-empting anything I could imagine anyone willfully misunderstanding to use as a weapon in comment threads. The whole of footnote 1 is such armor for example. You don't give your detractors enough credit. Many of these misunderstandings are not willful, and actively seeking to avoid them is almost always good practice on your part. (In my opinion.) For the record, I found footnote 1 illuminating. I'm sure that the intense scrutiny you get would annoy any writer. But I think it genuinely makes your essays stronger, too, and I hope you don't hate it too much.
- richardw 14y ago
  Two thoughts. 1, that's terrible. So many benefit from the ability to read (and interact with) your opinions. It's so much more valuable than a random once-off Reddit AMA. It's a shame the value is reduced through the actions of a few. 2, this community attracts young smart people, exactly those who might want to match wits with you. Some of it is valuable, some is just annoying. I'm reminded of the niceness value in discussion; if everyone was nice about it, maybe you wouldn't feel as apprehensive or besieged and we could still have a good debate to extract the maximum benefit. In the end, I hope you find some way to care less about the opinions, because what you do and write about are so valuable. In the spirit of "If you aren't writing enough wrong stuff, maybe you're being too cautious."
- brlewis 14y ago
  When I saw this comment (before reading the essay) I was ready to decry this armoring. But now, having read the essay, I think it's a good thing. This essay flows nicely and is clear. Footnote 1 is a good clarification, especially if someone hadn't read your other essays. I think at least half of the misunderstandings that arise in HN comment threads are honest misunderstandings.
  - pg 14y ago
    That seems a reasonable estimate, but it means up to half are dishonest misunderstandings, which is quite a lot if you think about it.
deleted 14y ago
[deleted]

cperciva 14y ago

You're missing my point -- I was objecting to the "(at least among the innumerate)" bit. It would hurt YC's reputation among everybody who matters, whether innumerate or not, if 70% of YC companies didn't survive past Demo Day.

csallen 14y ago
Hence the "at least", no?
- cperciva 14y ago
  Maybe this is just idiomatic, but when I see "it is thought (at least by people with property foo) that...", I read the parenthetical comment as meaning "people without property foo don't think this way".

Alex3917 14y ago

"I do care about would-be founders' opinions, but surely I don't have to use every essay I write to convince people to apply to YC." The essay reminds me a bit of the argument that the Native Americans actually got a great deal when they sold Manhattan for $24, because that money would be worth about $30 trillion today if it had been invested at a return of just 7.5% for the past 385 years. I think it's interesting and worthwhile to explore these sorts of mathematical ideas, but at the same time it's impossible to make good business decisions without fundamentally basing them on human needs, human scales, and human timeframes.

fleitz 14y ago

Do you think it might be possible to run this kind of program under a separate brand, similar to the relationship between Touchstone and Disney?