4 ms·

Weren’t all two state proposals in the past rejected by one Palestinian leader or the other?

by SilverElfin 1y ago

FridayoLeary 1y ago
Anyway the idea basically died on October 7.
- EdwardDiego 1y ago
  It's been dead since Netanyahu became Prime Minister. https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/article-748435 https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/article-748435 https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/knesset-overwhelmingly-passes-motion-rejecting-palestinian-statehood-days-before-pms-us-trip/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/knesset-overwhe...
  - nielsbot 1y ago
    And even before that.
  - tguvot 1y ago
    Netanyahu became PM in 1996. In his role as PM he signed follow up agreements to Oslo accords and handed over to PA control more parts west bank. As cabinet minister (in 2004?) he voted 4 times in favor of disengagement from gaza and removal of all jews from there (both life and dead). Later, when he became PM again, in speech that he gave he affirmed that he supports two state solution as long as palestinian state demilitarized (something that demand now all western countries that recognize it).
    - jfengel 1y ago
      What does Netanyahu's version of a two-state solution look like? I had imagined it as something like creating a country ("Palestine") in the West Bank, along the 1967 borders. But if so, what happens to the settlements that are (as TFA points out) still ongoing? Is there supposed to be a different border? Exclaves of Israel? Or are those settlers supposed to become part of Palestine?
      - tguvot 1y ago
        same as was negotiated in all rounds, including clinton parameters. big settlement blocks go to israel, in land swaps (iirc like 3% or 5% of west bank). remote settlements are evacuated. PA demilitarized (as uk, france, canada, australia, etc say should be). school should stop teaching hate (unrwa teaching that one day they will come and will liberate entire israel since 50s. take a look at this the atlantic article from 1961 https://cdn.theatlantic.com/media/archives/1961/10/208-4/132561290.pdf https://cdn.theatlantic.com/media/archives/1961/10/208-4/132... ) bibi in fact froze settlement construction once for 6 months (such freeze as precondition to negotiation never happened before. it was mess that obama created. construction inside limits of existing settlements) in order to get palestinians to negotiations table. they refused to negotiate and came to table only in last week, made no progress and left when construction was unfrozen. this is lovely article that shows how obama killed all negotiations between israel and palestinians https://www.meforum.org/israeli-settlements-american-pressure https://www.meforum.org/israeli-settlements-american-pressur...
      - deleted 1y ago
        [deleted]
EdwardDiego 1y ago
Only one Palestinian authority was recognized in the Oslo Accords as representing Palestine, and they've supported it since 1982. Which is why Israel funded Hamas to weaken the PLO. https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up...
- dlubarov 1y ago
  Israel never funded Hamas, you might be thinking of them facilitating Qatari aid funds.
  - nielsbot 1y ago
    Same difference
    - tguvot 1y ago
      at some point of time there was serious fallout between PA west bank and Hamas in Gaza (you need to remember that Hamas was elected as majority party by elections in 2006 and later there was coup attempt by PLO sponsored by usa, that succeeded in west bank and failed in gaza). As result of this fallout PA stopped transferring money to Gaza to pay salaries and for maintenance of all infrastructure and services. Mainstream media across the world had headlines that "hundreds of thousands of gazans will starve to death any moment now because they can't afford to buy food because israel blocks money for salaries" and "unmaintained infrastructure will result in mass illness etc.. etc.. etcc.. because israel blocks money for fixing things". eventually Israel folded and allowed those transfers. and now this is known as "israel propping up hamas"
      - nujabe 1y ago
        You folks being disingenuous as usual. Israel did not facilitate the payments to Hamas because of some humanitarian concern for Gazans(lol), they did it specifically for the purpose of undermining the PA so Netanyahu could point to Hamas and say “see we have no partner for peace” which is exactly what he’s done. [1] He is directly quoted by many sources saying “ anyone who wants to prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state needs to support strengthening Hamas” which wholly contradicts your claims. [2] It’s amazing to see how flat Israeli hasbara falls these days, it doesn’t hit like it used to, most people are now well informed to be gaslighted with lies. [1] https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/amp/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up... [2] https://www.politico.eu/article/israel-border-troops-women-hamas-warnings-war-october-7-benjamin-netanyahu/ https://www.politico.eu/article/israel-border-troops-women-h...
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]

Weren’t all two state proposals in the past rejected by one Palestinian leader or the other?

FridayoLeary 1y ago

Anyway the idea basically died on October 7.

EdwardDiego 1y ago
It's been dead since Netanyahu became Prime Minister. https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/article-748435 https://www.jpost.com/arab-israeli-conflict/article-748435 https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/knesset-overwhelmingly-passes-motion-rejecting-palestinian-statehood-days-before-pms-us-trip/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/knesset-overwhe...
- nielsbot 1y ago
  And even before that.
- tguvot 1y ago
  Netanyahu became PM in 1996. In his role as PM he signed follow up agreements to Oslo accords and handed over to PA control more parts west bank. As cabinet minister (in 2004?) he voted 4 times in favor of disengagement from gaza and removal of all jews from there (both life and dead). Later, when he became PM again, in speech that he gave he affirmed that he supports two state solution as long as palestinian state demilitarized (something that demand now all western countries that recognize it).
  - jfengel 1y ago
    What does Netanyahu's version of a two-state solution look like? I had imagined it as something like creating a country ("Palestine") in the West Bank, along the 1967 borders. But if so, what happens to the settlements that are (as TFA points out) still ongoing? Is there supposed to be a different border? Exclaves of Israel? Or are those settlers supposed to become part of Palestine?
    - tguvot 1y ago
      same as was negotiated in all rounds, including clinton parameters. big settlement blocks go to israel, in land swaps (iirc like 3% or 5% of west bank). remote settlements are evacuated. PA demilitarized (as uk, france, canada, australia, etc say should be). school should stop teaching hate (unrwa teaching that one day they will come and will liberate entire israel since 50s. take a look at this the atlantic article from 1961 https://cdn.theatlantic.com/media/archives/1961/10/208-4/132561290.pdf https://cdn.theatlantic.com/media/archives/1961/10/208-4/132... ) bibi in fact froze settlement construction once for 6 months (such freeze as precondition to negotiation never happened before. it was mess that obama created. construction inside limits of existing settlements) in order to get palestinians to negotiations table. they refused to negotiate and came to table only in last week, made no progress and left when construction was unfrozen. this is lovely article that shows how obama killed all negotiations between israel and palestinians https://www.meforum.org/israeli-settlements-american-pressure https://www.meforum.org/israeli-settlements-american-pressur...
    - deleted 1y ago
      [deleted]

EdwardDiego 1y ago

Only one Palestinian authority was recognized in the Oslo Accords as representing Palestine, and they've supported it since 1982. Which is why Israel funded Hamas to weaken the PLO. https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up...

dlubarov 1y ago
Israel never funded Hamas, you might be thinking of them facilitating Qatari aid funds.
- nielsbot 1y ago
  Same difference
  - tguvot 1y ago
    at some point of time there was serious fallout between PA west bank and Hamas in Gaza (you need to remember that Hamas was elected as majority party by elections in 2006 and later there was coup attempt by PLO sponsored by usa, that succeeded in west bank and failed in gaza). As result of this fallout PA stopped transferring money to Gaza to pay salaries and for maintenance of all infrastructure and services. Mainstream media across the world had headlines that "hundreds of thousands of gazans will starve to death any moment now because they can't afford to buy food because israel blocks money for salaries" and "unmaintained infrastructure will result in mass illness etc.. etc.. etcc.. because israel blocks money for fixing things". eventually Israel folded and allowed those transfers. and now this is known as "israel propping up hamas"
    - nujabe 1y ago
      You folks being disingenuous as usual. Israel did not facilitate the payments to Hamas because of some humanitarian concern for Gazans(lol), they did it specifically for the purpose of undermining the PA so Netanyahu could point to Hamas and say “see we have no partner for peace” which is exactly what he’s done. [1] He is directly quoted by many sources saying “ anyone who wants to prevent the establishment of a Palestinian state needs to support strengthening Hamas” which wholly contradicts your claims. [2] It’s amazing to see how flat Israeli hasbara falls these days, it doesn’t hit like it used to, most people are now well informed to be gaslighted with lies. [1] https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/amp/ https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up... [2] https://www.politico.eu/article/israel-border-troops-women-hamas-warnings-war-october-7-benjamin-netanyahu/ https://www.politico.eu/article/israel-border-troops-women-h...

deleted 1y ago

[deleted]