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Well, at least AI is going to be better than the blockchain hype. No one knew what “blockchain” was, how it worked, or what could be used for. I had a very har

Well, at least AI is going to be better than the blockchain hype. No one knew what “blockchain” was, how it worked, or what could be used for. I had a very hard time explaining once you put something in the chain, you can’t easily pull it back out. If you wanted to verify documents, all you have to do is put a hash in a database table. Which we already had. It has exactly one purpose: prevent any single entity from controlling the contents. That includes governments, business executives, lawyers, judges, and hackers. The only good thing is every single piece of data can be pulled out into a different data structure once you realize your mistake. Note, I’m greatly oversimplifying all the details and I’m not referring to cryptocurrency.

Analemma_ 1y ago
My monkey jpegs are surely going back up! Just have to keep hodling.
- gerdesj 1y ago
  I've lost track of my memes. Should I be locking up the green crayons or my daughters?
  - krapp 1y ago
    A lot of y'all still don't get it. https://x.com/JuiceSimpsons/status/1523551892432953345 https://x.com/JuiceSimpsons/status/1523551892432953345
    - gerdesj 1y ago
      "monkey jpegs": NFT "hodl" - I think r/WallStreetBets came up with that. Perhaps not - its too ubiquitous, similar to teh. r/WSB did originate the eating green crayons thing along with smooth brain monkeys etc I simply mixed and matched and riffed in an old school "lock up your daughter" meme. Sorry, I don't have a Spongebob illustration. I do words.
      - roskelld 1y ago
        HODL came from a drunk post on bitcoin talk. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=375643.0 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=375643.0
        gerdesj 1y ago
        If they managed to find the shift key, they weren't pissed enough! ... OK, read the post ... legendary!
  - bradgessler 1y ago
    You should be driving your Lambo on the moon.
xyst 1y ago
[flagged]
Terr_ 1y ago
> has exactly one purpose: prevent any single entity from controlling the contents. I'd like to propose a different characterization: "Blockchain" is when you want unrestricted membership and participation. Allowing anybody to spin up any number of new nodes they desire us the fundamental requirement which causes a cascade of other design decisions and feedback systems. (Mining, proof-of-X, etc.) In contrast, deterring one entity from taking over can also be done with a regular distributed database, where the nodes--and which entities operate them--are determined in advance.
- johnecheck 1y ago
  Sure, blockchain development has always been deeply tied to ideas of open membership and participation. I like those ideas too. But that's a poor definition of a blockchain. A blockchain is merely a distributed ledger with certain properties from cryptography. If you spin up a private bitcoin network, it's a blockchain even if nobody else knows or cares about it. Now, are non-open blockchains at all useful? I suspect so, but I don't know of any great examples. The wide space between 'membership is determined in advance' and 'literally anyone can make a million identities at a whim' is worth exploring, IMO.
  - Terr_ 1y ago
    > A blockchain is merely a distributed ledger with certain properties from cryptography. If we charitably assume "blockchain" has some engineering meaning (and it isn't purely a word for marketing/scamming) then there's some new aspect which sets it apart from the distributed-databases we've been able to make just fine for decades. Uncontrolled participation is that key aspect. Without that linchpin, almost all the other new stuff becomes weirdly moot or actively detrimental. > If you spin up a private bitcoin network, it's a blockchain even if nobody else knows or cares about it. That's practically a contradiction in terms. It may describe the ancestry of the project, but it doesn't describe what/how it's being used. Compare: "If you make a version of Napster/Gnutella with all the networking code disabled, it's still a Peer-to-Peer file sharing client even when only one person uses it."
    - 1y ago
quantum_state 1y ago
let's use the term xype for anything being hyped without a good reason .. :-)
inkyoto 1y ago
> No one knew what “blockchain” was, how it worked, or what could be used for. Not the blockchain itself, but the concept of an immutable, append only, tamper-proof ledger underpinning it is a very useful one in many contexts where the question of authenticity of datasets arises – the blockchain has given us a ledger database. The ledger database is more than just a hash as it also provides a cryptographic proof that the data is authentic via hash chaining, no ability to delete or modify a record, and the entire change history of any record. All these properties make the ledger databases very useful in many contexts, especially the ones where official documents are involved.
- kstrauser 1y ago
  For all that stuff, I like the blockchain implementation known as "git".
  - inkyoto 1y ago
    I have heard an argument for git before, and it is a viable fit for some use cases. The problem, however, stems from the fact that the git commit history can be modified, which automatically disqualifies git in many other use cases, e.g. official government-issued documents, financial records, recognition of prior learning, and similar – anywhere where the entire, unabridged history of records is required.
    - kstrauser 1y ago
      It can't without destroying every subsequent commits' digest, unless you find a way to generate commits with identical SHA digests.
      - inkyoto 1y ago
        There is no such a thing as «subsequent commits» in git. Commits in git are non-linear and form a tree[0][1]. A commit can be easily deleted without affecting the rest of the tree. If the git commit represent a subtree with branches dangling off it, deleting such a commit will delete the entire subtree. Commits can also be moved around, detached and re-attached to other commits. [0] https://www.baeldung.com/ops/git-objects-empty-directory#2-git-tree https://www.baeldung.com/ops/git-objects-empty-directory#2-g... [1] https://www.baeldung.com/ops/git-trees-commit-tree-navigation https://www.baeldung.com/ops/git-trees-commit-tree-navigatio...

Analemma_ 1y ago

My monkey jpegs are surely going back up! Just have to keep hodling.

gerdesj 1y ago
I've lost track of my memes. Should I be locking up the green crayons or my daughters?
- krapp 1y ago
  A lot of y'all still don't get it. https://x.com/JuiceSimpsons/status/1523551892432953345 https://x.com/JuiceSimpsons/status/1523551892432953345
  - gerdesj 1y ago
    "monkey jpegs": NFT "hodl" - I think r/WallStreetBets came up with that. Perhaps not - its too ubiquitous, similar to teh. r/WSB did originate the eating green crayons thing along with smooth brain monkeys etc I simply mixed and matched and riffed in an old school "lock up your daughter" meme. Sorry, I don't have a Spongebob illustration. I do words.
    - roskelld 1y ago
      HODL came from a drunk post on bitcoin talk. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=375643.0 https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=375643.0
      - gerdesj 1y ago
        If they managed to find the shift key, they weren't pissed enough! ... OK, read the post ... legendary!
- bradgessler 1y ago
  You should be driving your Lambo on the moon.

xyst 1y ago

[flagged]

Terr_ 1y ago

> has exactly one purpose: prevent any single entity from controlling the contents. I'd like to propose a different characterization: "Blockchain" is when you want unrestricted membership and participation. Allowing anybody to spin up any number of new nodes they desire us the fundamental requirement which causes a cascade of other design decisions and feedback systems. (Mining, proof-of-X, etc.) In contrast, deterring one entity from taking over can also be done with a regular distributed database, where the nodes--and which entities operate them--are determined in advance.

johnecheck 1y ago
Sure, blockchain development has always been deeply tied to ideas of open membership and participation. I like those ideas too. But that's a poor definition of a blockchain. A blockchain is merely a distributed ledger with certain properties from cryptography. If you spin up a private bitcoin network, it's a blockchain even if nobody else knows or cares about it. Now, are non-open blockchains at all useful? I suspect so, but I don't know of any great examples. The wide space between 'membership is determined in advance' and 'literally anyone can make a million identities at a whim' is worth exploring, IMO.
- Terr_ 1y ago
  > A blockchain is merely a distributed ledger with certain properties from cryptography. If we charitably assume "blockchain" has some engineering meaning (and it isn't purely a word for marketing/scamming) then there's some new aspect which sets it apart from the distributed-databases we've been able to make just fine for decades. Uncontrolled participation is that key aspect. Without that linchpin, almost all the other new stuff becomes weirdly moot or actively detrimental. > If you spin up a private bitcoin network, it's a blockchain even if nobody else knows or cares about it. That's practically a contradiction in terms. It may describe the ancestry of the project, but it doesn't describe what/how it's being used. Compare: "If you make a version of Napster/Gnutella with all the networking code disabled, it's still a Peer-to-Peer file sharing client even when only one person uses it."
  - 1y ago

quantum_state 1y ago

let's use the term xype for anything being hyped without a good reason .. :-)

inkyoto 1y ago

> No one knew what “blockchain” was, how it worked, or what could be used for. Not the blockchain itself, but the concept of an immutable, append only, tamper-proof ledger underpinning it is a very useful one in many contexts where the question of authenticity of datasets arises – the blockchain has given us a ledger database. The ledger database is more than just a hash as it also provides a cryptographic proof that the data is authentic via hash chaining, no ability to delete or modify a record, and the entire change history of any record. All these properties make the ledger databases very useful in many contexts, especially the ones where official documents are involved.

kstrauser 1y ago
For all that stuff, I like the blockchain implementation known as "git".
- inkyoto 1y ago
  I have heard an argument for git before, and it is a viable fit for some use cases. The problem, however, stems from the fact that the git commit history can be modified, which automatically disqualifies git in many other use cases, e.g. official government-issued documents, financial records, recognition of prior learning, and similar – anywhere where the entire, unabridged history of records is required.
  - kstrauser 1y ago
    It can't without destroying every subsequent commits' digest, unless you find a way to generate commits with identical SHA digests.
    - inkyoto 1y ago
      There is no such a thing as «subsequent commits» in git. Commits in git are non-linear and form a tree[0][1]. A commit can be easily deleted without affecting the rest of the tree. If the git commit represent a subtree with branches dangling off it, deleting such a commit will delete the entire subtree. Commits can also be moved around, detached and re-attached to other commits. [0] https://www.baeldung.com/ops/git-objects-empty-directory#2-git-tree https://www.baeldung.com/ops/git-objects-empty-directory#2-g... [1] https://www.baeldung.com/ops/git-trees-commit-tree-navigation https://www.baeldung.com/ops/git-trees-commit-tree-navigatio...