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As a remark, not a criticism, such a deliberate promotion is probably illegal in the UK market, > "But Ofcom says platforms required to introduce "highly effec

As a remark, not a criticism, such a deliberate promotion is probably illegal in the UK market, > "But Ofcom says platforms required to introduce "highly effective" methods to check user age must not host, share or permit content that encourages use of VPNs to get around age checks. The government has also told the BBC it would be illegal for platforms to do so." https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cn72ydj70g5o https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cn72ydj70g5o

walterbell 1y ago
Can VPN/DNS providers independently market their services, if content providers cannot advertise VPN providers?
- perihelions 1y ago
  > "content that encourages use of VPNs to get around age checks" I think "...to get around age checks" is controlling. It isn't illegal to promote VPN's in that country; it's illegal to promote their usefulness in circumventing other laws.
  - neilcj 1y ago
    The law reads like it applies to platforms required to do the checks rather than third party service providers.
    - JdeBP 1y ago
      * https://legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2023/50/contents https://legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2023/50/contents Which section of the Online Safety Act 2023 is that in, please?
buyucu 1y ago
For people who don't live in the UK, why should they care about UK law?
- calgoo 1y ago
  Because the tech that is being implemented for the UK will now be available for any other country on request. Its one thing to try to force the companies to implement the solutions, its another to get your country added to the config of said implementation.
- jansper39 1y ago
  Because it's becoming the standard everywhere.
- ac29 1y ago
  NextDNS is a company not a person. The have infrastructure in the UK and presumably have UK customers, so they should care about UK law.
  - retype 1y ago
    The US also has multiple states that have enacted similar laws.
petcat 1y ago
> must not host, share or permit content that encourages use of VPNs to get around age checks. The government has also told the BBC it would be illegal for platforms to do so Holy. Crap. I knew the UK was going off the deep end with these laws, but this actually looks like China-level government reach.
- pas 1y ago
  next step is to try to make VPNs illegal (or require age verification for them, of course)
  - RiverCrochet 1y ago
    Age verification for VPNs would be awesome. I would rather hand ID over to a VPN provider than individual sites I visit.
    - lttlrck 1y ago
      The VPN provider should hook into the existing government identify service.
    - tacticus 1y ago
      This would ensure you couldn't tie an Identity to an activity\user on a service which is of course why it's not where they're going
  - zarzavat 1y ago
    You need to introduce an invasive great firewall before you can effectively ban VPNs, since there's so many different ways to hide traffic. Unlike banning porn, banning VPNs has no political value because the technically inept voters who support these age verification policies don't know what a VPN is.
    - miki123211 1y ago
      > You need to introduce an invasive great firewall before you can effectively ban VPNs If you're China, yes. If you're a large and powerful western country, not so much. The way to do it would be through the concept of "data laundering." Just like the US does with money laundering, the government would publish a list of all organizations and individuals engaged in the practice. All companies operating in that country would need to (globally) sever all ties with everybody who is on the list. Everybody else could choose between doing the same or ending up on the list themselves. Only powerful countries could do this effectively, less powerful ones would just isolate themselves, just like China did. The US could definitely do it. The EU, UK, Japan and maybe India probably could, but it would be dicy. Everybody else would fail spectacularly.
MistahKoala 1y ago
NextDNS isn't a content platform required to have age checks, so no, that prohibition doesn't apply here and promoting the bypass feature isn't 'probably illegal'.
- riedel 1y ago
  But HN might be Ofcoms next target now I guess, giving all the comments and post an circumvention...
- aydyn 1y ago
  "Illegal" is only what the government will go after you for, and I very much doubt ofcom will see it your way.
rendaw 1y ago
"Under no circumstances should you use Mullvad VPN (https://mullvad.net/en https://mullvad.net/en), available for 5Eur/mo - also payable in Bitcoin, to avoid our age verification checks!"
graemep 1y ago
That only applies to those platforms that are required to do "highly effective age checks". i.e. the top category of "harmful" site cannot point people to VPNs as a way to avoid age verification. Everyone else can tell people about VPNs as a way to avoid age verification. The media have been doing so for a start.
thrown-0825 1y ago
[flagged]
- glitchcrab 1y ago
  > Be kind. Don't be snarky. Converse curiously; don't cross-examine. Edit out swipes. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

walterbell 1y ago

Can VPN/DNS providers independently market their services, if content providers cannot advertise VPN providers?

perihelions 1y ago
> "content that encourages use of VPNs to get around age checks" I think "...to get around age checks" is controlling. It isn't illegal to promote VPN's in that country; it's illegal to promote their usefulness in circumventing other laws.
- neilcj 1y ago
  The law reads like it applies to platforms required to do the checks rather than third party service providers.
  - JdeBP 1y ago
    * https://legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2023/50/contents https://legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2023/50/contents Which section of the Online Safety Act 2023 is that in, please?

buyucu 1y ago

For people who don't live in the UK, why should they care about UK law?

calgoo 1y ago
Because the tech that is being implemented for the UK will now be available for any other country on request. Its one thing to try to force the companies to implement the solutions, its another to get your country added to the config of said implementation.
jansper39 1y ago
Because it's becoming the standard everywhere.
ac29 1y ago
NextDNS is a company not a person. The have infrastructure in the UK and presumably have UK customers, so they should care about UK law.
- retype 1y ago
  The US also has multiple states that have enacted similar laws.

petcat 1y ago

> must not host, share or permit content that encourages use of VPNs to get around age checks. The government has also told the BBC it would be illegal for platforms to do so Holy. Crap. I knew the UK was going off the deep end with these laws, but this actually looks like China-level government reach.

pas 1y ago
next step is to try to make VPNs illegal (or require age verification for them, of course)
- RiverCrochet 1y ago
  Age verification for VPNs would be awesome. I would rather hand ID over to a VPN provider than individual sites I visit.
  - lttlrck 1y ago
    The VPN provider should hook into the existing government identify service.
  - tacticus 1y ago
    This would ensure you couldn't tie an Identity to an activity\user on a service which is of course why it's not where they're going
- zarzavat 1y ago
  You need to introduce an invasive great firewall before you can effectively ban VPNs, since there's so many different ways to hide traffic. Unlike banning porn, banning VPNs has no political value because the technically inept voters who support these age verification policies don't know what a VPN is.
  - miki123211 1y ago
    > You need to introduce an invasive great firewall before you can effectively ban VPNs If you're China, yes. If you're a large and powerful western country, not so much. The way to do it would be through the concept of "data laundering." Just like the US does with money laundering, the government would publish a list of all organizations and individuals engaged in the practice. All companies operating in that country would need to (globally) sever all ties with everybody who is on the list. Everybody else could choose between doing the same or ending up on the list themselves. Only powerful countries could do this effectively, less powerful ones would just isolate themselves, just like China did. The US could definitely do it. The EU, UK, Japan and maybe India probably could, but it would be dicy. Everybody else would fail spectacularly.

MistahKoala 1y ago

NextDNS isn't a content platform required to have age checks, so no, that prohibition doesn't apply here and promoting the bypass feature isn't 'probably illegal'.

riedel 1y ago
But HN might be Ofcoms next target now I guess, giving all the comments and post an circumvention...
aydyn 1y ago
"Illegal" is only what the government will go after you for, and I very much doubt ofcom will see it your way.

rendaw 1y ago

"Under no circumstances should you use Mullvad VPN (https://mullvad.net/en https://mullvad.net/en), available for 5Eur/mo - also payable in Bitcoin, to avoid our age verification checks!"

graemep 1y ago

That only applies to those platforms that are required to do "highly effective age checks". i.e. the top category of "harmful" site cannot point people to VPNs as a way to avoid age verification. Everyone else can tell people about VPNs as a way to avoid age verification. The media have been doing so for a start.

thrown-0825 1y ago

[flagged]

glitchcrab 1y ago
> Be kind. Don't be snarky. Converse curiously; don't cross-examine. Edit out swipes. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html