4 ms·

more people need to be like Woz and we need more Jobs in the world. Jobs was a person who bullied through the ego centric system and paved a good single way for

more people need to be like Woz and we need more Jobs in the world. Jobs was a person who bullied through the ego centric system and paved a good single way forward. Remember when MS office did not include a pdf outputter because they didn’t want to hurt adobe’s feelings? Remember that? Would that have happened with a bully like Jobs? Who went nuclear on all of those analytics companies because they put analytics without declaring it? Jobs caused a lot of divorces with the iPhone. He did! But he cut through people’s ego like scissors and in a creative field that can happen a lot. He didn’t have ego though.

pyrale 1y ago
> Would that have happened with a bully like Jobs? To assume that ms wasn't headed by bullies requires a striking ignorance of ms' history.
- Spooky23 1y ago
  You made me lol. Microsoft’s feats of assholishness and bullies is pretty legendary.
_mu 1y ago
> He didn’t have ego though. False. Steve Jobs had a massive ego and was by no means a saint. He got a girl pregnant and tried to skirt the responsibility. That's not someone with no ego. Steve Jobs was also a genius and his bullying pushed a lot of people to excellence. Someone can be both a genius on the one hand and a total shithead on the other. That's called being human. <3
- lunarboy 1y ago
  I met Jobs as a high schooler at Westfield Valley Fair with a "Programming in Objective-C for iPhone" book in hand during like the iPhone 3G era, and he refused to sign the book lol
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
- wkat4242 1y ago
  He was a textbook narcissist. They're all about ego.
  - WalterBright 1y ago
    And Apple would never have existed without him.
    - wkat4242 1y ago
      True, I'm not saying that. I'm sure without a big ego you won't succeed as a big businessman. I'm just saying he was a very typical narcissist and as such his ego would have been important to him (which is what the thread discussion was about). I didn't state any moral judgment there (though I do have one which I elaborated on elsewhere)
      - WalterBright 1y ago
        > I'm sure without a big ego you won't succeed as a big businessman I agree. Unconfident people will never take the personal risks needed to get big.
        throawaywpg 1y ago
        and in fact many unconfident people feel its somehow immoral to feed their ego in this way
        wkat4242 1y ago
        Having confidence isn't necessarily a good thing of course. Neither is 'getting big'. A lot of politics and industry is made up by vacuous people selling hot air these days. Too much confidence, too little respect and knowledge.
        fuzzfactor 1y ago
        People even more confident than the egoists can have the very same feeling.
- WalterBright 1y ago
  > his bullying pushed a lot of people to excellence A story about Chuck Yeager. He did a stint as squadron commander in the Korean War. When he arrived at the airbase, he watched the squadron land. Afterwards, he called all the pilots together, got a bucket of paint, and marked off two lines across the runway. He said the pilots were doing sloppy landings and would now land between the two lines. The pilots protested, saying that was impossible. So Yeager got in a jet, took off, circled the airfield, and touched down exactly at the midpoint between the lines. The squadron pilots got the point. Yeager wanted his pilots to survive combat, and that meant being perfect pilots every time. If I was a pilot, I'd be glad to have a squadron leader like that in command, even if he was a total asshole.
  - satiated_grue 1y ago
    I think you'll really enjoy watching "12 O'Clock High" with Gregory Peck. I'm still trying to find a reasonably priced copy of the book.
    - WalterBright 1y ago
      I've seen it several times. I have an ancient crumbly paperback of it. My dad, 32 missions over Germany in a B-17, said it was representative of how things were. See also the original "Memphis Belle".
keeganpoppen 1y ago
this is the right take. the world clearly needs more Steve Jobses or the world wouldn't remember this one so singularly. and i don't know what the number would be before the world didn't need any more Wozniaks. the problem is that the Wozniaks of the world nowadays, if they're not getting paid 9 figures by Zuck, are probably in a random room somewhere doing absolutely brilliant work that will take a decade to appreciate. and the more Wozes in the world, the more advantageous it is to be a Jobs. kind of a funny dynamic equilibrium.

pyrale 1y ago

> Would that have happened with a bully like Jobs? To assume that ms wasn't headed by bullies requires a striking ignorance of ms' history.

Spooky23 1y ago
You made me lol. Microsoft’s feats of assholishness and bullies is pretty legendary.

_mu 1y ago

> He didn’t have ego though. False. Steve Jobs had a massive ego and was by no means a saint. He got a girl pregnant and tried to skirt the responsibility. That's not someone with no ego. Steve Jobs was also a genius and his bullying pushed a lot of people to excellence. Someone can be both a genius on the one hand and a total shithead on the other. That's called being human. <3

lunarboy 1y ago
I met Jobs as a high schooler at Westfield Valley Fair with a "Programming in Objective-C for iPhone" book in hand during like the iPhone 3G era, and he refused to sign the book lol
deleted 1y ago
[deleted]
wkat4242 1y ago
He was a textbook narcissist. They're all about ego.
- WalterBright 1y ago
  And Apple would never have existed without him.
  - wkat4242 1y ago
    True, I'm not saying that. I'm sure without a big ego you won't succeed as a big businessman. I'm just saying he was a very typical narcissist and as such his ego would have been important to him (which is what the thread discussion was about). I didn't state any moral judgment there (though I do have one which I elaborated on elsewhere)
    - WalterBright 1y ago
      > I'm sure without a big ego you won't succeed as a big businessman I agree. Unconfident people will never take the personal risks needed to get big.
      - throawaywpg 1y ago
        and in fact many unconfident people feel its somehow immoral to feed their ego in this way
        wkat4242 1y ago
        Having confidence isn't necessarily a good thing of course. Neither is 'getting big'. A lot of politics and industry is made up by vacuous people selling hot air these days. Too much confidence, too little respect and knowledge.
        fuzzfactor 1y ago
        People even more confident than the egoists can have the very same feeling.
WalterBright 1y ago
> his bullying pushed a lot of people to excellence A story about Chuck Yeager. He did a stint as squadron commander in the Korean War. When he arrived at the airbase, he watched the squadron land. Afterwards, he called all the pilots together, got a bucket of paint, and marked off two lines across the runway. He said the pilots were doing sloppy landings and would now land between the two lines. The pilots protested, saying that was impossible. So Yeager got in a jet, took off, circled the airfield, and touched down exactly at the midpoint between the lines. The squadron pilots got the point. Yeager wanted his pilots to survive combat, and that meant being perfect pilots every time. If I was a pilot, I'd be glad to have a squadron leader like that in command, even if he was a total asshole.
- satiated_grue 1y ago
  I think you'll really enjoy watching "12 O'Clock High" with Gregory Peck. I'm still trying to find a reasonably priced copy of the book.
  - WalterBright 1y ago
    I've seen it several times. I have an ancient crumbly paperback of it. My dad, 32 missions over Germany in a B-17, said it was representative of how things were. See also the original "Memphis Belle".

keeganpoppen 1y ago

this is the right take. the world clearly needs more Steve Jobses or the world wouldn't remember this one so singularly. and i don't know what the number would be before the world didn't need any more Wozniaks. the problem is that the Wozniaks of the world nowadays, if they're not getting paid 9 figures by Zuck, are probably in a random room somewhere doing absolutely brilliant work that will take a decade to appreciate. and the more Wozes in the world, the more advantageous it is to be a Jobs. kind of a funny dynamic equilibrium.