5 ms·

The djb suites are well-represented both in TLS and SSH. While NTRU Prime is not implemented in TLS, if it has even half the lifespan of DSA in SSH then it wil

by chasil 1y ago

The djb suites are well-represented both in TLS and SSH. While NTRU Prime is not implemented in TLS, if it has even half the lifespan of DSA in SSH then it will be quite long lived.

throw0101a 1y ago
The context of the conversation is "Bernstein's NTRU Prime", which is not present for TLS in any draft, and for SSH there are only personal / non-WG drafts. So while some SSH folks just happened to pick NTRU after looking at the options at a particular point in time, some of the other most widely deployed systems (TLS, IPsec) will not be using it. So I'm not quite sure how defendable the "great preference" claim is.
- chasil 1y ago
  The first SSH server that chose it was TinySSH. Have you ever visited their site? https://tinyssh.org/ https://tinyssh.org/ I use this in a variety of ways, thousands of logins per day. I don't see much love for AES.
  - throw0101a 1y ago
    > The first SSH server that chose it was TinySSH. Yes, I know. I mention this timeline in another one of my comments: * https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44866802 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44866802 > I use this in a variety of ways, thousands of logins per day. I don't see much love for AES. So? Given its focus on low(er)-performance systems, perhaps on chips without AES-NI, it's no surprise that TinySSH does not have AES. Further, Dropbear, another implementation often used on smaller footprints, does have AES and recently added ML-KEM: * https://github.com/mkj/dropbear/commit/1748ccae5090d511753c0b659be87ebaa3d69e86 https://github.com/mkj/dropbear/commit/1748ccae5090d511753c0... PuTTY added ML-KEM in 0.83 earlier this year. So I'm not sure how talking about a niche SSH implementation supports your claim that "there will be great preference in the community for Bernstein's NTRU Prime." The evidence appears to me that implementation have been adding NIST's choice(s) since they have become available.
    - chasil 1y ago
      Seal its fate then, and get TinySSH to drop it.

by chasil 1y ago

The djb suites are well-represented both in TLS and SSH. While NTRU Prime is not implemented in TLS, if it has even half the lifespan of DSA in SSH then it will be quite long lived.

throw0101a 1y ago

The context of the conversation is "Bernstein's NTRU Prime", which is not present for TLS in any draft, and for SSH there are only personal / non-WG drafts. So while some SSH folks just happened to pick NTRU after looking at the options at a particular point in time, some of the other most widely deployed systems (TLS, IPsec) will not be using it. So I'm not quite sure how defendable the "great preference" claim is.

chasil 1y ago
The first SSH server that chose it was TinySSH. Have you ever visited their site? https://tinyssh.org/ https://tinyssh.org/ I use this in a variety of ways, thousands of logins per day. I don't see much love for AES.
- throw0101a 1y ago
  > The first SSH server that chose it was TinySSH. Yes, I know. I mention this timeline in another one of my comments: * https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44866802 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=44866802 > I use this in a variety of ways, thousands of logins per day. I don't see much love for AES. So? Given its focus on low(er)-performance systems, perhaps on chips without AES-NI, it's no surprise that TinySSH does not have AES. Further, Dropbear, another implementation often used on smaller footprints, does have AES and recently added ML-KEM: * https://github.com/mkj/dropbear/commit/1748ccae5090d511753c0b659be87ebaa3d69e86 https://github.com/mkj/dropbear/commit/1748ccae5090d511753c0... PuTTY added ML-KEM in 0.83 earlier this year. So I'm not sure how talking about a niche SSH implementation supports your claim that "there will be great preference in the community for Bernstein's NTRU Prime." The evidence appears to me that implementation have been adding NIST's choice(s) since they have become available.
  - chasil 1y ago
    Seal its fate then, and get TinySSH to drop it.