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Is it "democratic" when both parties agree on everything of substance and elections don't change anything no matter who wins? Because that's how "democracy" has

Is it "democratic" when both parties agree on everything of substance and elections don't change anything no matter who wins? Because that's how "democracy" has worked in the UK for at least as long as I've been alive. Also, no-one asked for this bill, both parties support it, it received basically no debate or scrutiny and was presented as a fait accompli. Where's the democracy exactly?

AlecSchueler 1y ago
There are any number of criticisms I would happily join you in directing at the British parliamentaey system but I don't think relying on American businesses to pressure the government would actually be the win for democracy you seem to suggest?
- arrowsmith 1y ago
  I didn't say anything prescriptive, I'm just disputing your use of the word "democratic".
  - AlecSchueler 1y ago
    For all it's issues I think you would be hard pressed to argue that the United Kingdom isn't a democracy in the common sense of the term.
    - johnnyanmac 1y ago
      For all it's issues, it's practically bad faith to argue that the UK is a democracy in the spirit of the term. I believe that's how the EU works with law? Oh yeah, they left that.
      - AlecSchueler 1y ago
        I have no idea what this means.
        johnnyanmac 1y ago
        Representives not representing their constituents makes democracy a sham. If you think representatives as of late are acting in good faith, I question yours.
- anigbrowl 1y ago
  None of this is responsive to the specific criticisms made, and nor are the follow-up replies.
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
foldr 1y ago
The Brexit referendum ought to have shut up the “your vote doesn’t make any difference” folks forever (regardless of whether or not they were in favor of Brexit). But they tend to have short memories.
- phatfish 1y ago
  Someone doesn't know the difference between a simple majority referendum and a parliamentary election result.
  - foldr 1y ago
    >elections don't change anything no matter who wins [not you, but who I was responding to] The Brexit referendum was in the 2015 Conservative party manifesto [1]. If Labour had won the 2015 election then there would have been no referendum and the UK would still be in the EU. Or if people had voted differently in the referendum, the UK would still be in the EU. The person I was responding to suggests that elections have never changed anything in the UK within their lifetime. Unless they are less than 10 years old, this is clearly false. [1] https://www.theresavilliers.co.uk/files/conservativemanifesto2015.pdf https://www.theresavilliers.co.uk/files/conservativemanifest... (p. 30)

AlecSchueler 1y ago

There are any number of criticisms I would happily join you in directing at the British parliamentaey system but I don't think relying on American businesses to pressure the government would actually be the win for democracy you seem to suggest?

arrowsmith 1y ago
I didn't say anything prescriptive, I'm just disputing your use of the word "democratic".
- AlecSchueler 1y ago
  For all it's issues I think you would be hard pressed to argue that the United Kingdom isn't a democracy in the common sense of the term.
  - johnnyanmac 1y ago
    For all it's issues, it's practically bad faith to argue that the UK is a democracy in the spirit of the term. I believe that's how the EU works with law? Oh yeah, they left that.
    - AlecSchueler 1y ago
      I have no idea what this means.
      - johnnyanmac 1y ago
        Representives not representing their constituents makes democracy a sham. If you think representatives as of late are acting in good faith, I question yours.
anigbrowl 1y ago
None of this is responsive to the specific criticisms made, and nor are the follow-up replies.
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]

foldr 1y ago

The Brexit referendum ought to have shut up the “your vote doesn’t make any difference” folks forever (regardless of whether or not they were in favor of Brexit). But they tend to have short memories.

phatfish 1y ago
Someone doesn't know the difference between a simple majority referendum and a parliamentary election result.
- foldr 1y ago
  >elections don't change anything no matter who wins [not you, but who I was responding to] The Brexit referendum was in the 2015 Conservative party manifesto [1]. If Labour had won the 2015 election then there would have been no referendum and the UK would still be in the EU. Or if people had voted differently in the referendum, the UK would still be in the EU. The person I was responding to suggests that elections have never changed anything in the UK within their lifetime. Unless they are less than 10 years old, this is clearly false. [1] https://www.theresavilliers.co.uk/files/conservativemanifesto2015.pdf https://www.theresavilliers.co.uk/files/conservativemanifest... (p. 30)