5 ms·

It's not moving the goalpost, it's pointing out a straw man fallacy. "Organic" just means that (among other things) no synthetic fertilizers, irradiation, sewag

It's not moving the goalpost, it's pointing out a straw man fallacy. "Organic" just means that (among other things) no synthetic fertilizers, irradiation, sewage sludge or genetic engineering was used. I'm not sure who seriously expects that food produced like this would be "more nutritious", but it's proven that organic food contains less contaminants than conventional food [1]. Also, the studies mentioned probably only observe a few well-known micro-nutrients like vitamins. But I read somewhere that an apple for example contains more than a hundred organic compounds, the effects of which we haven't fully researched yet (ever heard of ursolic acid for example? [2]). Some studies showed that organic chicken and eggs contain more Omega 3 fatty acids. The organic label is also an indicator that the production process is not as low-cost as possible, and usually high quality and low price are opposing goals. This is not necessarily always the case, but as I said it's an indicator. [1] http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2012/sep/04/organic-foods-no-better-nutrient http://www.guardian.co.uk/science/2012/sep/04/organic-foods-... [2] http://www.naturalnews.com/036312_apple_peel_obesity_ursolic_acid.html http://www.naturalnews.com/036312_apple_peel_obesity_ursolic...

derleth 14y ago
> no synthetic fertilizers, irradiation, sewage sludge or genetic engineering was used Never mind that each of those things have greatly different effects on the safety of the food and other things: > no synthetic fertilizers A valid environmental concern, depending on how the fertilizers are used and where the runoff goes. > irradiation Fear-mongering nonsense. Irradiation doesn't make food radioactive. It just kills what's growing on the food without noxious chemicals. > sewage sludge A slam. Nobody literally uses sewage sludge to grow food, unless you're talking about nightsoil (human excrement used as fertilizer), which is entirely organic. > genetic engineering More fear-mongering nonsense when applied to food safety, but a valid concern as regards patent law and similar legal battles. Also, citing to Natural News is bad. They're the ones who claim Bill Gates wants to depopulate the world using vaccines, which they also believe are evil.
- inafield 14y ago
  > Fear-mongering nonsense. Irradiation doesn't make food radioactive. It just kills what's growing on the food without noxious chemicals. Is that all they're doing? They said something similar about dichlorodiphenyltrichloroethane (DDT). > A slam. Nobody literally uses sewage sludge to grow food, unless you're talking about nightsoil (human excrement used as fertilizer), which is entirely organic. Some farms do use untreated sewage sludge to grow food. As for human excrement, the chemical and bacterial content is very different depending on the diet of the humans in question. > genetic engineering We don't yet know all the side effects of genetic engineering. We also don't know what has been hidden or destroyed by corporations that want to hide the 2% mutant plant that ate the research team. I'm being funny and exaggerative, but we really don't know.
  - falcolas 14y ago
    >> Fear-mongering nonsense. Irradiation doesn't make food radioactive. It just kills what's growing on the food without noxious chemicals. > Is that all they're doing? They said something similar about dichlorodiphenyltrichloroethane (DDT). Might not want to open your mail then. Some of it is irradiated to kill bacteria and viruses, based on origin and destination. Probably don't want to use bandaids, either, since they are irradiated to steralize them. > Some farms do use untreated sewage sludge to grow food. As for human excrement, the chemical and bacterial content is very different depending on the diet of the humans in question. Whose sewage? Human is dangerous, due to the fact that human pathogens can carry over from one incarnation to the next. Livestock, not so much; and is commonly used in "organic" fertilizers.
  - derleth 14y ago
    > They said something similar about dichlorodiphenyltrichloroethane (DDT). Ooooh scary letters. To be clear: DDT is not very toxic to humans. The reason we stopped using it was because it was becoming not very toxic to mosquitoes, as well, as they evolved resistance, in addition to what it was doing to birds. We still use DDT in regions where malaria is most dangerous. http://www.pan-uk.org/pestnews/Actives/ddt.htm http://www.pan-uk.org/pestnews/Actives/ddt.htm > In one study involving humans, 17 people ate 35 mg/man daily (about 0.5 mg/kg daily) for 18 months suffering no ill-effect(25). In another study volunteers ate 0.31 to 0.61 mg/kg daily without any noticeable effects(26). http://www.blackwellpublishing.com/ridley/tutorials/The_theory_of_natural_selection__part_1_13.asp http://www.blackwellpublishing.com/ridley/tutorials/The_theo... > DDT-resistant mosquitoes were first detected in India in 1959, and they have increased so rapidly that when a local spray program is begun now, most mosquitoes become resistant in a matter of months rather than years. Also: > We also don't know what has been hidden or destroyed by corporations Without any evidence, this is fear-mongering. This is what fear-mongering is. Using rumors and innuendo to make people afraid without saying anything of substance.

derleth 14y ago

> no synthetic fertilizers, irradiation, sewage sludge or genetic engineering was used Never mind that each of those things have greatly different effects on the safety of the food and other things: > no synthetic fertilizers A valid environmental concern, depending on how the fertilizers are used and where the runoff goes. > irradiation Fear-mongering nonsense. Irradiation doesn't make food radioactive. It just kills what's growing on the food without noxious chemicals. > sewage sludge A slam. Nobody literally uses sewage sludge to grow food, unless you're talking about nightsoil (human excrement used as fertilizer), which is entirely organic. > genetic engineering More fear-mongering nonsense when applied to food safety, but a valid concern as regards patent law and similar legal battles. Also, citing to Natural News is bad. They're the ones who claim Bill Gates wants to depopulate the world using vaccines, which they also believe are evil.

inafield 14y ago
> Fear-mongering nonsense. Irradiation doesn't make food radioactive. It just kills what's growing on the food without noxious chemicals. Is that all they're doing? They said something similar about dichlorodiphenyltrichloroethane (DDT). > A slam. Nobody literally uses sewage sludge to grow food, unless you're talking about nightsoil (human excrement used as fertilizer), which is entirely organic. Some farms do use untreated sewage sludge to grow food. As for human excrement, the chemical and bacterial content is very different depending on the diet of the humans in question. > genetic engineering We don't yet know all the side effects of genetic engineering. We also don't know what has been hidden or destroyed by corporations that want to hide the 2% mutant plant that ate the research team. I'm being funny and exaggerative, but we really don't know.
- falcolas 14y ago
  >> Fear-mongering nonsense. Irradiation doesn't make food radioactive. It just kills what's growing on the food without noxious chemicals. > Is that all they're doing? They said something similar about dichlorodiphenyltrichloroethane (DDT). Might not want to open your mail then. Some of it is irradiated to kill bacteria and viruses, based on origin and destination. Probably don't want to use bandaids, either, since they are irradiated to steralize them. > Some farms do use untreated sewage sludge to grow food. As for human excrement, the chemical and bacterial content is very different depending on the diet of the humans in question. Whose sewage? Human is dangerous, due to the fact that human pathogens can carry over from one incarnation to the next. Livestock, not so much; and is commonly used in "organic" fertilizers.
- derleth 14y ago
  > They said something similar about dichlorodiphenyltrichloroethane (DDT). Ooooh scary letters. To be clear: DDT is not very toxic to humans. The reason we stopped using it was because it was becoming not very toxic to mosquitoes, as well, as they evolved resistance, in addition to what it was doing to birds. We still use DDT in regions where malaria is most dangerous. http://www.pan-uk.org/pestnews/Actives/ddt.htm http://www.pan-uk.org/pestnews/Actives/ddt.htm > In one study involving humans, 17 people ate 35 mg/man daily (about 0.5 mg/kg daily) for 18 months suffering no ill-effect(25). In another study volunteers ate 0.31 to 0.61 mg/kg daily without any noticeable effects(26). http://www.blackwellpublishing.com/ridley/tutorials/The_theory_of_natural_selection__part_1_13.asp http://www.blackwellpublishing.com/ridley/tutorials/The_theo... > DDT-resistant mosquitoes were first detected in India in 1959, and they have increased so rapidly that when a local spray program is begun now, most mosquitoes become resistant in a matter of months rather than years. Also: > We also don't know what has been hidden or destroyed by corporations Without any evidence, this is fear-mongering. This is what fear-mongering is. Using rumors and innuendo to make people afraid without saying anything of substance.