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Harmony: OpenAI's response format for its open-weight model series
- throwaway314155 1y agowhat's this for?
- babelfish 1y agoread the README
- koakuma-chan 1y agoBasically, LLMs are trained with a specific conversation format, and if your input does not follow that format, the LLM will perform poorly. We usually don't have to worry about this because their API automatically puts our input into the proper format, but I guess now that they open sourced a model, they are also releasing the corresponding format.
- jfoster 1y agoThe page links to: https://gpt-oss.com/ https://gpt-oss.com/ and https://openai.com/open-models https://openai.com/open-models ... but these links aren't active yet. I presume they will be imminently, and I guess that means that OpenAI are releasing an open weights GPT model today?
- FergusArgyll 1y agoNone of their links work? - https://gpt-oss.com/ https://gpt-oss.com/ Auth required? - https://openai.com/open-models/ https://openai.com/open-models/ seems empty? - https://cookbook.openai.com/topic/gpt-oss https://cookbook.openai.com/topic/gpt-oss 404 - https://openai.com/index/gpt-oss-model-card/ https://openai.com/index/gpt-oss-model-card/ empty page? Am I holding the internet wrong?
- FergusArgyll 1y agoDoes seem like we're gonna get open weights models today tho
- jfoster 1y agoI think they're currently doing the release. I am guessing those will all be online soon.
- paxys 1y agoI'm guessing someone published the github repo too early.
- stillpointlab 1y agoAlso https://cookbook.openai.com/articles/openai-harmony https://cookbook.openai.com/articles/openai-harmony is referenced 3 times in the README but it is 404
- Imustaskforhelp 1y agothe link does work now for what its worth
- trenchpilgrim 1y agoPresumably they use GitHub and their release process is delayed by the current GitHub outage.
- echelon 1y agoCosmically bad timing.
- skhameneh 1y agoApparently the issue was resolved, but there's no indication there was an outage in the last 24 hours when looking at status... https://www.githubstatus.com/ https://www.githubstatus.com/ Not a fan of this presentation of communication.
- skhameneh 1y agoThe status page now reflects an issue, at time of writing it had been resolved for almost an hour and there was no indication of an issue.
- bbor 1y agoIDK I think this is on purpose: https://nitter.net/sama/status/1952759361417466016#m https://nitter.net/sama/status/1952759361417466016#m we have a lot of new stuff for you over the next few days! something big-but-small today. and then a big upgrade later this week. EDIT: nevermind, I spoke too soon! I guess this was referring to GPT 5 later this week. https://openai.com/open-models/ https://openai.com/open-models/ is live
- rvz 1y ago> Am I holding the internet wrong? The GitHub outage is delaying them on their release.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- minimaxir 1y agoThe new transformers release describes the model: https://github.com/huggingface/transformers/releases/tag/v4.55.0 https://github.com/huggingface/transformers/releases/tag/v4.... > GPT OSS is a hugely anticipated open-weights release by OpenAI, designed for powerful reasoning, agentic tasks, and versatile developer use cases. It comprises two models: a big one with 117B parameters (gpt-oss-120b), and a smaller one with 21B parameters (gpt-oss-20b). Both are mixture-of-experts (MoEs) and use a 4-bit quantization scheme (MXFP4), enabling fast inference (thanks to fewer active parameters, see details below) while keeping resource usage low. The large model fits on a single H100 GPU, while the small one runs within 16GB of memory and is perfect for consumer hardware and on-device applications.
- guluarte 1y agohttps://ollama.com/library/gpt-oss https://ollama.com/library/gpt-oss
- wilg 1y agoEvery OpenAI announcement has threads of people complaining that the links don't work yet as if you can trivially deploy 10 different interconnected websites completely instantly.
- stronglikedan 1y ago> Am I holding the internet wrong? Likely, considering every single one opens right up for me.
- qsort 1y agopelican when
- MarcelOlsz 1y agoWhat's pelican?
- babelfish 1y ago@simonw asks every new foundation model to generate an SVG of a pelican riding a bicycle as a part of his review post
- echelon 1y agoThe foundation model companies should just learn that case and call it a day.
- schmidtleonard 1y agoHe spotted a pelican in a presentation the other week, so they're on to him and he's on to them.
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- unglaublich 1y agoBenchmark-driven development, like Dieselgate in automotive.
- pythonaut_16 1y agoYes, they should definitely Goodhardt the Pelican Test so we can... just have to invent a new test?
- Spivak 1y agoYes but then you can use the pelican test in all your marketing where you say that this is the <apple slide deck voice> most capable model. ever. And then ignore the new test except as a footnote in some long dry boring evaluation.
- deckar01 1y agogpt-oss models are reportedly being hosted on huggingface. https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/artificial-intelligence/openai-prepares-new-open-weight-models-along-with-gpt-5/ https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/artificial-intelligenc...
- bbor 1y ago(as of 3 days ago)
- lajr 1y agoThis format, or similar formats, seem to be the standard now, I was just reading the "Lessons from Building Manus"[1] post and they discuss the Hermes Format[2] which seems similar in terms of being pseudo-xml. My initial thought was how hacky the whole thing feels, but then the fact that it works and gives rise to complex behaviour (like coercing specific tool selection in the Manus post) is quite simple and elegant. Also as an aside, it is good that it appears that each standard tag is a single token in the OpenAI repo. [1] https://manus.im/blog/Context-Engineering-for-AI-Agents-Lessons-from-Building-Manus https://manus.im/blog/Context-Engineering-for-AI-Agents-Less... [2] https://github.com/NousResearch/Hermes-Function-Calling https://github.com/NousResearch/Hermes-Function-Calling
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- deleted 1y ago[deleted]
- obviyus 1y agoLinks seem to be working now: - https://openai.com/index/introducing-gpt-oss/ https://openai.com/index/introducing-gpt-oss/ - https://cdn.openai.com/pdf/419b6906-9da6-406c-a19d-1bb078ac7637/oai_gpt-oss_model_card.pdf https://cdn.openai.com/pdf/419b6906-9da6-406c-a19d-1bb078ac7...
- dr_dshiv 1y agoYesterday I gave a presentation on the role of harmony in AI — as a matter of philosophical interest. I’d previously written a large literature review on the concept of harmony (here: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S240587262200003X https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S240587262...). If you are curious about the slides, here: Bit.ly/ozora2025 I assume they are using the concept of harmony to refer to the consistent response format? Or is it their intention for an open weights release?
- Scene_Cast2 1y agoI wonder how much performance is left on the table due to it not being zero-copy.
- irthomasthomas 1y agoPrediction: GPT-5 will use a consortium of models for parallel reasoning, possibly including their oss versions. Each using different 'channels' from the harmony spec. I have a branch of llm-consortium where I was noodling with giving each member model a role. Only problem is it's expensive to evaluate these ideas so I put it on hold. But maybe now with oss models being cheap I can try and it on those.
- Imustaskforhelp 1y agoWhat are your thoughts on some other model like qwen using something like this? Pardon me but are you thinking that this method is superior than mixture of experts? What are your thoughts?
- irthomasthomas 1y agoI tested a consortium of qwens on the brainfuck test and it solved it, while the single models fail. MOEs are a single model. An 'expert' is a subset of layers chosen by a router model for each token. This makes them run faster. A consortium is a type of parallel reasoning that uses multiple of the same or different models to generate parallel response and find the best one. All models have a jagged frontier with weird skill gaps. A consortium can bridge those gaps and increase performance on the frontier.
- onlyrealcuzzo 1y agoHas anyone compared a consortium of leading edge 3B-20B models compared to the most powerful models? I'd love to see how they performed.
- irthomasthomas 1y agoDo you have a favourite benchmark? I may just have the budget for testing some 3b models
- nxobject 1y ago
- gsibble 1y agoIt's weird to me that ChatGPT would release a local model that you can't plug directly into their client.....kind of defeats the purpose. Also creates a walled garden on purpose.
- accrual 1y ago> The format enables the model to output to multiple different channels for chain of thought, and tool calling preambles along with regular responses That's pretty cool and seems like a logical next step to structure AI outputs. We started out with a stream of plaintext. In the future perhaps we'll have complex typed output. Humans also emit many channels of information simutaneously. Our speech, tone of voice, body language, our appearance - it all has an impact on how our information is received by another.
- citizensinan 1y agoSame here - all those links are either broken or asking for auth. Classic case of announcing something before the infrastructure is ready. This kind of coordination failure is surprisingly common with AI releases lately. Remember when everyone was trying to access GPT-4 on launch day? Or when Anthropic's Claude had those random outages during their big announcements? Makes you wonder if they're rushing to counter Google's Genie 3 news and got caught with their pants down during the GitHub outage. The timing seems too coincidental. At least when it does go live, having truly open weights models will be huge for the community. Just wish they'd test their deployment pipeline before hitting 'publish' on the blog post.