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My usual pet peeve - They use the abbreviation NVR in the first sentence without saying what it means. It means "networked video recorder". Please don't do t

My usual pet peeve - They use the abbreviation NVR in the first sentence without saying what it means. It means "networked video recorder". Please don't do that. Not everyone who comes across your site is a member of your particular niche.

tiagod 1y ago
Most stores will just market the devices as NVR or NVR Recorder (I know). If you google it, you get your answer immediately.
- lobsterthief 1y ago
  Right, but I don’t want to open tabs and Google terms right after I start reading an article ;) Even as a super technical person
  - vdfs 1y ago
    NVR is to distinguish it from DVR, Digtal Video Recorder (ironically it's not really digital, more like analog) It's much cheaper than NVR, because the camras are simple and diffrere the encoding to the DVR unit. And there XVR with can combine both Network and Digital cameras
- hopelite 1y ago
  You are missing the point. It has been considered general English language competency that you always expand the first instance of any abbreviation that is not absolutely obvious in context, e.g., USA, “e.g.”, or CIA, unless you happen to be writing about the Culinary Institute of America in most contexts outside of the culinary context. It is a rather annoying myopic perspective I most often run across in tech, where technical people for whatever reason are so fixated on their little corner that they are either unaware or simply indifferent to the fact that there are others in the world, and that if they want to spread their work and impact, they need to make things approachable and lower barriers to entry. It Is why the rule of general language proficiency exists in English especially because of all the abbreviations, to facilitate information and knowledge sharing. Let’s all improve by going through whatever our project is and make sure that at least in the context, abbreviations are easily understood by expanding them, e.g., your introduction/overview page and documentation should always expand most first instance abbreviations, including in separate, high level segments (e.g., if you have different first contact pages or objects) unless they are globally known to society. It’s really not any different than any other “sales” tactic; you will not be successful selling something if you do not first describe what it does in a one-liner. Ask yourself, “who is the person I want/need to come to this thing and should I assume they would know what this all means?”
  - tiagod 1y ago
    What I'm arguing is that in the context of CCTV (Closed-circuit television) systems, NVR is a universal term. I would also argue that the expansion of "e.g." is not "absolutely obvious". I know what it means ("for example"), but I had to google it to know it's an abbreviation of "exempli gratia", and I don't speak Latin, so I don't even know exactly what that means without reading further. In the same way, you can also quickly understand from the page what an NVR is without knowing the exact expansion.
    - cgriswald 1y ago
      I have no real conclusion here, but sort of land on the side of "Why wouldn't you expand it?" The abbreviation of e.g. isn't a good example. It is hundreds of years old and taught in schools. It is essentially a feature of the language (or at least of writing the language) and can hardly be compared to the far more recent initialism NVR. It is ubiquitous and all native English speakers should know it and all non-native English speakers should learn it. VCR is an example that is almost always referred to solely as its initialism. However, this became a completely ubiquitous term. Early advertisements didn't say "VCR", they said things like "video recorder"[0]. Once it was ubiquitous non-specialists knew what a VCR was even if they didn't understand the initialism and they were marketed just as "VCR". One could make the case that "VCR" stopped being a pure initialism and become more of a word. (VHS on the other hand... not expanded in that video.) Is NVR ubiquitous enough? BestBuy sells them without expanding the initialism (in the examples I checked), so maybe. However, I bet if you sampled people, the majority wouldn't be able to tell you. And BestBuy selling them this way may have more to do with limited 'item title' space. It might be the case that it is well-enough known among people who 'need to know' like security folks. I'd argue that's probably not meaningful if BestBuy is retailing them to the public. Maybe a better example is something like an air-admittance valve (AAV). Most people have never heard of it, but all plumbers have heard of it. In context, anyone can probably figure out what it does. And yet Oatey "correctly" (according to style rules) identifies the name and puts the initialism in parentheses[1]. So on the one hand, it may be ubiquitous enough that it doesn't matter (and is becoming more of a word). On the other hand, there's evidence here that it does matter because it isn't ubiquitous enough for people to be comfortable not knowing what the acronym means. What I can't see is the downside of writing "network video recorder (NVR)" on the first instance of is use at least on the landing page. Everyone has to learn what it means somewhere and it seems like a missed marketing opportunity for it to not be through your product's landing page. It may also reduce friction or aid in SEO. (YMMV, but I get quite different results searching for "network video recorder" and "NVR".) [0] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQ9nkyo01HQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQ9nkyo01HQ [1] - https://www.oatey.com/products/air-admittance-valves-aav https://www.oatey.com/products/air-admittance-valves-aav
disruptiveink 1y ago
Usually I would agree with you, but this is an incredibly common initialism, used by not just people in the industry, but also by consumers. Sure, it may not be as widespread as VHS (global) or API (tech-adjacent), but anyone who is in the market for this software already knows what NVR means. Most people would know the term from either being quoted or looking up CCTV solutions, all of which, unless they're fully "cloud-based", come with a component that is called the NVR. You wouldn't even consider this if you weren't aware of the concept. If NVR means nothing to you, Network Video Recorder doesn't mean anything to you either. This is meant to be a replacement for closed and inflexible hardware boxes that are sold together with security cameras, and the name of those boxes are "NVRs".
- varelse 1y ago
  [dead]
- triceratops 1y ago
  As a consumer I disagree. Never heard of "NVR" but I can suss out what "network video recorder" means from context.
  - vdfs 1y ago
    NVR is to distinguish it from DVR, Digtal Video Recorder (ironically it's not really digital, more like analog) It's much cheaper than NVR, because the camras are simple and diffrere the encoding to the DVR unit. And there XVR wich can combine both Network and Digital cameras
    - sib 1y ago
      Which is odd because the first time I heard the term DVR was in the late 1990's, referring to the box that was used to record TV signals digitally for playback and/or ad-skipping. The term distinguished it from things such as VCRs, which recorded in analog, on tape. Those DVRs were, in fact, digital.
    - LocalH 1y ago
infecto 1y ago
Disagree. I would expect 90% or more of the folks coming to Frigate would know what an NVR is. Would be nice to define all things definitely but NVR seems table stakes knowledge to even consider using Frigate.
- Workaccount2 1y ago
  100% of people coming to frigate can read "networked video recorder".
  - infecto 1y ago
    So what? Like I said it does not hurt to define but at the same time if you don’t know what NVR stands for, Frigate is not for you. It’s like reading an equity research paper and complaining EPS is not defined. Some things just don’t need to be defined and if you don’t know, you most likely are not the target audience.
    - DonHopkins 1y ago
      [dead]
      - infecto 1y ago
        You’ve really taken a mild disagreement and spun it into some moral crusade against user inclusivity. No one is “alienating” users or acting out of “contempt”… I made a simple point that, for a niche technical project like Frigate, it’s reasonable to assume some baseline domain knowledge. If someone doesn’t know what an NVR is, they’re likely not ready to deploy a self-hosted AI-powered video surveillance system. That’s not exclusionary and it’s just reality. Let’s not pretend a missing acronym definition is the same as slamming a door in someone’s face. I am sorry expressing an opinion offended you.
    - deleted 1y ago
      [deleted]
  - subscribed 1y ago
some_random 1y ago
Assuming visitors know what NVR stands for seems like a perfectly reasonable assumption, but even if they don't I think there's enough context for someone to still understand what Frigate is.

tiagod 1y ago

Most stores will just market the devices as NVR or NVR Recorder (I know). If you google it, you get your answer immediately.

lobsterthief 1y ago
Right, but I don’t want to open tabs and Google terms right after I start reading an article ;) Even as a super technical person
- vdfs 1y ago
  NVR is to distinguish it from DVR, Digtal Video Recorder (ironically it's not really digital, more like analog) It's much cheaper than NVR, because the camras are simple and diffrere the encoding to the DVR unit. And there XVR with can combine both Network and Digital cameras
hopelite 1y ago
You are missing the point. It has been considered general English language competency that you always expand the first instance of any abbreviation that is not absolutely obvious in context, e.g., USA, “e.g.”, or CIA, unless you happen to be writing about the Culinary Institute of America in most contexts outside of the culinary context. It is a rather annoying myopic perspective I most often run across in tech, where technical people for whatever reason are so fixated on their little corner that they are either unaware or simply indifferent to the fact that there are others in the world, and that if they want to spread their work and impact, they need to make things approachable and lower barriers to entry. It Is why the rule of general language proficiency exists in English especially because of all the abbreviations, to facilitate information and knowledge sharing. Let’s all improve by going through whatever our project is and make sure that at least in the context, abbreviations are easily understood by expanding them, e.g., your introduction/overview page and documentation should always expand most first instance abbreviations, including in separate, high level segments (e.g., if you have different first contact pages or objects) unless they are globally known to society. It’s really not any different than any other “sales” tactic; you will not be successful selling something if you do not first describe what it does in a one-liner. Ask yourself, “who is the person I want/need to come to this thing and should I assume they would know what this all means?”
- tiagod 1y ago
  What I'm arguing is that in the context of CCTV (Closed-circuit television) systems, NVR is a universal term. I would also argue that the expansion of "e.g." is not "absolutely obvious". I know what it means ("for example"), but I had to google it to know it's an abbreviation of "exempli gratia", and I don't speak Latin, so I don't even know exactly what that means without reading further. In the same way, you can also quickly understand from the page what an NVR is without knowing the exact expansion.
  - cgriswald 1y ago
    I have no real conclusion here, but sort of land on the side of "Why wouldn't you expand it?" The abbreviation of e.g. isn't a good example. It is hundreds of years old and taught in schools. It is essentially a feature of the language (or at least of writing the language) and can hardly be compared to the far more recent initialism NVR. It is ubiquitous and all native English speakers should know it and all non-native English speakers should learn it. VCR is an example that is almost always referred to solely as its initialism. However, this became a completely ubiquitous term. Early advertisements didn't say "VCR", they said things like "video recorder"[0]. Once it was ubiquitous non-specialists knew what a VCR was even if they didn't understand the initialism and they were marketed just as "VCR". One could make the case that "VCR" stopped being a pure initialism and become more of a word. (VHS on the other hand... not expanded in that video.) Is NVR ubiquitous enough? BestBuy sells them without expanding the initialism (in the examples I checked), so maybe. However, I bet if you sampled people, the majority wouldn't be able to tell you. And BestBuy selling them this way may have more to do with limited 'item title' space. It might be the case that it is well-enough known among people who 'need to know' like security folks. I'd argue that's probably not meaningful if BestBuy is retailing them to the public. Maybe a better example is something like an air-admittance valve (AAV). Most people have never heard of it, but all plumbers have heard of it. In context, anyone can probably figure out what it does. And yet Oatey "correctly" (according to style rules) identifies the name and puts the initialism in parentheses[1]. So on the one hand, it may be ubiquitous enough that it doesn't matter (and is becoming more of a word). On the other hand, there's evidence here that it does matter because it isn't ubiquitous enough for people to be comfortable not knowing what the acronym means. What I can't see is the downside of writing "network video recorder (NVR)" on the first instance of is use at least on the landing page. Everyone has to learn what it means somewhere and it seems like a missed marketing opportunity for it to not be through your product's landing page. It may also reduce friction or aid in SEO. (YMMV, but I get quite different results searching for "network video recorder" and "NVR".) [0] - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQ9nkyo01HQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vQ9nkyo01HQ [1] - https://www.oatey.com/products/air-admittance-valves-aav https://www.oatey.com/products/air-admittance-valves-aav

disruptiveink 1y ago

Usually I would agree with you, but this is an incredibly common initialism, used by not just people in the industry, but also by consumers. Sure, it may not be as widespread as VHS (global) or API (tech-adjacent), but anyone who is in the market for this software already knows what NVR means. Most people would know the term from either being quoted or looking up CCTV solutions, all of which, unless they're fully "cloud-based", come with a component that is called the NVR. You wouldn't even consider this if you weren't aware of the concept. If NVR means nothing to you, Network Video Recorder doesn't mean anything to you either. This is meant to be a replacement for closed and inflexible hardware boxes that are sold together with security cameras, and the name of those boxes are "NVRs".

varelse 1y ago
[dead]
triceratops 1y ago
As a consumer I disagree. Never heard of "NVR" but I can suss out what "network video recorder" means from context.
- vdfs 1y ago
  NVR is to distinguish it from DVR, Digtal Video Recorder (ironically it's not really digital, more like analog) It's much cheaper than NVR, because the camras are simple and diffrere the encoding to the DVR unit. And there XVR wich can combine both Network and Digital cameras
  - sib 1y ago
    Which is odd because the first time I heard the term DVR was in the late 1990's, referring to the box that was used to record TV signals digitally for playback and/or ad-skipping. The term distinguished it from things such as VCRs, which recorded in analog, on tape. Those DVRs were, in fact, digital.
  - LocalH 1y ago

infecto 1y ago

Disagree. I would expect 90% or more of the folks coming to Frigate would know what an NVR is. Would be nice to define all things definitely but NVR seems table stakes knowledge to even consider using Frigate.

Workaccount2 1y ago
100% of people coming to frigate can read "networked video recorder".
- infecto 1y ago
  So what? Like I said it does not hurt to define but at the same time if you don’t know what NVR stands for, Frigate is not for you. It’s like reading an equity research paper and complaining EPS is not defined. Some things just don’t need to be defined and if you don’t know, you most likely are not the target audience.
  - DonHopkins 1y ago
    [dead]
    - infecto 1y ago
      You’ve really taken a mild disagreement and spun it into some moral crusade against user inclusivity. No one is “alienating” users or acting out of “contempt”… I made a simple point that, for a niche technical project like Frigate, it’s reasonable to assume some baseline domain knowledge. If someone doesn’t know what an NVR is, they’re likely not ready to deploy a self-hosted AI-powered video surveillance system. That’s not exclusionary and it’s just reality. Let’s not pretend a missing acronym definition is the same as slamming a door in someone’s face. I am sorry expressing an opinion offended you.
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
- subscribed 1y ago

some_random 1y ago

Assuming visitors know what NVR stands for seems like a perfectly reasonable assumption, but even if they don't I think there's enough context for someone to still understand what Frigate is.