5 ms·

There already was a time when Steam managed to free people from need to use funny pieces of plastic in their lifes... They've done that with CDs, they can do it

by harvie 1y ago

There already was a time when Steam managed to free people from need to use funny pieces of plastic in their lifes... They've done that with CDs, they can do it again with Cards.

master-lincoln 1y ago
Yeah, that was when Steam freed the users from actually owning any game and instead gave the users limited licenses for using games. I am looking forward to the day when they shutdown and everybody realizes this.
- dpoloncsak 1y ago
  Can't I still just run the .exe of the game? Or DRM nightmares?
  - hexmiles 1y ago
    All (most?) Steam games have a very simple DRM that is extremely easy to bypass, and you can find examples on github. However, a lot of games add their own DRM and/or protection scheme that complicates things. EDIT: technically there are two distinct component: the actual DRM, called steamstub, and the steamwork library, that does not work without steam but it is not considered drm. Both can be easily bypassed/emulated.
    - dpoloncsak 1y ago
      I see, but there is Steam DRM there. So, I guess as the other commenter was alluding to, if Steam goes belly up so does your collection, regardless of the dev studio's intention (Or atleast, locked behind a DRM bypass). I understood this in terms of Live Service games, but did not consider Steam's ability to shut down their own platform and kill my locally installed single player games with it (Again, I'm seeing its possible and seems easy to bypass usually, but the principle of the matter)
      - hexmiles 1y ago
        I tried to search if it's possible for a dev studio to release a game on Steam that works without it, by which I mean that if I uninstall Steam, the games keep working; I wasn't able to confirm, but it seems to be theoretically possible... None of the games I have in my library work like that, but online some people suggest that some games work even without Steam, once installed. Your point, however, still stands.
    - skeaker 1y ago
      Definitely not all games, and for games that do have it cracking it is in most cases as simple as swapping out a Steam .dll (so very easy). It's primarily there as appeasement for devs who would be reluctant to engage with a platform with no copy protection, or in otherwords is mostly theater.
      - hexmiles 1y ago
        Do you know of any games downloaded from Steam that work even once Steam is removed? I tried to search a bit, but I couldn't find any. I would like to test it for myself to confirm it.
        skeaker 1y ago
        I haven't tried with too many games since the usecase only comes up rarely, but I know that Downwell and UFO 50 work this way off the top of my head. They come with a Steam dll that will try to launch Steam for the sake of getting achievements and such, but if you delete them or just don't have Steam they launch all the same. Google turns up this Steam curator that lists games that run without Steam and are DRM-free out of the box, though it seems far from comprehensive: https://store.steampowered.com/curator/38523697-DRM-FREE-GAMES/?appid=274190 https://store.steampowered.com/curator/38523697-DRM-FREE-GAM... The PC Gaming Wiki has a couple of better lists it looks like: https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/The_big_list_of_DRM-free_games_on_Steam https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/The_big_list_of_DRM-free_g... and https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/List_of_DRM-free_games_on_Steam https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/List_of_DRM-free_games_on_...
- zamadatix 1y ago
  The real loss was in the inability to sell the 90% of titles I no longer care about owning, but that's already true immediately after purchase. Steam shutting down and taking your library with it really doesn't change much except you lose that nice delivery platform with good integrations (achievements, workshop mods, multiplayer integration, automatic updates) for games you're active in. For the 90% you were never going to touch again it wouldn't be noticeable, outside the annoying reminder you were never able to resell them. The other 10% just reverts back to "pirate it" which is about here on my scale: "find that legal physical copy to play with" < "pirate it" < "click button on Steam"
- MarioMan 1y ago
  Steam has famously gone on record that they will provide a DRM removal patch for everything they’re legally allowed to, if/when they go under. If they don’t do this and it’s all just lip service, then it makes a strong argument for ethical piracy at that time.
  - shoxidizer 1y ago
    This is a very persistent rumor. I forget the details but it comes from a customer support email, not some official statement or promise from Gabe, and even that was originally posted on a long gone forum which you can only find quotes of. Even if there was first hand proof of an official statement, I wouldn't expect it to be upheld. Minecraft's website used to have a line from Notch saying he would make it open-source in the future.
    - akimbostrawman 1y ago
      Steam DRM is and has been for decades famously easy to crack. Literally look up steam auto cracker and crack all your games in couple minutes. It is also optional by the way. I much rather have weak but popular steam DRM that makes it less likely devs use much stronger and expensive denuvo DRM.

by harvie 1y ago

There already was a time when Steam managed to free people from need to use funny pieces of plastic in their lifes... They've done that with CDs, they can do it again with Cards.

master-lincoln 1y ago

Yeah, that was when Steam freed the users from actually owning any game and instead gave the users limited licenses for using games. I am looking forward to the day when they shutdown and everybody realizes this.

dpoloncsak 1y ago
Can't I still just run the .exe of the game? Or DRM nightmares?
- hexmiles 1y ago
  All (most?) Steam games have a very simple DRM that is extremely easy to bypass, and you can find examples on github. However, a lot of games add their own DRM and/or protection scheme that complicates things. EDIT: technically there are two distinct component: the actual DRM, called steamstub, and the steamwork library, that does not work without steam but it is not considered drm. Both can be easily bypassed/emulated.
  - dpoloncsak 1y ago
    I see, but there is Steam DRM there. So, I guess as the other commenter was alluding to, if Steam goes belly up so does your collection, regardless of the dev studio's intention (Or atleast, locked behind a DRM bypass). I understood this in terms of Live Service games, but did not consider Steam's ability to shut down their own platform and kill my locally installed single player games with it (Again, I'm seeing its possible and seems easy to bypass usually, but the principle of the matter)
    - hexmiles 1y ago
      I tried to search if it's possible for a dev studio to release a game on Steam that works without it, by which I mean that if I uninstall Steam, the games keep working; I wasn't able to confirm, but it seems to be theoretically possible... None of the games I have in my library work like that, but online some people suggest that some games work even without Steam, once installed. Your point, however, still stands.
  - skeaker 1y ago
    Definitely not all games, and for games that do have it cracking it is in most cases as simple as swapping out a Steam .dll (so very easy). It's primarily there as appeasement for devs who would be reluctant to engage with a platform with no copy protection, or in otherwords is mostly theater.
    - hexmiles 1y ago
      Do you know of any games downloaded from Steam that work even once Steam is removed? I tried to search a bit, but I couldn't find any. I would like to test it for myself to confirm it.
      - skeaker 1y ago
        I haven't tried with too many games since the usecase only comes up rarely, but I know that Downwell and UFO 50 work this way off the top of my head. They come with a Steam dll that will try to launch Steam for the sake of getting achievements and such, but if you delete them or just don't have Steam they launch all the same. Google turns up this Steam curator that lists games that run without Steam and are DRM-free out of the box, though it seems far from comprehensive: https://store.steampowered.com/curator/38523697-DRM-FREE-GAMES/?appid=274190 https://store.steampowered.com/curator/38523697-DRM-FREE-GAM... The PC Gaming Wiki has a couple of better lists it looks like: https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/The_big_list_of_DRM-free_games_on_Steam https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/The_big_list_of_DRM-free_g... and https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/List_of_DRM-free_games_on_Steam https://www.pcgamingwiki.com/wiki/List_of_DRM-free_games_on_...
zamadatix 1y ago
The real loss was in the inability to sell the 90% of titles I no longer care about owning, but that's already true immediately after purchase. Steam shutting down and taking your library with it really doesn't change much except you lose that nice delivery platform with good integrations (achievements, workshop mods, multiplayer integration, automatic updates) for games you're active in. For the 90% you were never going to touch again it wouldn't be noticeable, outside the annoying reminder you were never able to resell them. The other 10% just reverts back to "pirate it" which is about here on my scale: "find that legal physical copy to play with" < "pirate it" < "click button on Steam"
MarioMan 1y ago
Steam has famously gone on record that they will provide a DRM removal patch for everything they’re legally allowed to, if/when they go under. If they don’t do this and it’s all just lip service, then it makes a strong argument for ethical piracy at that time.
- shoxidizer 1y ago
  This is a very persistent rumor. I forget the details but it comes from a customer support email, not some official statement or promise from Gabe, and even that was originally posted on a long gone forum which you can only find quotes of. Even if there was first hand proof of an official statement, I wouldn't expect it to be upheld. Minecraft's website used to have a line from Notch saying he would make it open-source in the future.
  - akimbostrawman 1y ago
    Steam DRM is and has been for decades famously easy to crack. Literally look up steam auto cracker and crack all your games in couple minutes. It is also optional by the way. I much rather have weak but popular steam DRM that makes it less likely devs use much stronger and expensive denuvo DRM.