4 ms·

For those who are reading the parent comment, no, that's not what equity means. Equity means just and fair allocation of resources and opportunities, not equal

For those who are reading the parent comment, no, that's not what equity means. Equity means just and fair allocation of resources and opportunities, not equality of outcomes.

anonymousiam 1y ago
[flagged]
- const_cast 1y ago
  Yes, let's all go back to MLK's times, surely things were more fair then! Who, me, racist? Nooooo... Every conservative has the same exact belief system: every conservative ideology before them was wrong, but this time, they're right. This time, for the first time in human history, conservatism is right, and we need to stop all progress immediately. We made it far enough. Any further and then it's bad! Of course, that's why conservatives before you said. And the ones before them. And the ones before them. And the ones before them. And the ones before them. Of course, we all know now they were wrong. Usually very wrong. But, surely, if we maintain the exact same ideology we will magically be right this time! Right guys? Right...?
  - deleted 1y ago
    [deleted]
  - mathiaspoint 1y ago
    [flagged]
    - tremon 1y ago
      look after our own and which "our own" might that be? Does that include Native Americans? People of Irish or Italian descent? Gays? Women? Pedophiles?
- exasperaited 1y ago
  > The problem with this is that children and relatives cannot be held legally responsible for crimes (or wrongs) committed by their parents/ancestors. (At least not in the USA.) But no reparations scheme attempts to find anyone legally responsible, surely? Most of them are simply aimed at pricking the consciences of organisations that benefited from (and sometimes exist only because of) slavery. If even transfers of money are concerned it's usually in the form of donations to foundations and state aid, at least that is how it is here in the UK.
- LexiMax 1y ago
  > I am looking forward to the return of merit-based systems, rather than racist policies and quotas. I'm dismayed that we've gone so far astray. Around what time period would you pin this to? When do you think hiring and career progression was at its most meritocratic and colorblind?
  - anonymousiam 1y ago
    Sometime around November 4th, 2008?
- mrala 1y ago
  You are objectively incorrect almost across the board but especially about what “MLK was looking for.” See: https://www.diverseeducation.com/opinion/article/15661878/how-the-work-of-dr-martin-luther-king-jr-was-about-diversity-equity-and-inclusion https://www.diverseeducation.com/opinion/article/15661878/ho... > I'm presently in the most oppressed group -- I'm a white heterosexual male. The group you are in is the perpetually seeking victimhood group. > All the DEI training materials claim that I'm "inherently racist", which is a ploy to punish me unjustly. Right, the problem is not the actual racism rather it’s pointing out things that could be racist and making racists feel bad about being racist.
  - Jensson 1y ago
    > Right, the problem is not the actual racism rather it’s pointing out things that could be racist and making racists feel bad about being racist. Is it racist to be a white male? If not he is not inherently racist. And if you do think white males are inherently racist then you are a racist.
- BallsInIt 1y ago
  You didn't include "gamer" in your group; you're hardly the most oppressed.
- UncleMeat 1y ago
  MLK expressly supported policies that provided specific material benefits to black people, not merely the end of ongoing discrimination. You can believe what you want, but don't invoke MLK here.
SilverElfin 1y ago
Isn’t that what equality already meant?
Dig1t 1y ago
Here’s Kamala Harris saying exactly OP’s definition. >we are talking more rightly about equity … it has to be about a goal of saying that everybody should end up in the same place https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LaAXixx7OLo https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LaAXixx7OLo It is literally all about equality of outcomes.
oarla 1y ago
I guess it's up to each individual or organization on how to interpret it. Some places may interpret it as the more controversial equality of outcome.
EnergyAmy 1y ago
I have personally gone through HR trainings that directly contradict what you're saying. "just and fair" allocation is also a vacuous qualifier. According to whom? If it's just and fair allocation according to someone that believes in equality of outcome, then you're not disagreeing with the comment you're responding to. I think in practice, equity does in fact mean equity of outcome. Pretending that that's not the case feels like gaslighting to people, and drives people away from DEI initiatives.
mvdtnz 1y ago
Then explain the one picture that every single DEI advocate shares at the start of their intro sessions. You know the exact one that I'm talking about. https://interactioninstitute.org/illustrating-equality-vs-equity/ https://interactioninstitute.org/illustrating-equality-vs-eq...
mathiaspoint 1y ago
I was lectured by Jewish (they made a big deal out of it, not me) consultants at my last job about how to implement DEI and they completely disagree with you.

For those who are reading the parent comment, no, that's not what equity means. Equity means just and fair allocation of resources and opportunities, not equality of outcomes.

anonymousiam 1y ago

[flagged]

const_cast 1y ago
Yes, let's all go back to MLK's times, surely things were more fair then! Who, me, racist? Nooooo... Every conservative has the same exact belief system: every conservative ideology before them was wrong, but this time, they're right. This time, for the first time in human history, conservatism is right, and we need to stop all progress immediately. We made it far enough. Any further and then it's bad! Of course, that's why conservatives before you said. And the ones before them. And the ones before them. And the ones before them. And the ones before them. Of course, we all know now they were wrong. Usually very wrong. But, surely, if we maintain the exact same ideology we will magically be right this time! Right guys? Right...?
- deleted 1y ago
  [deleted]
- mathiaspoint 1y ago
  [flagged]
  - tremon 1y ago
    look after our own and which "our own" might that be? Does that include Native Americans? People of Irish or Italian descent? Gays? Women? Pedophiles?
exasperaited 1y ago
> The problem with this is that children and relatives cannot be held legally responsible for crimes (or wrongs) committed by their parents/ancestors. (At least not in the USA.) But no reparations scheme attempts to find anyone legally responsible, surely? Most of them are simply aimed at pricking the consciences of organisations that benefited from (and sometimes exist only because of) slavery. If even transfers of money are concerned it's usually in the form of donations to foundations and state aid, at least that is how it is here in the UK.
LexiMax 1y ago
> I am looking forward to the return of merit-based systems, rather than racist policies and quotas. I'm dismayed that we've gone so far astray. Around what time period would you pin this to? When do you think hiring and career progression was at its most meritocratic and colorblind?
- anonymousiam 1y ago
  Sometime around November 4th, 2008?
mrala 1y ago
You are objectively incorrect almost across the board but especially about what “MLK was looking for.” See: https://www.diverseeducation.com/opinion/article/15661878/how-the-work-of-dr-martin-luther-king-jr-was-about-diversity-equity-and-inclusion https://www.diverseeducation.com/opinion/article/15661878/ho... > I'm presently in the most oppressed group -- I'm a white heterosexual male. The group you are in is the perpetually seeking victimhood group. > All the DEI training materials claim that I'm "inherently racist", which is a ploy to punish me unjustly. Right, the problem is not the actual racism rather it’s pointing out things that could be racist and making racists feel bad about being racist.
- Jensson 1y ago
  > Right, the problem is not the actual racism rather it’s pointing out things that could be racist and making racists feel bad about being racist. Is it racist to be a white male? If not he is not inherently racist. And if you do think white males are inherently racist then you are a racist.
BallsInIt 1y ago
You didn't include "gamer" in your group; you're hardly the most oppressed.
UncleMeat 1y ago
MLK expressly supported policies that provided specific material benefits to black people, not merely the end of ongoing discrimination. You can believe what you want, but don't invoke MLK here.

SilverElfin 1y ago

Isn’t that what equality already meant?

Dig1t 1y ago

Here’s Kamala Harris saying exactly OP’s definition. >we are talking more rightly about equity … it has to be about a goal of saying that everybody should end up in the same place https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LaAXixx7OLo https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=LaAXixx7OLo It is literally all about equality of outcomes.

oarla 1y ago

I guess it's up to each individual or organization on how to interpret it. Some places may interpret it as the more controversial equality of outcome.

EnergyAmy 1y ago

I have personally gone through HR trainings that directly contradict what you're saying. "just and fair" allocation is also a vacuous qualifier. According to whom? If it's just and fair allocation according to someone that believes in equality of outcome, then you're not disagreeing with the comment you're responding to. I think in practice, equity does in fact mean equity of outcome. Pretending that that's not the case feels like gaslighting to people, and drives people away from DEI initiatives.

mvdtnz 1y ago

Then explain the one picture that every single DEI advocate shares at the start of their intro sessions. You know the exact one that I'm talking about. https://interactioninstitute.org/illustrating-equality-vs-equity/ https://interactioninstitute.org/illustrating-equality-vs-eq...

mathiaspoint 1y ago

I was lectured by Jewish (they made a big deal out of it, not me) consultants at my last job about how to implement DEI and they completely disagree with you.