6 ms·

Google has dropped more than 50 DEI-related orgs from one of its funding lists

62 points by gslin 1y ago

myponybaloney 1y ago
[flagged]
michaelt 1y ago
I hope critics will be equally critical of the companies that weren't donating to any DEI-related orgs in the first place.
- djohnston 1y ago
  Most people aren’t critical of either and don’t care about DEI initiatives.
- trhway 1y ago
  The companies which followed their principles even when it was against the prevailing ideology du jour? (Being originally from USSR I hate ideologies and those 180 turns people do on a dime the moment the ideology changes)
- perching_aix 1y ago
  Why? Wouldn't it make more sense to blame these organizations "now-demonstrated to have been performative", as DEI's critics have been (performatively?) accusing them to be for so long? Or would that count as performative too? Getting lost in the narratives at this point.
  - dyauspitr 1y ago
    Disadvantaged folks getting jobs is not performative.
    - perching_aix 1y ago
      Well yeah. Sure didn't stop from people claiming otherwise though, or at least ignoring it / focusing on the performance and narrative aspect instead.
  - michaelt 1y ago
    IDK what 'performative' means. But according to my calculations, if I donated $50,000 to a charity last year and $0 this year, I've still donated $50,000 to the charity. Whereas someone who donated $0 last year and $0 this year has donated $0. It'd be pretty weird if the former got worse press than the latter.
    - perching_aix 1y ago
      I was being sarcastic. For a lot of people the narrative is more important; I'd even argue it's what people normally default to, including me. What I meant to convey then was that at this point I find all those narrative driven perspectives beyond tiresome, and yet I fully expect them to barrel on regardless, unlike what you're hoping for. Your napkin math is one demonstration why a focus on narrative can prove misguided. It can matter very little how genuine their intents were if in practice they materially helped a significant amount.
- weldboss 1y ago
  DEI policies are dumb as fuck. Get rid of that shit and let people figure things out for themselves.
cbeach 1y ago
[flagged]
- getlawgdon 1y ago
  [flagged]
  - cronelius 1y ago
    racism is bad business. the market deals with it in the following ways: - the competent people who are being discriminated against leave and go to places where they aren’t discriminated - people in protected classes sue for discrimination - companies that don’t discriminate get a reputation as such and attract the best - companies that keep discriminating keep losing talent and getting hit with lawsuits what else could you possibly need to show that racism is bad business? that racists get what’s coming to them in the long term?
    - nxrabl 1y ago
      As the saying goes, the market can stay irrational longer than you can stay solvent. There are any number of ways a firm can do things that, in isolation, are bad for business, and still do very well overall if they’re protected by other factors (such as, case in point, the money printing machine that is Google ads). I think what the GP is saying is that sitting back and leaving things to the market to work out is essentially resigning the issue not to be resolved in our lifetimes.
    - typewithrhythm 1y ago
      [flagged]
    - LexiMax 1y ago
      > racism is bad business The history of the US is littered with riots that not only targeted individuals and families, but businesses and other sources of minority wealth. Turns out that you don't need to be better at business if you can prescribe the competition with impunity.
    - 1y ago
neko_ranger 1y ago
The new South Park episode offers further insights into this very topic
SilverElfin 1y ago
[flagged]
- ryandrake 1y ago
  FTA> Google’s Chief People Officer Fiona Cicconi told employees that the company would end DEI-related hiring “aspirational goals” due to new federal requirements and Google’s categorization as a federal contractor. It doesn't appear to be voluntarily "changing politics" but instead a mandate from the feds to change ideology or not work with them.
- kevingadd 1y ago
  The fundamental question is whether you think the population distribution of a company with thousands (or tens of thousands) of employees should look similar to the population distribution of the countries it's based in. If the distribution doesn't look similar, why not? Is there a good excuse for being predominantly male, or predominantly white, or predominantly asian, or predominantly indian? What does that good excuse look like? I see people complain about these things all the time. There's an assumption here that discrimination in the workplace only exists because of DEI which is a weird leap to make IMO. You could argue that DEI made the situation worse and that gets us somewhere but it's not clear to me whether that's your position.
  - x3n0ph3n3 1y ago
    The discrimination is likely occurring much earlier in the employment pipeline (this was obvious in 2008). Why is it Google's job to solve that problem?
    - perching_aix 1y ago
      > Why is it Google's job to solve that problem? This gave me a funny thought, can you imagine the absolute shitstorm if the government mandated ethnic and gender quotas for every workplace? Now that'd have been some real popcorn time, if I get my eyes roll over from all the overreach and oppression talk here now, that'd be a thread I would not dare to open for sure.
csours 1y ago
Writing as a person who wants the future to be a better place, the number one pass time of progressives is complaining about other progressives. The number two pass time is complaining about conservatives. Anyway, my complaint is that a lot of DEI flavored stuff is very very lazy. A fundamental issue is that once a person has been raised, you don't get to raise them again. You can't parent a grown person - even if they need more parenting. Social punishment only works inside a socially cohesive group. The shame and anxiety you create with social punishment may be exploited by someone else. Anyway, I'm sure some DEI groups are coming to terms with why anti-woke trolling is so effective, and I hope they find a good way to tell that story.
- nerdsniper 1y ago
  *pastime

62 points by gslin 1y ago

[flagged]

I hope critics will be equally critical of the companies that weren't donating to any DEI-related orgs in the first place.

djohnston 1y ago
Most people aren’t critical of either and don’t care about DEI initiatives.
trhway 1y ago
The companies which followed their principles even when it was against the prevailing ideology du jour? (Being originally from USSR I hate ideologies and those 180 turns people do on a dime the moment the ideology changes)
perching_aix 1y ago
Why? Wouldn't it make more sense to blame these organizations "now-demonstrated to have been performative", as DEI's critics have been (performatively?) accusing them to be for so long? Or would that count as performative too? Getting lost in the narratives at this point.
- dyauspitr 1y ago
  Disadvantaged folks getting jobs is not performative.
  - perching_aix 1y ago
    Well yeah. Sure didn't stop from people claiming otherwise though, or at least ignoring it / focusing on the performance and narrative aspect instead.
- michaelt 1y ago
  IDK what 'performative' means. But according to my calculations, if I donated $50,000 to a charity last year and $0 this year, I've still donated $50,000 to the charity. Whereas someone who donated $0 last year and $0 this year has donated $0. It'd be pretty weird if the former got worse press than the latter.
  - perching_aix 1y ago
    I was being sarcastic. For a lot of people the narrative is more important; I'd even argue it's what people normally default to, including me. What I meant to convey then was that at this point I find all those narrative driven perspectives beyond tiresome, and yet I fully expect them to barrel on regardless, unlike what you're hoping for. Your napkin math is one demonstration why a focus on narrative can prove misguided. It can matter very little how genuine their intents were if in practice they materially helped a significant amount.
weldboss 1y ago
DEI policies are dumb as fuck. Get rid of that shit and let people figure things out for themselves.

cbeach 1y ago

[flagged]

getlawgdon 1y ago
[flagged]
- cronelius 1y ago
  racism is bad business. the market deals with it in the following ways: - the competent people who are being discriminated against leave and go to places where they aren’t discriminated - people in protected classes sue for discrimination - companies that don’t discriminate get a reputation as such and attract the best - companies that keep discriminating keep losing talent and getting hit with lawsuits what else could you possibly need to show that racism is bad business? that racists get what’s coming to them in the long term?
  - nxrabl 1y ago
    As the saying goes, the market can stay irrational longer than you can stay solvent. There are any number of ways a firm can do things that, in isolation, are bad for business, and still do very well overall if they’re protected by other factors (such as, case in point, the money printing machine that is Google ads). I think what the GP is saying is that sitting back and leaving things to the market to work out is essentially resigning the issue not to be resolved in our lifetimes.
  - typewithrhythm 1y ago
    [flagged]
  - LexiMax 1y ago
    > racism is bad business The history of the US is littered with riots that not only targeted individuals and families, but businesses and other sources of minority wealth. Turns out that you don't need to be better at business if you can prescribe the competition with impunity.
  - 1y ago

neko_ranger 1y ago

The new South Park episode offers further insights into this very topic

SilverElfin 1y ago

[flagged]

ryandrake 1y ago
FTA> Google’s Chief People Officer Fiona Cicconi told employees that the company would end DEI-related hiring “aspirational goals” due to new federal requirements and Google’s categorization as a federal contractor. It doesn't appear to be voluntarily "changing politics" but instead a mandate from the feds to change ideology or not work with them.
kevingadd 1y ago
The fundamental question is whether you think the population distribution of a company with thousands (or tens of thousands) of employees should look similar to the population distribution of the countries it's based in. If the distribution doesn't look similar, why not? Is there a good excuse for being predominantly male, or predominantly white, or predominantly asian, or predominantly indian? What does that good excuse look like? I see people complain about these things all the time. There's an assumption here that discrimination in the workplace only exists because of DEI which is a weird leap to make IMO. You could argue that DEI made the situation worse and that gets us somewhere but it's not clear to me whether that's your position.
- x3n0ph3n3 1y ago
  The discrimination is likely occurring much earlier in the employment pipeline (this was obvious in 2008). Why is it Google's job to solve that problem?
  - perching_aix 1y ago
    > Why is it Google's job to solve that problem? This gave me a funny thought, can you imagine the absolute shitstorm if the government mandated ethnic and gender quotas for every workplace? Now that'd have been some real popcorn time, if I get my eyes roll over from all the overreach and oppression talk here now, that'd be a thread I would not dare to open for sure.

csours 1y ago

Writing as a person who wants the future to be a better place, the number one pass time of progressives is complaining about other progressives. The number two pass time is complaining about conservatives. Anyway, my complaint is that a lot of DEI flavored stuff is very very lazy. A fundamental issue is that once a person has been raised, you don't get to raise them again. You can't parent a grown person - even if they need more parenting. Social punishment only works inside a socially cohesive group. The shame and anxiety you create with social punishment may be exploited by someone else. Anyway, I'm sure some DEI groups are coming to terms with why anti-woke trolling is so effective, and I hope they find a good way to tell that story.

nerdsniper 1y ago
*pastime